Honda/Nissan/(Mitsubishi) merger

[GS1150Pilot]

Merger has colapsed.....

Yeah. Nissan didn't agree to become a subsidiary of Honda, which Honda insisted on as part of the deal. Power struggle may lead to Nissan's death.

[650Skull]

Merger has colapsed.....

[Tazman001]

Still own my Datsun:

1967datsun001.jpg

Bought it in Cali 1991. Brought it to the midwest in 1995. Been in the garage ever since.

[GS1150Pilot]

I was shopping for Hybrid Lexus a couple of months, almost bought one. But I took a step back and thought it over it was a great car but the price was more than I was comfortable with, I have a very usable Toyotya Tundra with 20yrs left in it and it's paid for. Two weeks after I was checking a used Porsche Boxster, I've driven them before great fun beautiful car only an oil leak from an undetermined source prevented the sale. I've got two bikes my 84 GS1150efe and a 79 CBX and Ive looking at my garage to to see if I can squeeze in a Indian FTR or Triumph Speed twin.

Funny you should mention Triumphs. I have my eye on a 900 Bonneville, too.

[wyly]

While I may own an electric grocery getter in the form of an electric bike or tiny hatch, I do not think, in my lifetime, that I will ever be without an IC vehicle. I say that as I lay plans for finding either an early 70's El Camino or Ranchero and while loving the Harley and looking at Guzzis and various Beemers.

I was shopping for Hybrid Lexus a couple of months, almost bought one. But I took a step back and thought it over it was a great car but the price was more than I was comfortable with, I have a very usable Toyotya Tundra with 20yrs left in it and it's paid for. Two weeks after I was checking a used Porsche Boxster, I've driven them before great fun beautiful car only an oil leak from an undetermined source prevented the sale. I've got two bikes my 84 GS1150efe and a 79 CBX and Ive looking at my garage to to see if I can squeeze in a Indian FTR or Triumph Speed twin.

[dorkburger]

While I may own an electric grocery getter in the form of an electric bike or tiny hatch, I do not think, in my lifetime, that I will ever be without an IC vehicle. I say that as I lay plans for finding either an early 70's El Camino or Ranchero and while loving the Harley and looking at Guzzis and various Beemers.

I miss my 454 powered 66 ElCamino. Certainly not economical, but great fun. I saw an interesting VW on Saturday. Apparently some company makes a kit to make a small VW car into a ute. It was neat. The owner said he didn't need a giant pickup for his needs and the little converted VW was perfect for him.

https://www.smythkitcars.com/jetta-golf-ute

[GS1150Pilot]

Very good article, I just skimmed through it's very long I'll to sit down a give it a better read when I time.

A couple quick observations, claiming ev numbers is only a small percentage of cars on the road isn't taking into account the average life span of a car is 11 yrs, as practical ev's are still fairly recent I expect we'll see a noticeable *@%^$*@%^$*@%^$*@%^$ in 5yrs in North America, domestic builders need to improve their products.

Rural areas slow to adopt evs, Not surprising rural people being more conservative are slow to pick up new technology. And the range issues haven't been solved for their needs.

All the various fuels for ICE, I see that as stop gap measures for countries that are far behind in ev infrastructure. Toyota is a conservative company it knows the future is electric but its taking it slow covering all bases.

When Battery range, charge and infrastructures issues are solved I can't envision ICE surviving except for super clean emission vehicles but that will only delay the inevitable. Give consumers 1000km range, gobs of pin you to your seat torque, 10-15min home charging and I'll never own another ICE again.

While I may own an electric grocery getter in the form of an electric bike or tiny hatch, I do not think, in my lifetime, that I will ever be without an IC vehicle. I say that as I lay plans for finding either an early 70's El Camino or Ranchero and while loving the Harley and looking at Guzzis and various Beemers.

[oldGSfan]

Probably nobody ever thought we wouldn't eventually evolve into something better than ICE, Just seems we've not evolved that far "yet". When we do folks will buy them just cause they think they're better than ICE. Even that Ford CEO, Jim Farley, back last Aug., after a trip in a Ford EV admitted we had a ways to go and how challenging keeping the Ford charged was. Seems we've knid'f been getting forced towards EV's for the past few yrs., before they have evolved enough to suit the general public. No doubt, we'll get there, just not yet.

