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    #16
    Voltage drop

    Hello, when you checked out your voltage at your coils you noticed a lower than expected value. This is because of your old bike being emmisions compliant. I'm from Canada and bought a gs1000 a few years ago that was a U.S. model well I'll cut to the chase. If you check the resistance of the line that goes to your coils you will notice x amount of ohms. In the north and Europe the coils received full battery voltage because they weren't jetted lean and needed a fat spark to keep things lit otherwise you ended up having a condition known as knock. You can remedy this by installing a relay tied into your ignition and feed your coils directly from your battery. You can get the lowdown at http://kzrider.com/archive/viewthrea...9470#pid250070 I've done this to my bike and it fires up first crank now and no carbon fouling of the plugs. Hope this helps.

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      #17
      Yet another twist to the story

      Now you really have me interested. I have been looking at schematics in my Clymer GS750 manual and have not seen any indication that there is a ballast resistor much less emissions ballast resistor. I guess there could be one on the low side inside of the igniter.

      Thanks for the links, I will be checkout out my 1980 (parts bike) and 1981 (daily rider) GS750E's

      Posplayr

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        #18
        ??horn relay??

        i'm just learning the whole electrical thing regarding my 78 gs750, and wonder if you can explain the horn relay's operation for me. does the relay only send power to the coils when the ignition is on? what guage wire and whwt size fuse do i need to run from the battery? thanks for your help folks! randy.

        Comment


          #19
          I have been following this thread and agree with most of the points that have been made.
          However, this one made me scratch my head for a bit:
          Originally posted by motoman View Post
          In the north and Europe the coils received full battery voltage because they weren't jetted lean and needed a fat spark to keep things lit otherwise you ended up having a condition known as knock.
          It has always been my understanding that a lean mixture is harder to light and therefore needed a fatter spark.
          A richer mixture will, indeed, foul the plugs, but I think it would do that despite the 'fatness' of the spark.

          .
          sigpic
          mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
          hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
          #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
          #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
          Family Portrait
          Siblings and Spouses
          Mom's first ride
          Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
          (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

          Comment


            #20
            schematic

            Oldryder may have another schematic but this is the one provided at the link proofed by motoman.

            You are basically changing the primary current path from going through the fuzebox/ignition/kill switch to just through the fuse box (or other fuse). The control is the previous current path (i.e. the kill switch voltage.). As long as the current paths through the ignition can fire the solenoid coil, they can be as bad as they want and this will work.

            Posplayr


            Here's the diagram. Luckily I had it printed off.

            Click on it for a larger view.

            [Edited on 9/25/2005 by rstnick]

            rstnick has attached this image:

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              #21
              Steve

              What puzzles me even more with the ballast resistor is that whether or not it can run with it or without, why add cost (i.e. the resistor) when it will not help the bike?

              Posplayr

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                #22
                BikeCliff website update

                Hi guys,

                With the help of Mr. oldryder and Mr. Steve, I've added a page to my little BikeCliff website with some information about the ignition coil upgrade mod.

                Direct link here.

                Great thread. Thank you all for your input. I think I'm going to try this mod on the next Saturday I have free.

                Thank you for your indulgence,

                BassCliff

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by BassCliff View Post
                  Hi guys,

                  With the help of Mr. oldryder and Mr. Steve, I've added a page to my little BikeCliff website with some information about the ignition coil upgrade mod.

                  Direct link here.

                  Great thread. Thank you all for your input. I think I'm going to try this mod on the next Saturday I have free.

                  Thank you for your indulgence,

                  BassCliff
                  that's great info!
                  now, something's telling me you're going to take some pickies of how it's done when you get to trying it out on your bike! :-D
                  GS850GT

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Have camera, will wrench

                    Originally posted by psyguy View Post
                    that's great info!
                    now, something's telling me you're going to take some pickies of how it's done when you get to trying it out on your bike! :-D
                    Sure, why not? I'll keep you informed. Thanks Mr. psyguy.


                    Thank you for your indulgence,

                    BassCliff

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by BassCliff View Post
                      Sure, why not? I'll keep you informed. Thanks Mr. psyguy.


