Page last modified: 09/03/08

Drivetrain

Note: Email addresses and links listed in this Q&A section may no longer be valid!

 

DATE: January 29, 2000
QUESTION: Clutch grabbing - 1982 GS450TX

I have an 82 GS450TX that I have owned for about 2yrs. If the bike is stationary I can't shift the gears. If I am moving it shifts just fine. I have had the bike worked on by a shop to adjust the clutch cable and have replaced the clutch cable. It still will not shift when stopped. Is this normal or is there a bigger problem?

RIDER: John Both

REPLY:  Chris Hunter
I had this problem when I first started riding. I always thought the it was too much effort to pull the clutch lever all the way in to the handlebar. So what I did was loosen the cable adjuster at the lever to give more slack to the cable. oI fixes it so only the last half of the lever travel required any real strength. The first half I was only taking up slack in the cable the second half was actually disengaging the clutch plates. In effect when I was stationary, I was not disengaging the clutch enough to change gears. This is not a problem when you are moving because the centrifugal force helps you disengage the clutch.

So adjust the cable at the lever so that the entire range of lever motion disengages the clutch. If this doesn't help, then your clutch plates are worn down and need to be replaced.


DATE: December 12, 1999
QUESTION: No power to front sprocket/rear wheel - 1985 GS 700 E

Somehow there has been a disconnect between the engine and tranny. It happened while tooling along the road no warning noises no bangs just no power to the rear. The engine starts and runs great and I can shift through all 5 gears but there she sit. I hope it's a simple fix but I'm ready for the hard stuff also. Pls advise, Aloha from Oahu, Hi

RIDER: Derrick Simmons

REPLY:  Sandra Whitney
It sounds to me like you either spun the countershaft sprocket (or nut) or the clutch backet. If the engine made no noise when this happened and it doesn't make any abnormal noise when shifting gears, then your transmission should be ok. Take the countershaft sprocket cover off first and check to see if the countershaft nut fell off. If it did and the sprocket's splines are not firmly on the countershaft, then you might be in luck. Check the countershaft and countershaft sprocket splines for damage.Also inspect the threads on the countershaft. If it is not the case, then you will need to take off the clutch cover. Inspect the clutch basket, nut and shaft splines for damage.

The only other thing it could be is the gear on your crankshaft that spins your clutch basket (but this is highly unlikely).


DATE: November 27, 1999
QUESTION: New Clutch still slips - 1983 GS750E

I replaced my clutch with new set of Barnett friction plates and new drive plates. I still get major slippage in all gears after 5000 rpm. If i goose the throttle real hard the motor will rev up to 10000 RPM's and then gradually go back. I do not know if it will catch on its own as I am afraid to let the motor drop back on its own. I always let off the gas and then get back on it with a lighter hand. I do not want to put anymore money into this bike. Does this sound familiar to anyone? Is there an easy fix? Or does this sound like the death toll for this bike? I am at the point where I will just get rid of it and get another. Help!!

RIDER: Scott R. Coy

REPLY: Robert Hyde
I emailed you a couple of weeks ago, I have a GS1150E that seemed to have the same problem as you. Well, after 4.5 months of trial and error and on my final attempt before I sold the bike, I took one last look at my bike and fixed the problem, after replacing everything (I thought) from Steel plates, Friction plates, Springs, cable to no avail

I noticed a groove at the bottom of the inner clutch basket. inquired at a few shops and finally found one that knew about this part called a RING WASHER STOPPER that holds the first steel plate tight against the basket. After installation of this part I noticed a HUGE improvement, however, it still acted up at higher Rpm's around 8,000. so I upped the springs to Cir Cycle high tension and now my bike is awesome. Shame about the snow up here, oh well I now know that next year will be fun.

I hope you this helps you solve your problem. I have never felt such a feeling of satisfaction as when the bike lifted while shifting into 3rd. I would be interested to know if this helped.
REPLY: Frank Perreault
Not to be cruel and heartless, but if you had been using a service manual you would have noticed that something belonged in that groove.  This is why we preach about getting a service manual.


DATE: November 7, 1999
QUESTION: Clutch problems after rebuild - 1981 GS1100E

The clutch on my bike started slipping, so I bought a new Barnett clutch to replace. Replaced the disks and springs with no problems, and inserted the extra disk and metal ring. I adjusted the clutch per my Haynes manual, but had to pull it in a lot more. When I finally got it adjusted right, and went to let the clutch out, there was a terrible shaking and a loud clattering noise. It worked fine and I drove it this way for a few days hoping that the plates just needed to get broken in. It didn't. I went to a friends house and we took it back out. The disks showed quit a bit of wear on one side, but nothing else wrong. Put the disks back in alternating the worn spots. Much better now, but when it is cold and you go to take off the first time, it is still shaking. This doesn't occur if you take of from over 3000 rpm, only if you take of slow. The clutch isn't slipping, just making a shuddering at low rpm take off. Any ideas? I filled it for the first time with genuine Suzuki 10W40 oil as well.

RIDER: Troy Sigwing

REPLY: Scott Horner
I have never had good luck with aftermarket clutches. We use stock steels and fibers in 300+HP motors with great results. The low rpm chatter is very common with aftermarket clutches, especially Barnett. There is one adjustment that may help you if you have not already done it. The steel plates are stamped, there will be a smooth edge and a sharp edge on the outside of the plate. It does not matter how you install them, as long as they are all facing the same way. I seem to find it easier to install the sharp edge in. I would also check the inner and outer hubs for grooves, or notching. The thinner plates eat away at the hubs and ruin them. Good Luck!


DATE: September 6, 1999
QUESTION: Final drive questions - 1982 GS1100G

With my GS1100G 1982 model, At approx 90,000 KM's the final drive splines on both the wheel and Final Drive had worn ( mainly the wheel) on a taper from approx 20% from the end of the spline to the inside. This wear was sufficient to make me replace them ( albeit with second hand but in good nick even with tapered wear. These only lasted 6000Kms with the wheel spline being ripped off totally from that 20% point inwards resulting in no drive of course. This has been noticed in almost all of the bikes that I have seen now from 650 to 1100 with some few exceptions. I believe this occurrence is because of the wheel locating too deeply inside the Final Drive Spline which is only spaced by the long spacer inside the drive housing thru which the axle shaft passes. 

