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    Smart bolts

    A copy of information posted by Laotzuistruth on the XS650 Garage forum:http://www.smartbolts.com/index.htm

    Very interesting development in bolt rechnology. I can see real use in bikes like the XS where everything shakes loose in quick order. GSs not so much but for peace of mind....great idea.

    Cheers all,
    Spyug

    #2
    seems like a very expensive gimmick to me. a torque wrench to tighten them up and either a spring washer or some locktite to stop them coming loose is a far better and cheaper option
    1978 GS1085.

    Just remember, an opinion without 3.14 is just an onion!

    Comment


      #3
      On bikes it probably would be a gimmick. I've seen these things in engineering magazines for a while now. They're for those critical applications where you need to know the tension on the bolt. There's a degree of uncertainty with a torque wrench, even a quality one tightening a lubed screw. Also handy for service inspections, since they will tell you if the bolt is loosening or stretching.
      Dogma
      --
      O LORD, be gracious to me; heal me, for I have sinned against you! - David

      Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense. - Carl Sagan

      --
      '80 GS850 GLT
      '80 GS1000 GT
      '01 ZRX1200R

      How to get a "What's New" feed without the Vortex, and without permanently quitting the Vortex

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Dogma View Post
        On bikes it probably would be a gimmick. I've seen these things in engineering magazines for a while now. They're for those critical applications where you need to know the tension on the bolt. There's a degree of uncertainty with a torque wrench, even a quality one tightening a lubed screw. Also handy for service inspections, since they will tell you if the bolt is loosening or stretching.
        if fitted in a critical application i am sure they would make adequate precautions to make sure the bolt doesn't come loose in the first place
        1978 GS1085.

        Just remember, an opinion without 3.14 is just an onion!

        Comment


          #5
          Man, these things are expensive! Leftover sample bolts are about $25 each.

          I kind of wonder how well they withstand heat, and the fluid capsules seem vulnerable. I suspect they're intended more for protected areas of construction than machinery.

          The "poor man's" way to ensure that bolts stay put is this brittle goop that cracks and changes color if the fastener moves at all.

          Looking for a link...
          1983 GS850G, Cosmos Blue.
          2005 KLR685, Aztec Pink - Turd II.3, the ReReReTurdening
          2015 Yamaha FJ-09, Magma Red Power Corrupts...
          Eat more venison.

          Please provide details. The GSR Hive Mind is nearly omniscient, but not yet clairvoyant.

          Celeriter equita, converteque saepe.

          SUPPORT THIS SITE! DONATE TODAY!

          Get "The Riding Obsession" sport-touring motorcycling podcast at https://tro.bike/podcast/ or wherever you listen to podcasts!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Agemax View Post
            if fitted in a critical application i am sure they would make adequate precautions to make sure the bolt doesn't come loose in the first place
            That's why I mentioned bolt stretching as one condition these would detect. A bolt that is stretching under load won't be helped by any locking devices (which are probably also present).
            Dogma
            --
            O LORD, be gracious to me; heal me, for I have sinned against you! - David

            Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense. - Carl Sagan

            --
            '80 GS850 GLT
            '80 GS1000 GT
            '01 ZRX1200R

            How to get a "What's New" feed without the Vortex, and without permanently quitting the Vortex

            Comment


              #7
              All bolts stretch under load. A torque wrench, used with clean threads and anti-seize compound, measures the tension developed as the bolt stretches.
              sigpic[Tom]

              “The greatest service this country could render the rest of the world would be to put its own house in order and to make of American civilization an example of decency, humanity, and societal success from which others could derive whatever they might find useful to their own purposes.” George Kennan

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by themess View Post
                All bolts stretch under load. A torque wrench, used with clean threads and anti-seize compound, measures the tension developed as the bolt stretches.
                Yes, that's how these work. The screws have a hole through the center with a precise amount of fluid in it. As the screw stretches, the volume of that hole increases, drawing more fluid into the body of the screw, and out of the head. The amount of fluid visible in the head decreases until a dot of the correct size is all that's left visible.

                I was referring to stretching due to fatigue, creep or increased loading for some reason other than torque applied to the head. So, if the tension and strain induced on the bolt after proper torquing is no longer on the screw when you come back to check it, this screw can tell you. Re-torquing to check tension is not always an option, or may not be precise enough.

