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Putting Cylinders on Pistons - Oil or No Oil?

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    Putting Cylinders on Pistons - Oil or No Oil?

    Ok, I'm hoping to put my cylinders on tonight, but I'm a little confused as to whether I should use some engine oil or not.

    The Clymer says to put some engine oil in the cylinders, but I have seen threads on here that say to do it dry...

    What's the best option?
    1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
    1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

    sigpic

    450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

    Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

    #2
    I recommend just enough oil to keep the cylinder from rusting Pete. I don't think it matters much either way though.
    Ed

    To measure is to know.

    Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

    Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

    Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

    KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

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      #3
      Oil, it needs to have oil when it runs
      1978 GS 1000 (since new)
      1979 GS 1000 (The Fridge, superbike replica project)
      1978 GS 1000 (parts)
      1981 GS 850 (anyone want a project?)
      1981 GPZ 550 (backroad screamer)
      1970 450 Mk IIID (THUMP!)
      2007 DRz 400S
      1999 ATK 490ES
      1994 DR 350SES

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        #4
        Cheers for the quick reply Ed, makes sense.

        The guys who did the honing for me put a bit of engine oil in and cling wrapped them to preserve it for me, so I'll wipe that oil out and put a smear of some of the oil I have as I don't know what oil they put in.
        1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
        1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

        sigpic

        450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

        Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Big T View Post
          Oil, it needs to have oil when it runs
          That makes sense too Big T, cheers
          1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
          1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

          sigpic

          450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

          Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

          Comment


            #6
            I don't how much the shop cleaned up the bores after honing them; but you might want to scrub those cylinders out a bit more. I usually use hot soapy water and a scrub brush followed by wiping the cylinder walls with ATF and paper towels. If you have a high pressure steam cleaner - even better. Then oil. I'm always amazed at how much metal dust and shavings are still in there.
            -1980 GS1100 LT
            -1975 Honda cb750K
            -1972 Honda cl175
            - Currently presiding over a 1970 T500

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              #7
              Pete, don't neglect to space the rings correctly. I always oil the ring grooves and rings so they will rotate easily for correct spacing. I also oil the bores, particularly the chamfer on the bottom of the cylinders where the rings first enter the bore. As has been said, "you don't want to start the motor up dry", it needs lubrication until the pump can get the oil in there. I can't understand the thinking behind putting a motor together dry.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Tom R View Post
                I don't how much the shop cleaned up the bores after honing them; but you might want to scrub those cylinders out a bit more. I usually use hot soapy water and a scrub brush followed by wiping the cylinder walls with ATF and paper towels. If you have a high pressure steam cleaner - even better. Then oil. I'm always amazed at how much metal dust and shavings are still in there.
                Pete,

                Use the hot soapy water and wipe it out with paper as above. Honing leaves stuff behind and engineering shops usually just oil the sleeves afterwards.

                Ken

                Comment


                  #9
                  Pete,

                  I have ring compressors for bike pistons if you want to borrow them. Better then using small screwdrivers. I can take them to work in town and meet you somewhere.

                  Don't forget to put rags in the top case. Hate to drop a circlip when putting the pistons on the rods.

                  Ken
                  Last edited by Guest; 01-10-2011, 05:54 AM.

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                    #10
                    Thanks for all the advice guys, I got them in tonight.

                    The guys did spray and blow it out before putting the oil in, but I got an old dish washing brush and kero and gave it an extra good scrub tonight before putting some oil in them again for assembly.

                    I did the difficult thing and used my fingers as ring compressors. Wasn't terribly easy but it worked ok.

                    And Don, yes, I spaced all the ring gaps according to the Clymer at around 120 degress.

                    I'm uploading pic's now but will update my rebuild thread in the morning as my eyes are a little tired at the moment.

                    PS: I didn't get the whole putting the cylinders on dry also, made no sense to me but I'm brand new at this so need to check all these things out, which is why I'm here after all
                    Last edited by pete; 01-10-2011, 08:11 AM. Reason: Forgot the PS
                    1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
                    1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

                    sigpic

                    450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

                    Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

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                      #11
                      Always put mine one with just a hint of oil around the base. You be admazed how much still gets scraped to the top when you wind it over. Built my Honda 900 proddy bike with a full rebuild and ran it in for a total 1.5 laps on a 2.4 klm course before full throttle and was a very quick bike. Knowing how i set the race engine up (loose) bearing wise helped.

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                        #12
                        Cool stuff. Given the ring's scraping up and down the cylinders, it doesn't surprise me that a reasonable amount of oil would be moved with it now that you put it like that.
                        1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
                        1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

                        sigpic

                        450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

                        Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

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                          #13
                          A general rule-of-thumb is to use oil every time you assemble parts that will move.

                          Since that is what they are supposed to do, the parts will begin moving sometime after assembly, and if there is no lubrication at that time then there will be abrasion.

                          If, for example, you assembled and installed the pistons dry, then started the engine, the pistons would move through several cycles before pumped oil could reach them. During that time abrasion would be inevitable.

                          Piston rings will move in their slots, over time, but they need lubrication intially, and so do the cylinder walls.
                          "If you scare people enough, they will demand removal of freedom. This is the path to tyranny."
                          Elon Musk Jan, 2022

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                            #14
                            See that's what I figured, which is why I couldn't understand the whole assemble it dry thing, but probably 99% of posters on here know more than I about this sort of thing, so I must ask...
                            1982 GS450E - The Wee Beastie
                            1984 GSX750S Katana 7/11 - Kit Kat - BOTM May 2020

                            sigpic

                            450 Refresh thread: https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-GS450-Refresh

                            Katana 7/11 thread: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...84-Katana-7-11

                            Comment


                              #15
                              i wouldnt even contemplate building anything mechanical that moves, without any form of lubrication to give it a "head start". dont go mad but a bit too much in an engine wont hurt and will soon burn off any excess
                              1978 GS1085.

                              Just remember, an opinion without 3.14 is just an onion!

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