Do you know of any other fix of this apart from trial & error with extra spacers and why this variation occurs in the first place. Great Site and well done to all. Regards Trevor Franklin.....

RIDER: Trevor Franklin

REPLY:  Malcolm Evans
Can't change around the gearing.  Try rubber mounting the handlebars with some foam grips.


DATE: September 6, 1999
QUESTION: Ring and pinion ratio - 1980 GS850G

I would like to lower the highway cruising RPM on my bike, a GS850G. In the past I owned a GS1000L, and this bike was geared taller and revved less. My question is, can I put a GS1000 differential in my GS850 and get taller gearing or is the difference in the engine as opposed to the final drive?? Thanks.

RIDER: Mark Oefinger

REPLY: Tom Glidewell, Jr.
I think the difference in gearing is in the transmission, not the differential ("final drive").

I have a 79 GS850GN complete with Suzuki shop manual and specs for every GS850 model made ('79-'83) including the L models and it is the source for much of the following:

Originally the 850 L models had the same size tires and wheels as the regular "G" models, but beginning with the GLX (1981, I think) they fitted a 16 inch rear wheel (instead if 17") and reduced the number of teeth on the 5th DRIVE gear by one tooth. The gear change raised the gear ratio from .961 to .923, in effect increasing the overdrive almost 4% (to counteract the effect of the smaller rear wheel, I'm sure). The fifth DRIVEN gear was left unchanged. So to recap, originally the drive gear had 25 teeth and the driven gear had 26, but this was changed to 24/26 with the 1981 GS850GLX model and all subsequent 850 L models.

Thus, if you made the gear change on your bike, keeping your present rear wheel size unchanged, you would have a 4% reduction in RPM at any speed in 5th gear.

However, if you change the the 5th DRIVE gear, you should also change the DRIVEN gear as well, and including Labor charges this is going to get expensive. In addition with only a 4% reduction in RPM, you should question whether you want to split the cases to fix something that isn't really broke! Why not wait till you have to go into the transmission for some other reason?

Regarding Final Drives, I can also vouch with reasonable confidence the following information: The Ring and Pinion Gears for the 1980 GS850GT (NOT an "L" model) and the 1980 GS1000GLT (an "L" model) are exactly the same. They have the same part number, so nothing is to be gained by changing final drive gearsets. The '80 model year is the only year I've checked like this but I suspect that all other years for these 2 models would be the same. I do know for sure that the specs for the final drive gears for ALL the 850 models (both Regular and "L" models) are exactly the same. My guess is that all the GS1000Gs and the GS1100Gs all use the same rear end as the 850 but I don't know that for sure. I only know it for the 1980 model year. A dealer can tell you by comparing part numbers on his microfiche/computer.

I hope all this helps you in some way. Let me know if I can be of any further help. If you decide to make this gear change, do check everything out with a dealer.

By the way, I have gotten really good prices on Suzuki Genuine Parts from Freedom Cycles in Grandview, Mo. 1-800-438-0316.


DATE: August 8, 1999
QUESTION: Replace clutch basket? -1985 GS1150E

I have scanned and printed the references to clutches and still feel like I need a more specific answer so here goes...

I have been told that its would be a good idea to have the clutch basket replaced with a Falicon or similar rebuilt and reinforced unit to avoid a failure. And that if it does fail it may take out the rest of the engine. The bike had been owned by two of the mildest riders in the world, had 16,000 miles on it when I bought a few months ago, and has nearly 20,000 on it now. I don't plan to race it but it will occasionally get wrung out, and it'll spend a bunch of time on long road trips. Also, it is presently an immaculate, original, show room condition bike which I plan to keep in my family forever.

Should I replace the clutch basket as a precaution? Any other concerns I should look out for? I should mention, the stator has just failed, during a 24 hour/100o mile rally I was riding in. So the stator and Reg/Rectifier are soon to be replaced with the Electrex USA units.

RIDER:  Kevin Wynn

REPLY: Chris Skanderup
You can usually tell on an 1150 if the clutch basket is going bad by a slight knock at idle. It will sound like it is coming right from the bottom end of the motor, but will be hard to locate exactly. Most of the guys I know with 1150's all have that little knock and have never had a problem, but if yours knocks and you are worried about it, by all means, replace it!
REPLY: Scott Horner
I have seen several GS 1100/1150 hubs come apart. They usually take out #4 piston and cylinder sleeve as a minimum. I would install a APE or Falicon type HD backing plate w/ HD springs. It will run just under $200 with you supplying the hub. While it is apart, inspect the inner hub on the backside where the input shaft slides through. Starting with the 1150, Suzuki installed a steel insert to ride on the shaft, over time, the insert will loosen in the hub. This I have seen in 70%-80% of the 1150's I deal with.


DATE: July 31, 1999
QUESTION: Hypoid Gear Oil - 1982 GS850L

I have not had the bike long and just checked the oil in the gear case. I thought there'd be a dipstick, but there's none. How do I know how much gear oil is supposed to be in there?? Thanks

RIDER: Donald Gagnon

REPLY:  Malcolm Evans
The rear case has enough in it when it is level with the fill hole or just running out: The front one has a 10mm headed bolt with a crosshead screw as well set in, on the side of the case: undo this, and when oil comes out of this the front case is up to the mark.


DATE: April 23, 1999
QUESTION: Drivetrain oil - 1982 GS1100GL

My Clymer manual says to use Hypoid gear oil in the primary and final drive gears. What is a hypoid gear? Or does it refer to the oil? I found some Castrol Hypoy C SAE 80W-90.   Is it the same? Can you advise me please?

RIDER: Kenton Brunner

REPLY: Ed Parsons
You found the right lubricant, Castrol Hypoy 80-90 or 90 weight gear oil. Roughly, a hypoid gear in your motorcycle is a beveled gear capable of transmitting power in a 90 degree angle. Be sure to read your manual on how to avoid overfilling the secondary and final gear cases.


DATE: March 28, 1999
QUESTION: Clutch and Starter - 1979 GS850GN

My clutch slips in all gears. Is a clutch replacement a job for a do-it-yourselfer? Also, when the bike is cold, the clutch drags, usually killing the bike the first couple of tries into first gear from neutral. I have heard of a kit to remedy this problem. More info please? Second, it seems like either my starter or the solenoid has gone out. How do I tell which and again, is the replacement a job for a do-it-yourselfer. Thank you, Chad.