                      Thank you for your indulgence,

                      BassCliff
                      I just did the mod and took some pics!
                      did it on the project bike that had enough voltage drop it wouldn't start.

                      (it has new harness and yes I cleaned the switches but still did not like the drop)

                      first you need to gather up the needed supplies.
                      wire, I used 14 gauge and also have a assortment of colors but this can be done with just one color.

                      connectors. butt, spade and ring are the three type needed I used trick gold plated copper for the connection at the relay as I had it laying around and it looks purdy.

                      relay. I used a osram mini relay I had salvaged from a bad PDM at work, these are nice and small and rated to 30 amps, more than enough for the job. these also are very reliable, we have some trucks four years old with over 800,000 miles on them and they still have all their original relays.

                      in-line fuse holder and fuse. i had this cheep one laying around so I used it
                      I used a capped mini blade fuse holder when I did the mods on my G and prefer to use them.

                      pic of parts and tools layed out.


                      picture of relay with wires connected and ready to go.

                      the power lead (fuse holder) connects to terminal 30 on the relay
                      the output to the coils connects to terminal 87 on the relay and splits into two female spade connectors on the coil end.
                      the control wire connects to terminal 85 on the relay
                      the ground relay connects to terninal 86 on the relay


                      you plug the coil wire (yellow) onto the + terminal on each coil and take the orange with white wires that were connected to the coils and crimp them into the butt connector on the control (green) wire.
                      early coils had the wire permenantly fixed into the coils so you cut them midway down to the harness plug and use butt connectors instead of the female spade connectors.


                      you then connect the power feed wire (with fuse holder) to the + battery terminal and the ground to a good ground spot or the ground terminal of the battery.
                      I tucked the relay up in the protective comer on the harness that goes to the fuse box.



                      this is a little video clip of the results (this bike has sat for 10 years!)
                      Store your photos and videos online with secure storage from Photobucket. Available on iOS, Android and desktop. Securely backup your memories and sign up today!

                      Comment


                        #26
                        You cant argue with success

                        Congratulations, that looks like it did the trick.
                        Posplayr

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Well it looks like you have that problem fixed, now to get the other bugs out of the bike. :shock:

                          (Referencing the last picture for that comment.) 8-[

                          .
                          sigpic
                          mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                          hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                          #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                          #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                          Family Portrait
                          Siblings and Spouses
                          Mom's first ride
                          Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                          (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Mr. focus frenzy,

                            You are an encouragement. I'll be ordering parts for my bike soon (front caliper rebuilt kits, shims, etc). I'll be sure to include the parts for this ignition upgrade. Nice work.

                            I'm glad we don't have ants that big around here. Running over a few of them with your bike would make quite a mess.


                            Thank you for your indulgence,

                            BassCliff

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Where does the green wire go in the relay? and why do the orange and white wires from the coils get connected to it. usually im very electric-savvy but for some reason, i cant get my head around this.

                              do i need that green wire if i do this? cant i just relay the power cable and leave the other two wires connected to the coil?
                              Last edited by Guest; 03-16-2008, 05:12 PM.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by catbed View Post
                                Where does the green wire go in the relay? and why do the orange and white wires from the coils get connected to it. usually im very electric-savvy but for some reason, i cant get my head around this.

                                do i need that green wire if i do this? cant i just relay the power cable and leave the other two wires connected to the coil?
                                It might help to demystify relays just a little bit. All it is, is a remote-control switch.

                                The orange/white wire used to provide power to the coils. Now you will use that wire to turn on the relay, so you connect it to the green wire, which is connected to terminal 85 or 86. The other terminal (86 or 85) will need to be connected to ground. What this does for the relay is power the coil that pulls the other contacts together.

                                Now you take your battery power (through a fuse), connect that to terminal 30. Now run a pair of wires from terminal 87 to where the orange/white wire used to be on the coils. This is your new power source for the coils, but it is controlled by the original wire.

                                .
                                sigpic
                                mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                                hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                                #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                                #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                                Family Portrait
                                Siblings and Spouses
                                Mom's first ride
                                Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                                (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                                Comment

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