My then 18 y/o son met Jim Farley in the pits at Monterey Historics in Sept '23. Farley chatted with him a few minutes (my son is a bit of a gearhead...) and let him sit in his Cobra, which he raced to a very close 2nd. It was about 1 hour before the race. After the race my son was hanging around the pits, waiting to see him come back in, and Farley (cousin of Chris) got rushed off to do a promo for the latest electric Mustang. Pretty wild being in such a time where things are transitioning. We love the past but embrace the future. Hopefully.

[rphillips]

Probably nobody ever thought we wouldn't eventually evolve into something better than ICE, Just seems we've not evolved that far "yet". When we do folks will buy them just cause they think they're better than ICE. Even that Ford CEO, Jim Farley, back last Aug., after a trip in a Ford EV admitted we had a ways to go and how challenging keeping the Ford charged was. Seems we've knid'f been getting forced towards EV's for the past few yrs., before they have evolved enough to suit the general public. No doubt, we'll get there, just not yet.

[wyly]

Very good article, I just skimmed through it's very long I'll to sit down a give it a better read when I time.

A couple quick observations, claiming ev numbers is only a small percentage of cars on the road isn't taking into account the average life span of a car is 11 yrs, as practical ev's are still fairly recent I expect we'll see a noticeable *@%^$*@%^$*@%^$*@%^$ in 5yrs in North America, domestic builders need to improve their products.

Rural areas slow to adopt evs, Not surprising rural people being more conservative are slow to pick up new technology. And the range issues haven't been solved for their needs.

All the various fuels for ICE, I see that as stop gap measures for countries that are far behind in ev infrastructure. Toyota is a conservative company it knows the future is electric but its taking it slow covering all bases.

When Battery range, charge and infrastructures issues are solved I can't envision ICE surviving except for super clean emission vehicles but that will only delay the inevitable. Give consumers 1000km range, gobs of pin you to your seat torque, 10-15min home charging and I'll never own another ICE again.

[GS1150Pilot]

A good read on the issue of the world going fully EV:

The Future of Internal-Combustion Engines | Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA)

[wyly]

BYD is putting the smack down in China, the world's largest auto market. China sales were 26M in 2023. The US market, in 2nd place, is 1/2 of that.

Electric cars are coming fast. Sadly, electric cars in the US, other than Tesla, are losing money for the automakers.

Some are bashing Honda for taking on Nissan, and their debt. Nissan is a company with deep engineering skills and resources, though, and Honda knows that. Hopefully, they can work together and create something great.

Hybrid sales are good in the US. I think they will be the stopgap for a number of years here. Full EV's are the future, though.

I agree hybrid sales are where it's at right now Toyota is doing well with it's hybrids. I expect when Toyota gets it's SS batteries up and running the switch to full SS EVs wont be far behind. SS Lexus Hybrids should be out next year.

Honda has finished building a Solid State research facility and from their press reports intends to be selling SS EVs including motorcycles before 2030, and only SS Evs by 2040.

https://global.honda/en/newsroom/news/2024/c241121eng.html

I don't think there's much doubt the age of ICEs is closing fast I wouldn't want to be the guy that buys the last $150K pickup rolling of the assembly the resale value is going to take a hit.

[wyly]

Toyota has been hesitant on the full EV front. And I don't blame them. Internal combustion engines are their history, so trashing that must be very difficult for them. And Honda, maybe even more so. They make some of the best lawn equipment, generators, boat engines, and of course, motorcycles.

But Toyota is going all in on Solid State batteries it's assuming control of Panasonic batteries.

[wyly]

I don't see what Honda gains from this other than a lot of engineers a bigger workforce and assembly plants. Maybe it's to counter an expected tsunami of ev cars coming out of China.

[oldGSfan]

So no problems? "Pretty solid"?

Nothing blew up. Solid from a mechanical perspective.