RIDER: Chad Johnson

REPLY: Frank Perreault
See the article below.  Yes, you can do it yourself but you'll need a service manual and the tools to do it.

As for the starter, if you hear it click when you hit the switch the solenoid is fine.  If it doesn't click or the starter doesn't turn over have the battery load tested.
REPLY:
Joe Brennan
I changed my clutch in less than two hours-all you need is a manual and for special tools = an impact driver. If I can do it, anybody.... Also, when the bike is cold, the clutch drags----yes it does. In the Clymer manual they talk about this hard shifting/clutch dragging, and recommend installation of the improved clutch release rack, part number 23165-45101. I bought one, but I can't get it in the bike. I wrote to Frank Perreault asking why, but heard no replies. When I put it in, I can't move the clutch lever-it allows no play or movement or whatever-I can't make it work. Now this is a pretty simple mechanism, and if you look at it for a while you understand how it works-the whole clutch etc. But....


DATE: April 23, 1999
QUESTION: Transmission broke - 1983 GS550 Katana

Hi there! I'm driving my motorcycle with a lot of fun, but last week my transmission broke down. I can still drive in first, but i can't shift my transmission. Now i have 2 questions: 1) I don't have a manual so is it possible to open my transmission, or will it fall apart completely. 2) What do you think (as the experts) the problem is. I would be most grateful if you could give me some information. Thanks a lot. 

RIDER: Remco van Zijl

REPLY: Zack Schultz
My guess is a broken (or jammed) shift drum is the problem. Yes, you can open the tranny, but without a manual to see what it's supposed to look like, as well as torque settings etc. I wouldn't try. Get a manual first.


DATE: March 26, 1999
QUESTION: Clutch replacement - OEM or aftermarket? - 1983 GS750ED

I have the option of replacing my clutch plates with OEM plates for approx. $200 (Cdn), or a combo of Barnett steel plates and CK friction plates for $160, or Barnett and KG friction for approx. $185. Some have said that OEM clutches are better. I have particularly heard this with respect to some Yamahas. Any experience/comments/recommendations are appreciated.

RIDER: Matthew T. McGarvey

REPLY: Frank Perreault
Just based on the technology advances made in clutches in the last 17 years I would say that the aftermarket clutches would be a lot better than stock.  I've installed Barnett clutches and they work like a charm.


DATE: March 26, 1999
QUESTION: Transmission or clutch - 1982 GS1100GL

I recently purchased a GS1100 for 150 dollars, a the fine price for a decent Suzuki. After winding out first second and third gears clicking into fourth the gear just spins. Riding through town moderately there is no problem with the shifting of the tranny in fourth. Could this possibly be a clutch problem or are the dogs shot on fourth gear as I suspect. Thank you very much and I would appreciate any responses that would be helpful.

RIDER: Grant Raymond Allen

REPLY: Frank Perreault
Dogs.


DATE: February 9, 1999
QUESTION: Bent gearshift fork shaft - 1980 GS550E

I have a 1980 GS 550E that had its (I think) gearshifting fork shaft bent. It also bent the flush-mounted bearing/gasket that allows the shaft to exit the engine case. If anyone has the Clymer manual (M373) for the 550s, its the rod that is just to the lower right of the icon representing the {50} of figure 50 on page 162, anterior to the drive shaft. What I think had happened was: due to a semi-loose and hence wobbly drive sprocket, the chain was stretched abnormally fast, and when it was that loose, whipped around off the sprocket and bent the rod. If that's the case, then I feel like I've done a bit of good sleuthing. Please refute this if I have just created an impossible or unlikely scenario. Back to the point: it needs replacing. Do I need to look out for any other damage to the internals of the clutch and transmission? I've removed the engine and had a look inside and everything appears to be OK. All of the gears engage while I shift and have a friend turn the driveshaft. Also, the shaft slides nearly completely out of the left side when I give it a pull. Is this normal? On a similar tangent, the bike has always had a little trouble getting into neutral from either first or second. I had read an answer to a similar question in the Q&A section of this invaluable site, but the answer seemed a little hollow with respect to my bike. Upon cracking the sprocket cover, I inspected the clutch cable return spring, and it didn't seem to have all the 'pull' needed to get back to its tight position; i.e.- the spring never fully returned to its potentially fully closed position. This might explain things, if the clutch never fully engaged from within the engine (I couldn't adjust it from the hand lever or by the cable screw atop the sprocket case).

Last question: I know that the GS 550 series stopped having a kickstarter as of 1980, but I noticed that the internal case still has a slot for one. I'd have to locate a right-side clutch plate with a hole for the lever, but is there a kit to install, cannibalize one from a 1979, or am I just pipe-dreaming?

Thanks again for the this truly amazing resource page. If I'm ever in florida...

RIDER: Thomas Dalton

REPLY: Thomas Dalton
After talking with a local Suzuki shop, I've found out that the shaft's true name is the clutch push rod. That's the damaged part. I've also discovered that the part is discontinued from the suzuki parts list. The bearing/gasket I was referring to is named an 'oil sealer', but fortunately that one is orderable. Looks like I'll spend some time with an impact wrench at a junkyard!
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
I can't answer all your questions, but have some advice. Since you obviously have the cases split, inspect the engagement dogs on the gears - especially 1st & 2nd. They are the little 'teeth' on the sides of the gears. Also inspect the matching slots. Any broken or missing dogs or damaged slots need to have those gears changed.
REPLY:
Henry Dedrick
Thomas, I'm somewhat inexperienced (fortunately!) in this particular area, but I have the same bike, and I have the Clymer and Suzuki manuals, so here's my opinion...

My Clymer M373 is for '77 to '80, and your page refs don't jive, but I think the shaft, to which you refer to as being bent, is actually the clutch pushrod.

The shift fork shaft only exits the engine during destruction!

The pushrod mates on the left end with the plastic screw actuator that sits in the sprocket cover, and the other end of the shaft rides on (via a flat roller- bearing) the clutch pressure plate on the other side of the transmission. This shaft should be straight but the book indicates replacing it is just a matter of pulling it completely out (after removing the clutch pressure plate from the other side) and sliding in another one. I hope you didn't pull the engine and split the cases just to deal with this...I'm worried that you might be able to remove this pushrod from the sprocket side, I've never had to deal with this, so either it's broken in two, or the book is incomplete, or we're not talking about the same part. You shouldn't be able to remove it from the sprocket side.