                I seem to recall that they were also working on an electronic version of this that would work with something similar to an RFID reader. That way you can check large groups of fasteners just by waving the reader over them, or even have continuous monitoring.
                Dogma
                --
                O LORD, be gracious to me; heal me, for I have sinned against you! - David

                Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense. - Carl Sagan

                --
                '80 GS850 GLT
                '80 GS1000 GT
                '01 ZRX1200R

                How to get a "What's New" feed without the Vortex, and without permanently quitting the Vortex

                Comment


                  #9
                  doesn't that defeat the object? having a bolt in a critical area which has a hole drilled through its length, this would decrease the bolts strength and longevity straight away, causing it to stretch prematurely
                  1978 GS1085.

                  Just remember, an opinion without 3.14 is just an onion!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Agemax View Post
                    doesn't that defeat the object? having a bolt in a critical area which has a hole drilled through its length, this would decrease the bolts strength and longevity straight away, causing it to stretch prematurely
                    I'm sure it does decrease the strength somewhat, maybe a few percent. As I recall the hole is tiny, like 0.5 mm, probably ram EDM'd. But some critical joints are all about maximum grip, while other critical joints need to be easily inspected, and can give up a little strength.

                    I'm trying to think of an application example, and all I can think of is someplace like the hot areas of a nuclear reactor. Someplace where visual inspection by camera is possible, but putting a wrench on it is not. That's also a place where the steel may not stay steel indefinitely. (There's a family of stainless steels that are fairly immune to transmutation, but I'm not sure which.)
                    Dogma
                    --
                    O LORD, be gracious to me; heal me, for I have sinned against you! - David

                    Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense. - Carl Sagan

                    --
                    '80 GS850 GLT
                    '80 GS1000 GT
                    '01 ZRX1200R

                    How to get a "What's New" feed without the Vortex, and without permanently quitting the Vortex

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by bwringer View Post

                      The "poor man's" way to ensure that bolts stay put is this brittle goop that cracks and changes color if the fastener moves at all.

                      Looking for a link...
                      "torque-seal" or something of the sort... also called inspection paint.

                      www.mcmaster.com bright orange = 1476T114 lots of variety to choose from!

                      -nate

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Dogma View Post
                        I'm trying to think of an application example, ....transmutation...

                        They list applications on the website:



                        Embrittlement would be the more immediate concern. The design trend on the new (gen III+) reactors is simplicity and reliability, i.e. passive controls such as gravity driven grey and black rod insertions, and less reliance on novel technologies.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          if liquid core, what about bolts that are inverted or on an angle ? gravity must play havoc with the color of that little dot..

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by suzukiSam View Post
                            if liquid core, what about bolts that are inverted or on an angle ? gravity must play havoc with the color of that little dot..
                            As long as there are no air bubbles, position will make no difference.
                            1983 GS850G, Cosmos Blue.
                            2005 KLR685, Aztec Pink - Turd II.3, the ReReReTurdening
                            2015 Yamaha FJ-09, Magma Red Power Corrupts...
                            Eat more venison.

                            Please provide details. The GSR Hive Mind is nearly omniscient, but not yet clairvoyant.

                            Celeriter equita, converteque saepe.

                            SUPPORT THIS SITE! DONATE TODAY!

                            Get "The Riding Obsession" sport-touring motorcycling podcast at https://tro.bike/podcast/ or wherever you listen to podcasts!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by howling60 View Post
                              "torque-seal" or something of the sort... also called inspection paint.

                              www.mcmaster.com bright orange = 1476T114 lots of variety to choose from!

                              -nate
                              Yeah, that's what I was thinking of. It doesn't really prevent movement, but it simply makes any developing problems very easy to spot.

                              Fortunately, vibration loosening is not a big issue in the GS world.
                              1983 GS850G, Cosmos Blue.
                              2005 KLR685, Aztec Pink - Turd II.3, the ReReReTurdening
                              2015 Yamaha FJ-09, Magma Red Power Corrupts...
                              Eat more venison.

                              Please provide details. The GSR Hive Mind is nearly omniscient, but not yet clairvoyant.

                              Celeriter equita, converteque saepe.

                              SUPPORT THIS SITE! DONATE TODAY!

                              Get "The Riding Obsession" sport-touring motorcycling podcast at https://tro.bike/podcast/ or wherever you listen to podcasts!

                              Comment

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