voltage loss data

[saddlewarmer]

I get the use for all the tools in your picture but the pipe wrench and the angle grinder.

[catbed]

It might help to demystify relays just a little bit. All it is, is a remote-control switch.

The orange/white wire used to provide power to the coils. Now you will use that wire to turn on the relay, so you connect it to the green wire, which is connected to terminal 85 or 86. The other terminal (86 or 85) will need to be connected to ground. What this does for the relay is power the coil that pulls the other contacts together.

Now you take your battery power (through a fuse), connect that to terminal 30. Now run a pair of wires from terminal 87 to where the orange/white wire used to be on the coils. This is your new power source for the coils, but it is controlled by the original wire.

.

so there are still two stock wires connected to the coils. i was confused because i couldnt see the other connections on the coils in the picture.

[Steve]

I get the use for all the tools in your picture but the pipe wrench and the angle grinder.

The angle grinder cleans gounding points to assure a good connection. :shock:
The pipe wrench is to make sure the ground screws are tight. 8-[


.

[hp1000s]

The angle grinder cleans gounding points to assure a good connection. :shock:
The pipe wrench is to make sure the ground screws are tight. 8-[


.

...nicely done!

[focus frenzy]

The angle grinder cleans gounding points to assure a good connection. :shock:
The pipe wrench is to make sure the ground screws are tight. 8-[


.

actualy the grinder was for my toe nails, the next project was trimming my nails.
the pipe wrench was for if the bike failed to start as I could not find where I put my 3lb drillers hammer.

after hooking it up I had checked the spark and it was not a very strong spark, it was a nice shade of blue but was tiny.
both my G with dyna coils and E with accel coils put out fat hot spark.

[Kcwiro]

OldRyder....wow, Is there any risk to doing this to a bike that is not seeing the issue at the time...I knwo my bike starter sounds a tad weak but it does start pretty easily thoguh I have not tried it with the newer harness I just installed this last weekend *waiting on other parts*

can anyone post the new updated voltage loss data postmod? Certainly interested to know... but as I see it in here the mod basically provides direct junction from the key on position to the coil instead of it looping through everything as before but since we aren't disconnecting anything in that circuit it just has redundency and is also intern more efficient.

Very interesting and cheap.. my buddy and I are going to go for doing this...GOOD READ!

[focus frenzy]

can anyone post the new updated voltage loss data postmod? Certainly interested to know... but as I see it in here the mod basically provides direct junction from the key on position to the coil instead of it looping through everything as before but since we aren't disconnecting anything in that circuit it just has redundency and is also intern more efficient.

Very interesting and cheap.. my buddy and I are going to go for doing this...GOOD READ!

DOH!!!! ](*,) I was so happy to hear it run after its long slumber I neglected to take the readings.
I will bring home my good meter from work (the one I took the first readings with) and have the new coil supply volts numbers tomorrow by this time.

[Kcwiro]

Sweet! Thank you my buddy and I look forward to reading about it ... I stumbled across this thread via a search for 'Grounding' and I found this gem... I was glued to my monitor for like an hour and half just stairing at it:-D.... and reading

[PAULYBOY]

dear Mr. Frenziedfocus, can you tell me which wire from your kill switch you either tapped into or bridged, as per the shorcut diagram?(#86 on the shortcut from the KZriders website says trigger from kill switch). I see in your pix nicely done that you attached to the positive and negative battery posts(?) where the shortcut says to find the bolt at the starter solenoid and ground to a good frame bolt. Seems to me your method is better. Here's where I'm confused, and it's probably from following 3 different ideas of the same job: you connected the yellow wires to the coils, and that accounts for the third post of a 4 post relay. Then, you took the old leads from the coils and attached them both into your green wire, which makes 4 (1 for power, 2 for ground, etc.). So, did you just do that instead of going to the kill switch, or is my math fuzzy?

[catbed]

the killswitch trigger that you speak of is the two orange wires. when they get powered, the killswitch is in the "run" position. when the have no power, the killswitch is in the "stop" position. when they get power through the killswitch, it flips the relay and lets the full 12 volts through from the battery.

[focus frenzy]

ok here are the connections.
most relays of this type have four or five terminals and they are marked 30,87,87A,85 and 86. on relays with just four terminals there won't be a 87A terminal.

the power wire can be hooked up to the battery side of the starter solinoid or dirrect to the battery positive post. hooked to the solinoid that would be one less wire to deal with at battery change time. this wire then go's via a inline fuse holder (10amp) to the #30 relay terminal.

the output to coils wire connects to the #87 relay terminal and you can run two wires, one to each coil or run one and split into two at the coil end.

the relay is controled by the original coil power wire/s (orange with white stripe) connect a wire to the orange with white stripe wire and run it to the #85 terminal on the relay

then run a wire from the #86 relay terminal to a good ground.

[focus frenzy]

OK!!!!!
here are the voltage drop readings after installing the coil relay.

stock I found a 2.82 volt drop at the coils.
after the mod I now have a voltage drop of .05 volts at the coils!! \\/

good thing as this POS wallmart battery is rapidly deteriorating.
it was on the charger all night. I have a motorcycle specific charger that puts out a max of 1.5 amps and it switches to a pulsed trickle when the battery is fully charged.

fresh off the charger it showed 13.4 volts, turn on ignition and it dropped all the way to 11.99 volts before it stabilized.
the headlight is not plugged in so the only draw is the dash lights, tail lights and ignition.

[Kcwiro]

...most relays of this type have four or five terminals and they are marked 30,87,87A,85 and 86. on relays with just four terminals there won't be a 87A terminal....

'Question'

good point my friend went to NAPA to get the relays for us to do these mods (the store he was at did not have the specific one and the ones that did were already closed) .... they did have the five prong relays but we were hesitant to take one of those to use since I personally do not know enough if we can just leave that one un-attached or what.

Can anyone say in here that it is ok to use a five prong relay instead if so how would the connections work into that?

[focus frenzy]

'Question'

good point my friend went to NAPA to get the relays for us to do these mods (the store he was at did not have the specific one and the ones that did were already closed) .... they did have the five prong relays but we were hesitant to take one of those to use since I personally do not know enough if we can just leave that one un-attached or what.

Can anyone say in here that it is ok to use a five prong relay instead if so how would the connections work into that?

yes it will work.
read my post you quoted as it tells you how to wire using a 5 terminal realy.
you just don't hook anything to the 87A terminal.

the only time you will ever need the 87A terminal is if you are doing the headlight cut off mod. (kills headlight when starter button is pushed)

or want to do a side stand ignition kill switch.

[Matchless]

The 5 prong relays are usable. Basically the difference between the four and 5 prong is that the four prong has a connection for the relay coil, 85 and 86. The prong 30 is used to connect to the supply you want switched by the relay and the pin 87 puts out the input on 30 when the relay is operated. Pin 87a puts out the input on 30 when the relay is normal (not operated) and moves it to 87 when the relay is operated, so just disregard 87a if you are using it as an on off switch only

Always test an unknown relay as there are some that have either one of the contacts bridged internally to the frame or one pole of the coil. They are more custom, but can cause damage. It is used say to switch the same potential that is used to operate the coil and saves on an external bridge.

In more technical terms the 4 pin relay only has a make contact and the 5 pin relay has a changeover contact.

Hope this helps