If the shaft is bent, that would account for less than full disengagement of the clutch because it would bind in the bore drilled down the center of the countershaft. But let's think positive... the plastic screw actuator might also be worn from overuse without lube (there is a grease fitting inside the cover) or the actuator itself may be misadjusted (also under the cover...it's just above the shift lever, this is seperate from the cable adj.). Also, check the cable itself for free and unbinding travel, that needs lube sometimes too. I think the spring to which you refer, is only to take the slack out of the actuator. Most of the clutch resistance and return action is from the springs in the clutch itself.

I like my '550, but the tranny isn't one of it's finest points. Even with proper clutch adjustment, it clunks N to 1st, crashes 1st to 2nd, and is a pain getting from 1st to N when it's cold. but it's better after warmup, because then the clutch more fully disengages. I actually pull in the clutch and start mine in 1st, and slip the clutch a little before that first 1-2 shift of the day, it seems to reduce the violence a bit. This is the Suzuki clutch...I tried one from Barnett, and it aggrivated the above symptoms by a factor of four! After running it for a month, I switched back to the original, and stuffed the Barnett plates in a box. If you're having shifting problems, possibly the clutch is dragging...i.e. not fully disengaging, as opposed to a slipping (not fully engaging) clutch. You may have no tranny problems at all, just a clutch prob.

RE: kickstarter retrofit...I too, have lusted after one. (yeah, go ahead and giggle...but it's less dangerous than Internlust)

I think it's possible because the hole is still there, but you'd need the earlier side cover and internal parts, and I suspect Suzuki didn't tap the bolt holes in our model. And installation means splitting the cases (which I hope you haven't done yet). You might consider looking for a 1977 model engine, so you get the kick, and better carbs, and I suspect, better performance, because motorcycle emission controls took effect 1/1/78. Though a '78 or '79 mill would get you a kick also.

Also, I thank you for my new command of "anterior", which complements my familiarity of posterior, interior, and exterior, as well as "ant cow".
REPLY:
Thomas Dalton
Thanks for all the tips! You're right: it is the clutch pushrod. I've managed to find a guy who's willing to part with a '78 GS550E for a great price. I can cannibalize both the pushrod as well as the kickstart mechanism. I may opt for a complete swap of the engine since mine is already removed...We'll see.

The clutch push rod, I've found out, is no longer an orderable part from Suzuki. The old part number was 23100-44100, but it was changed to a new part number, 23100-44101. Regardless, the only way to get another pushrod is from a junkyard.

The clutch actuator on the left side still has nice action, so I don't think that's the prob with the 1 and 2 gears getting into N. The pushrod was bent before (I didn't think or know to look for it), and I'm inspecting the clutch all the way, so I could be in luck. I'll post any findings on the site.

Too late about the engine removal: I've already cracked the case wide open. I think I may have found a silver lining after all. First, it's a good learning experience; second, the kick starter I've found can be installed (hopefully, those drill holes may present a problem); and third, I need to replace the inner oil seal for that pushrod. It apparently has an inner and outer oil seal, and both are warped. When my problems first began, the push rod banana'ed so much that it ovaled the oil seal(s) and it leaked all over the road. Fortunately, I was at home, going reeeaaallly slow after replacing the chain. It was disheartening: the puddle of oil was like the lifeblood forming around a fallen hero... Time for a resurrection!

Thanks again for all the help.


DATE: February 9, 1999
QUESTION: Info needed on shaft to chain conversion - 1980 GS850G

I have a 1980 GS850G shaft drive that I have converted to cafe style [ lower bars,4 into 1, K & N filters, GSXR carbs, Metzlers etc] very pleased with results. Have pondered possibility of swapping early 80's GS650G final drive to my bike. Looking for lighter weight mainly, but higher top speed would also be nice. Any help out there?

RIDER: David Lauderdale

REPLY:  Malcolm Evans
GS 650 shafts and GS 850 shafts are not interchangeable, what you need to do is junk the shaft altogether and find a GS 750 (8v, not GSX 16v) bottom end plus the swingarm and back wheel.

The 850 top end bolts straight on, you get improved weight and handling, and then of course you can get into a set of GSXR wheels and a Metmachex swingarm.........course you have then got to keep it in chains.


DATE: December 5, 1998
PROBLEM: Shifting problems -1977-82 GS550

RIDER: Henry Dedrick
I've run into a strange shift linkage problem on both of my 1980 GS550E's. It's probably rare, but this could save someone from an unnecessary teardown.

The failure occurred on a very beaten 550 at 31,000 miles...It's been a while, but as I remember it, the bike would downshift N to first, but upshifting usually wouldn't happen, except after many attempts. This is why I got it so cheap...

When I pulled the clutch cover and the clutch, I discovered that the "gearshifting fork shaft" (Suzuki nomenclature) had walked out of place and had jammed the shift linkage. It had moved to the right and was limiting the shifter travel in the upshift mode.

This shaft is what the shifting forks pivot and ride back and forth on as you shift . One hard downshift on this bike would kick the forks to the left, and (sometimes) move the shaft back to proper position...temporarily.

This shaft gets slid in from right to left during transmission assembly, and then they run a panhead screw into the case adjacent to the shaft to retain it. From what I can see in the book, the shift forks slide back-and-forth on the shaft, but there is apparently some side loading and after 200,000 or so shifts, the shaft-end has punched its way through the edge of the screw head.

This is like digging through Alcatraz with a teaspoon...it takes so long, it's highly unlikely...but possible.

I kept the screw, and it looks like someone laser-cut a little half-moon from the edge of the head.

There was no consequential damage (pretty tough shift linkage!). Other parts of the linkage itself prevent the shaft from colliding w/the back of the clutch, it can only travel about an inch, so it doesn't go far enough to liberate the shifter forks. (that would be eventful!)

After that, I checked my other 550, which had about 45,000 on it, but certainly far fewer shifts. That screw showed some of the same damage but probably would have lasted years longer. This is a longshot, but worth checking before splitting the cases to cure a trans problem...I don't think the early 550's and 750's share shift linkage, but I suspect this may apply to others in the GS family. Cheers!


DATE: November 1, 1998
QUESTION: Gear slippage -1984 GS750E

When I aggressively accelerate in 2nd gear slippage occurs from 3000 to 3500 RPM's and again at 4500 to 5000 RPM's. No matter how aggressive you accelerate in 1st, 3rd, 4th, and 5th, no slippage occurs. Removal of engine base shows no signs of metal shavings from gear damage. Also if you slowly accelerate through 2nd this slippage does not occur. Any suggestions on this problem would be greatly appreciated.

RIDER: Richard Sceviour

REPLY: Frank Perreault
Sure sounds like a worn engagement dog to me, regardless of whether you see shavings or not.  They may have all got trapped in the oil filter at some point.   So examine the dogs closely to make sure the 2nd gear dog isn't worn.  You may need a shop manual for the proper procedure for doing this.
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
I agree with Frank on this. 2nd gears engagement dogs are worn. You'll need to replace the 2 mating gears and possible the shift fork. Since they will stay together when not hard on it, you most likely have a rounded set vs. a broken one. If you pull the pan with the engine in the frame, you may be able to do an inspection, but it won't be easy. Figure on a teardown this winter, and write if you have questions.
REPLY:
Scott Horner
I agree with Frank and Zack. When you find the rounded dogs I recommend Mark at R&D Motorsports in Clearwater Fl (813 447-4552) to take care of the tranny for you. If the dogs are not too worn he will weld them and re- hardface them for $12 a dog. I have had this done in 200+ horsepower Suzuki's with no problems.


DATE: November 1, 1998
QUESTION: Shafty oil leak - 1981 GS650G

My bike is an '81 GS650G Shaft Drive (45,000 km), which I bought in June.

On getting a friend to check it over he spotted there was no oil in the shaft drive at the wheel end. After filling it with the correct oil all was well - until I went on a long ride, when most of the oil leaked out on my back tire.

My friend replaced the seal with a new one. Again all was well until a longish ride when the same thing happened! My friend dis-assembled the rear of the bike and showed it to the local Suzuki dealership, who agreed that the work my friend had done seemed to be done correctly. The bike was once again re-assembled and again seemed fine until a long run when the same problem happened again.

Why would a seal give intermittently? Could it be heat/oil viscosity finding a flaw in the seal? Any other ideas? I am taking the bike into the local Suzuki dealership next week for them to take a closer look, but they seem pretty vague as to what is going on in there. Can anyone please help?

Wish I could get this sorted - the bike is great otherwise!

Very nice web site - congratulations!

RIDER: Steve Molinari

REPLY: Steve Molinari
Strange as it may seem (or maybe not), I am answering my own question.

The problem has been resolved (I believe). As the dealer explained it, the problem seems to have been that at some time in the past a bearing had perhaps been replaced. The plate (which is machined) had not been "sealed" with 3M on re-assembly and the oil was working it's way through when the bike was hot and being worked hard.

In any case all now seems well. I guess the moral here is that when anyone tells you that something is "bullet-proof and doesn't need to be checked" - CHECK IT! An early death or serious injury is probably a little too high of a price to pay for some-one else's self-assurance!


DATE: September 26, 1998
QUESTION: Tranny rebuild - GS550L

I'm about to get into the lower end of my engine to replace a worn engagement dog (2nd gear). Are there any other parts which are prone to failure, and should be replaced while I'm in there? I'd like to get maximum reliability for my efforts, and I don't mind spending the extra $$.

RIDER: Chris Arocha

REPLY: Frank Perreault
See the article "3rd gear lost - 1983 GS550E" below.


DATE: September 26, 1998
QUESTION: Looking for sprocket info - GSX750 hybrid

I just bought an GSX 750 with an GSX 1100 engine both from '81. I know this is at first sight not the most save combination but that is something to find out (carefully). But that is not the question. This is: It needs new sprockets and chain but it has some strange size like a 630 type chain. The chain has the same width as a 530 but a longer pitch. Are there other Suzuki sprockets which will fit on a GSX 750 rear and GSX 1100 front but can use a normal 530 chain? The strength should be sufficient because the are also used on modern 1100 CC motorcycles but they tend to be also a lot cheaper.

RIDER: Arthur Aalsma

REPLY: Scott Horner
Any sprocket from a GSX-R 750 or 1100 will work. The counter shaft sprocket needs to be shimmed out 6mm to align with the rear sprocket properly. Best of luck!
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
Change both sprockets and the chain at the same time. The only things you're going to have to watch is the spine pitch on the countershaft sprocket, and the bolt hole spacing on the rear. I'd suggest taking the old ones in to the shop for comparison.


DATE: August 24, 1998
QUESTION: Scrogged shaft gear and other mayhem - 1982 GS1100L

I've spoken to a veteran Suzuki dealer (30 years in the business) and the chief instructor for the motorcycle mechanic program at British Columbia Institute of Technology and both of them say they've never heard of this happening...

I was touring from Vancouver, BC to the Yukon and was on my way back when I started hearing strange noises from where the shaft connects to the engine. All this just out side of Dease Lake, BC (pop 700), 14 hours from the nearest Suzuki shop.

After getting it home I opened up the front gear oil reservoir and picked out chunks (not little bits, chunks) of gear with a magnet. Not a good sign. I checked the compression too and the readings were not great. Only 45000 km's on it too =(

So, if I can find the parts to replace the broken shaft I'll unbolt everything and do a complete restoration of the bike over the winter (waah! summer's only half over and I have no bike =( ) I'm wondering if anyone out there has any ring job, replacing a fubared shaft or frame up resto tips.

PS. If you ever have the opportunity to ride to the Yukon through BC, do it, and make sure you stop in at Liard Hot Springs...they're still natural and big enough to swim in!

RIDER: Erik Stenerud

REPLY: Frank Perreault
You'll need to get yourself a service manual and/or a Clymer manual.   Don't even try anything without it.  Any info you need will be in there.


DATE: August 24, 1998
QUESTION: 3rd gear lost - 1983 GS550E

My 1983 GS550E lost 3rd gear recently. It seemed to slip out of 3rd and into neutral and then 3rd was gone. There was no clunking noise and no unusual noise now. All the other gears work fine.

Will I have to rip this apart to fix it? or is it a minor adjustment (ha ha).   Also, is this a common problem? I think this is an awesome bike and will probably spend the money to repair it if possible.

RIDER: Gary J. Ward

REPLY: Frank Perreault
I would say that if the 550 is similiar to a 1100 in design that you will have to totally dismantle the engine to fix the transmission. And yes, that is expensive to do. I couldn't give you a price though.  See the note below.
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
I own an 84 ES. Know of a couple of other 550's in this area. Almost all that I've seen and talked to have had to replace 2nd and 3rd gears due to having the engagement dogs damaged. They range from rounding them off (mine) to shearing all 4 dogs and bending the shift forks. Yes, it is expensive to have done. You're talking quite a bit of shop time to pull the engine, split the cases, replace parts, reassemble and reinstall. The good news is that it isn't too hard to do if you're mechanically inclined. It sounds as if you've sheared the engagement dogs off. The bad news is that you have no 3rd gear. The really bad news is there are a couple of pieces of tranny parts floating around in the engine/transmission. The good news is that if they have made it out of the gear cluster, they're probably laying in the bottom of the pan and most likely won't cause any more damage - but I wouldn't bet my right arm on it. Mail me off the list if you need advice to replace the parts yourself.


DATE: August 24, 1998
QUESTION: Clicking noise from chain - 1980 GS550

I bought a 1980 GS550, my mechanic said the bike is in good shape but that the front sprocket might have a bad spot on it, or the chain could have a link that is bound up, when I ride I get a clicking noise from the chain, and when the bike is off and up on its stand the tire will not spin freely, it has a spot that tightens up when I spin the tire. Let me know what you think, and are these jobs fairly easy do. Thank you.

RIDER: Randy Giacometti

REPLY: Frank Perreault
Take off the left side engine cover that covers the front sprocket.  Make sure the you write down what screws go where since they all tend to be different lengths.   Put a mark with chalk in both the front and rear sprockets and the chain and then rotate the rear tire.  If you hear the click or get a tightness whenever a certain section of the chain hits a sprocket - it's the chain, if you hear it all the time - it's worn chain and sprockets.

In any case, if it's a problem with a sprocket or the chain, they all need to be replaced at once.  It isn't cheap, but if you only do one or the other, you'll only damage the new part you are replacing.
REPLY:
Randy Giacometti
Thanks for the advice Frank, I am going to let the dealership take care of repairs, its about 300.00 for new sprockets and chain for my 550, Thanks for the help.


DATE: July 20, 1998
QUESTION: Tranny noise - 1981 GS550

I have an '81 GS550 T with a little over 9k miles on it. Recently, I've been noticing a "gravely" sound coming from the transmission in 1st, 2nd, some in 3rd, and very little in 4th on up (of course with wind noise and engine noise, how can one be shure). I've been told that there was some problems with these transmissions, and there are some gears inside that need to be replaced, requireing the motor to be pulled off the bike and split.

If there is any truth to this I would greatly appreciate any tips and suggestions.

RIDER: Kevin S. Weaver

REPLY: Frank Perreault
It sounds like you have a bad bearing in the transmission.  The typical cause of this is tightening the drive chain too tight.  I've never heard anything about the 550's having tranny problems.
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
Frank is probably right about the tranny bearing causing the noise. Just wanted to correct the other statement. I own an 84. Know of a couple of others in this area. Almost all that I've seen and talked to have had to replace 2nd and 3rd gears due to having the engagement dogs damaged. They range from rounding them off (mine) to shearing all 4 dogs and bending the shift forks.
REPLY:
Henry Dedrick
I have that same noise, seems constant despite gear changes, just changes pitch w/road speed. Pull in the clutch at 65MPH and let the engine drop to idle and you'll hear it on the freeway, too. I even get it pushing the thing out of the garage! Very annoying. Chain lube doesn't help much

Mine seems to go away if I run the drive chain a bit looser than recommended (around 1.5 inches total up-down slack in mid-lower-run) but it comes back when I adjust it by the book(1 inch),  which I have an annoying habit of doing. I think this is the ticket, but I just don't like the thought of my chain whipping like crazy at 75MPH from excessive slack. I've learned to live w/it, now up to     60K, so I wouldn't worry at 9Kmiles. Just don't overdo this advice... check the top side of the left swingarm bearing for evidence of gouging, that's a sign that the chain has been too slack.


DATE: June 11, 1998
QUESTION: Clutch problems - 1984 Suzuki GS750EF

I have a general question about replacing my clutch. I am a first time bike owner and have been thoroughly enjoying my GS ever since I picked it up last year. It seems as if it wants a new clutch these days. I have tightened the clutch line as far as possible and I am beginning to really force the gears. This is making my ride a little rough at times and I think it is beginning to be a bit rough on the engine block as I force my shifting. Do I only need to change my clutch wire or may this require a new clutch altogether? I am suffering from some mechanical ignorance and I get mostly confused as I stare at the schematics in my manual. I have a printout of your instructions to Michael Keslar on replacing a clutch cable - should I follow the instructions?

RIDER: Richard Kouwenhoven

REPLY: Frank Perreault
I would say the the more common problem is that the clutch is worn, especially if you're finding you have the clutch cable adjusters at the limits.  If  you are not mechanically inclined I would drag the bike into the dealer and have them check it out and let them tell you.  You don't want to go ignoring the problem and end up trashing your transmission or you'll really have problems.


DATE: May 25, 1998
QUESTION: Tranny teardown - 1978 GS1000

I am going to replace the transmission, my old one has a chipped tooth on the third gear. Do you know if I can just take the bottom half of the casing off and replace the tranny while the motor is upside down or do I have to tear it down completely from the top?

RIDER: Mike Thompson

REPLY: Zack Schultz
That's exactly right. Put the whole transmission gear package together in the upper half (the motor should be upside down) and then put the lower half on. Reassemble in the reverse manner. Do watch for those dowel pins otherwise they will wreck your day. Here's another something that our mechanics used to do that works. Get some black hi-temp RTV. Put a reaaaal thin coat on the upper case half. You should be able to see silver through it - that thin. The idea is to fill in any small pits in the casting as it goes back together. It's not a glue and it's not a fixall for nurfing the cases with a pry bar. Too much is bad because the little crumbs that squeeze out will break off and get in the oiling system clogging the sump pickup or an oil passage. Again, thin is the way to go. Wipe off any excess with your finger to get it thin enough. Be careful, the edges of the cases are sharp.

You know, while you have the tranny out, take a look at all the engagement dogs and general conditions of all the gears. Also check the shift forks to see if they're straight. As long as it's apart already, might as well be 100% sure when it goes back in that everything is perfect.
REPLY:
Scott Horner
Just in case nobody has responded, yes, you can pull only the bottom case to get to the tranny once the motor has been removed from the chassis.  Be sure to drain the oil well prior to flipping the motor on it's lid.  Oil has been known to slip by the rings and pool in the combustion area and causing havoc later.  I have plenty of motor parts for that bad boy if you ever need any. Thanks!
REPLY:
Rob Eberle
All you need to do is take out all the top case bolts on the REAR part of the motor. Then turn the motor over and remove all the lower bolts (keeping track of placement). Take out the larger crank bolts last. Now this is assuming you know to take all of the case covers off the sides of the motor and the oil pan and oil filter housing. DO NOT PRY CASES APART. A few taps with a rubber mallet should do it. IF NOT you missed a bolt somewhere. When you split the cases the tranny will be exposed and you will see what to do. Hope this helps. Thank you for your e-mail.
REPLY:
Mike Thompson
Just a note to thank you for your advice on installing the new transmission in my 1978 GS1000. It works great and I am having a blast riding it. Thanks again.


DATE: May 17, 1998
QUESTION: Sprocket swap - 1981 GS1100E

First of all, thank you for this terrific site!

I've got an `81 GS1100E with a host of mods, and many more on the way.  It is currently in a local shop having mounts put in for the `91 GSXR750 swingarm.  I'm also installing a `91 GSXR1100 front end with YZF1000 calipers up front.  My question is; has anyone found a front 530 sprocket from another model that fits the GS11?    I can modify the offset myself, but I have to have a sprocket  to start with!

Thanks for your help.

RIDER: Gord Mounce

REPLY: Scott
A 530 sprocket off any of the GSXR's will mount right up.  If you order from someone with access to Parts Unlimited, they have a listing for a 630 to 530 conversion.   Good Luck!


DATE: April 10, 1998
QUESTION: Gearing change - 1982 GS1000EX

Want to raise the gearing to get me out of the "buzz" rpm at cruise, will a 16t (stock is 15) primary sprocket fit without running risky chain/case clearance? Will I have to add links to my stock 96 link chain? Any suggestions?

RIDER: Bill Abbott

REPLY: Zack Schultz
Most gearing changes are done to the rear sprocket since changing the front has a much more dramatic effect on RPM, power delivery etc. If you still want to change the front, take off the cover and measure the amount of room inside the cover. Measure the diameter of the chain as it passes around the sprocket. Divide that by 15, multiply the resulting number by 16 and that should give you the diameter of the chain as it passes over the bigger sprocket. If that will fit inside of the cover with clearance, go for it.

As far as adding links, if the rear axle is in the middle of it's adjustment, probably not. If it's more toward the front, probably yes. Keep in mind that by moving the axle forward, you're shortening the wheelbase a little. Not much, but consider that Honda added a 1/2 degree more rake to the CBR900 this year and everyone says it's a huge improvement.
REPLY:
Scott
The 16 tooth will fit without any problems.  You should be able to install it without adding to your chain.  Good Luck


DATE: February 15, 1998
QUESTION: Stiff shifter on a 1982 GS1100E

I have an '82 GS1100E. Since it is winter, I haven't been riding it all that often; I try to run it at least once or twice a month. Lately, the shifter has become REALLY stiff on upshifts. I would appreciate any possible diagnoses/remedies. Thanks so much.

RIDER: John E Sullivan

REPLY: Zack Schultz
You don't mention, but this improve when the oil gets good and warm? I suspect that oil is still pretty stiff and the clutch plates aren't altogether disengaging. If you're still using the summer 10W40, change it to a lighter weight for the cold weather months. Another test is to put the bike in neutral on the center stand. With the engine running, does the rear wheel turn? If so, the clutch is your source. Whether it's the oil or the clutch itself, wait 'till things warm up to determine.


DATE: February 15, 1998
QUESTION: GS1100GK tranny problems

Hi, my name is Eric and I appreciate the time all you guys take in working on this web page . Now on to my questions.  I have a 1982 GS1100GK I was riding her one day and she started to slip out of gear when under strain.  It goes into all gears but will slip out if weight is put on it.  My Suzuki dealer said it had to be in the rear end and gave me a list of parts to order.  Needless to say it had nothing to do with the the rear end.  So after several hundred dollars I it to a local Honda dealer who has had it for over a week and still has no clue as to what the real problem is.  If you have any ideas I'd love to entertain them because I really love my machine and don't relish the thought of losing her.

RIDER: Eric Bahmer

REPLY: Frank Perreault
The question I have is does it actually slip out of gear to neutral or does it appear to just be slipping?  If it stays in gear but slips I'd say it's the clutch adjustment or the clutch itself.  If it's really slipping out of gear, that would indicate possible tranny problems caused by worn dogs and or shifting mechanisms and that wouldn't be good news.  Getting into the tranny involves totally dismantling the engine which means "big bucks".
REPLY:
Zack Schultz
I agree with everything in Frank's response. However, the 'big bucks' is a labor charge. The actual parts required are fairly inexpensive. If you can do mechanical work yourself it's actually a fairly simple (though tedious and exacting) process. You need to remove the engine from the frame and split the cases. If that scares you off, go no further - take it to a dealer.


DATE: December 17, 1997
QUESTION: Hung clutch on a GS1100

I noticed that the clutch cable on my 81 GS1100E was very frayed, so I removed it and ordered a new one. Several days later while still waiting for the new part, I started the bike and let it run for a while to warm up, I was going to test out the shifting and tried to manually move the clutch lever that comes out of the housing, no way, it wouldn't budge. I reattached the cable to the lever and tried to pull the cable, no dice. Even tried tapping on it with a mallet, no dice.

Any ideas? Before this happened there were no troubles with the clutch, but it was shifting kinda hard. There are 35K miles on it. Thanks for any and all help.

RIDER: Troy Sigwing

REPLY: Frank Perreault
Troy, it sounds like you are going to be ripping into the clutch to find out what's going on here. It could be a couple of things, but you'll need to take the clutch cover off to see for sure.
REPLY:
Troy Sigwing
Well, luckily after I replaced the clutch cable, everything was back to normal, apparently you can't just push the clutch lever. On a different but possible related note, shifting into either first or second from neutral is pretty rude. I adjusted the clutch cable, no help and I just changed the oil (10W40 synth blend). Any ideas besides tearing apart the tranny?
REPLY:
Frank Perreault
You may not be able to push the clutch level with bare hands but you should be able to with a pair of Vice-Grips attached to the clutch lever. There is a ton of pressure there so I doubt whether you could move it with bare hands.

I believe that the hanging up is either due to something goofy in the clutch or damage in the tranny. Due to the expense of taking an engine down to the tranny, I would suggest dragging the bike down to the Suzuki dealer and have them look at it. It's hard to diagnose this type of problem without seeing and hearing it. I certainly wouldn't want you spending unneccessary money by me guessing wrong on this.

As a side note, I have found that running real motorcycle oil DOES make a significant difference in the smoothness of the shifting and the quietness of the engine. It also holds up better under high heat conditions.


DATE: December 5, 1997
QUESTION: Replacing a clutch cable

So there I was with a floppy clutch lever in my hand and not a clue in my head. It appears that the cable had frayed through to the last wire about an eighth of an inch from the ball at the grip. I would appreciate some help with the installation of the new cable I'm preparing to buy. Thanks.

RIDER: Michael Keslar

REPLY: Frank Perreault
OK, this is the quick and dirty method. Remove the positive battery terminal, remove the gas tank, pull back the rubber boot and loosen the locknut securing the clutch cable adjuster, screw in the adjuster all the way, remove the cotter pin, washer and clevis pin securing the cable end to the clutch release arm. Now pull the clutch cable from the front of the bike noting the routing of it. You may have to loosen some clamps and stuff to be able to pull it through. Align the slots on the adjuster of the clutch handle and remove the cable from it. Reassembly is the reverse of this.

You want to make sure that when you adjust the various adjusters so that you aren't applying 'pull' to the clutch release arm when the bike is at rest. This will cause clutch slipping and you could conceivably burn out your clutch if this happens. Make sure you leave just a tad of slack in the clutch cable.
REPLY:
Doug Petepiece
Just one more tip for the guy putting on a new clutch cable... have your bike pointed away from anything you don't want to hit. After installing a new clutch this summer, I almost ran my bike up the shop wall when the adjustments were being made....as you may have guessed I took off my centerstand.
REPLY:
Frank Perreault
That's the importance behind making sure that there isn't any tension on the cable. To be safe though, follow Doug's advice and leave the bike on the centerstand when starting it for the first time after a cable replacement.


DATE: November 8, 1996
QUESTION: Rattling clutch basket

I have a UK model 1976 GS1000EC. It's done about 50,000 miles and has been an ace bike. However the clutch rattles around when the bike is idling. It subsides when the clutch is engaged. Now I know this is a common problem so have any of you expert mechanics out there ever done anything about it? I remember in the eighties seeing articles about it and mentioning worn thrust washers behind the clutch basket. Is it really as simple as replacing a washer or manufacturing a thicker than new one?

RIDER: Jeremy Robinson, University of Limerick, Ireland

REPLY: Frank Perreault
I'd go with either a worn thrust washer, worn clutch springs or various clutch pieces not being torqued to specifications.
REPLY: Scott
Try a larger thrust washer as a possible fix. When you have the "basket" out look at the backing plate and the springs in the backing plate. If the springs are loose the basket will rattle. Place the basket open end down on a hard flat surface and push on the outer edges of the backing plate (not the helical gear) with your thumbs, one at 12 o'clock, one at six. Work your way around the basket to see if there is any movement. The rivets in the backing plate work themselves loose, usually after the springs go bad.


DATE: October 21, 1996
QUESTION: Re-gearing

I have a GS1100EX, and most of my bike friends have modern XYZ race reps. I like my GS but want to be able to cruise at higher speeds on motorways, and put more rubber on the road. I'd like to get some opinions on re-gearing the bike and swapping the swingarm for a JMC to get something like a GSXR wheel at the bike. I know the bike will have the torque to re-gear, but has anyone tried it ???

RIDER: Conrad Price, Belgium

REPLY: Peter Huppertz
If you'd redo the rear wheel and swingarm for something wider (a GSX-R arm might me made to fit, these seem to be adaptable to almost anything), you'd have 2 things to take into account:
First: the chain path may (and probably has got to) be altered (I mean, there's that extra rubber that the chain has to circumvent). If you alter the chain line without putting the front chain wheel further to the outside as well (which is VERY hard to do) the chain will wear much faster. You may want to look into one of the slimmer heavy-duty chains from Tsubaki (needless to say you need the sprockets to go with that too). It gives you just that extra bit of room.
Second: you will have to have a wider wheel and tire on the front as well, otherwise your geometry will be upset and you will get mighty funny effects.
On top of that: Wider tyres will make your bulk even heavier to handle. If you can adjust the front end to dive down *just* a little further, it will improve steering quickness, but at the cost of stability. You will absolutely need stiffer springs at the front to prevent the plot from becoming twisty under heavy braking if you do so. Anyway, using a 17" front wheel will compensate a little for the heavier steering.


DATE: July 17, 1996
QUESTION: Sticky clutch - 1981 GS450T

I have a 1981 GS450T with low mileage. I love it, but it has a couple of problems. First, as several others have reported, I'm having problems starting the bike if it hasn't been started for more than about 10 days. Has *anyone* solved this? Second, the clutch cable seems a bit sticky, and seems to release in small increments. This is very irritating. I've replaced the cable, and pour oil into it regularly, but it seems to only help temporarily.
Any ideas?

RIDER: Richard Kershenbaum

REPLY: Jean-Duc Villareal
I just bought a GS550E and had the clutch stick badly as soon as the engine was warm. The cable was obviously replaced by the seller very recently. One suggested me to lube the cable, but as you mentioned did not work efficiently.
I was told to change the oil and oil filter a little more frequently than usual (every 1000 miles) for 2 or 3 times. Well guess what, spent a saturday afternoon working on the bike and +=Tada=+ the clutch does not stick as much as it used to.

 

 

 

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