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    Degree the cams?

    To degree, or not to degree. That is the question.
    Is a lowly street bike and daily rider worthy of such effort?
    I understand that by degreeing the cams you're just moving the power band to another RPM range.
    Valuable adjustment for a race bike, but should I bother to do it with my 1100G?
    I was thinking it may be worth the learning experience, and probably interesting.
    "Only fe' collected the old way, has any value." from His Majesty O'Keefe (1954 film)
    1982 GS1100G- road bike, body, seat and suspension modded
    1990 GSX750F-(1127cc '92 GSXR engine) track bike, much re-engineered
    1987 Honda CBR600F Hurricane; hooligan bike, restored

    #2
    your thinking is correct, I think.....did it on my 1100 b/c of a cam swap. Learning experience for sure. Not that hard once you grok it, but it takes time to grok to fullness
    1983 GS 1100 ESD

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      #3
      Originally posted by greg78gs750 View Post
      your thinking is correct, I think.....did it on my 1100 b/c of a cam swap. Learning experience for sure. Not that hard once you grok it, but it takes time to grok to fullness
      I didn't know you did a cam swap, can't remember a post about it, but can't remember a lot of posts here.
      "Only fe' collected the old way, has any value." from His Majesty O'Keefe (1954 film)
      1982 GS1100G- road bike, body, seat and suspension modded
      1990 GSX750F-(1127cc '92 GSXR engine) track bike, much re-engineered
      1987 Honda CBR600F Hurricane; hooligan bike, restored

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        #4
        just stock 1150 cams, not anything too exciting
        1983 GS 1100 ESD

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          #5
          Originally posted by greg78gs750 View Post
          just stock 1150 cams, not anything too exciting
          On the 16V bikes the Exhaust cam on the 750E and the 1100E is the same, so you can boost up the 750 intake side with the 80-82 1100E intake cams. On a bone stock 81 GS750EX I had a noticeable increase in pep and had to bump-up the main 1 step size.

          If i was going to degree a cam, I would see if there are any step up cam option that would not break the bank.

          Comment


            #6
            It does add a small potential failure point; there's some nonzero risk of the bolts backing out and letting the sprockets whack around, or the bolts getting loose and creating chaos.

            What that degree of risk is, I dunno, but I've seen it happen (bolts didn't get loose, fortunately). However, in that case we had no idea who had originally done the modification, so perhaps it was just human error. We buttoned things up with new grade 12 bolts, proper torque, and red Loctite, and had no further issues.

            I'm not sure if there are any cam options for an 1100G. You could start by using a stop, degree wheel, indicator, etc. to take some careful measurements of the stock cam setup.

            I also learned the hard way during that project that there are different types of degree wheels (some are marked for 360 degrees and some 180 degrees and back to zero), and trying to follow instructions to the letter without being aware of the difference is one sure path to insanity.
            1983 GS850G, Cosmos Blue.
            2005 KLR685, Aztec Pink - Turd II.3, the ReReReTurdening
            2015 Yamaha FJ-09, Magma Red Power Corrupts...
            Eat more venison.

            Please provide details. The GSR Hive Mind is nearly omniscient, but not yet clairvoyant.

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            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Buffalo Bill View Post
              ...
              I understand that by degreeing the cams you're just moving the power band to another RPM range.
              ....
              Degreeing the cam is checking the cams are opening/closing when you think they are. You would degree stock cams if you were blue printing a motor.
              To change the "power band" you would move the "centers" or timing of the cams, by changing the clocking between the two cam and/or the crank.
              Off the top of my head a stock GS wants the cam centers at 105 degrees, lots of overlap.
              IIRC my GS is set at 110 degrees. Helps top end, kills gas mileage

              Comment


                #8
                I got a lot of grief about this but it works very well and uses the small degree wheel.

                https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?139950-High-Accuracy-Degree-Wheel&highlight=high+performance+degree+wheel

                Comment


                  #9
                  Regarding question if it's worth of effort for stock(ish) street bike. Well, you never know... I would say that moving the cam timing from stock values to something else probably won't provide huge improvement. But there is one catch. At least my experience is that stock timing can be quite badly off from the spec from the factory. I have seen over 10 degree variations. So if you bike happens to be this kind worst case sample then you might get noticeable improvement just by degreeing the cams to the factory spec.
                  Arttu
                  GS1100E EFI turbo
                  Project thread

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by posplayr View Post
                    I got a lot of grief about this but it works very well and uses the small degree wheel.

                    https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?139950-High-Accuracy-Degree-Wheel&highlight=high+performance+degree+wheel
                    Thanks a bunch, interesting read for useful info. Also an interesting debate.
                    "Only fe' collected the old way, has any value." from His Majesty O'Keefe (1954 film)
                    1982 GS1100G- road bike, body, seat and suspension modded
                    1990 GSX750F-(1127cc '92 GSXR engine) track bike, much re-engineered
                    1987 Honda CBR600F Hurricane; hooligan bike, restored

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by ArttuH View Post
                      Regarding question if it's worth of effort for stock(ish) street bike. Well, you never know... I would say that moving the cam timing from stock values to something else probably won't provide huge improvement. But there is one catch. At least my experience is that stock timing can be quite badly off from the spec from the factory. I have seen over 10 degree variations. So if you bike happens to be this kind worst case sample then you might get noticeable improvement just by degreeing the cams to the factory spec.
                      I think you're right, it would be useful to check my engine for accuracy.
                      I've been reluctant to spend money on rarely used tools, but a dial indicator can be used for other things too.
                      Learning a new skill has surprising usefulness in unrelated work.
                      "Only fe' collected the old way, has any value." from His Majesty O'Keefe (1954 film)
                      1982 GS1100G- road bike, body, seat and suspension modded
                      1990 GSX750F-(1127cc '92 GSXR engine) track bike, much re-engineered
                      1987 Honda CBR600F Hurricane; hooligan bike, restored

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Changing the cam timing can make a very noticeable difference in the feel of the bike. I enjoy lower end torque much better than top end peak HP. For me, it was a little aggravating to get things set up, the first time, Something in the cyl. to measure find TDC, a good solid mount for the dial indicator, good solid pointer for the degree wheel. But after you do it & see what is involved, back in the day it was well worth the effort. Now days, I just ride them like they are. Just not as energetic as I once was. But yeah, I would recommend it. Just my opinion.
                        1983 GS1100E, 1983 CB1100F, 1991 GSX1100G, 1996 Kaw. ZL600 Eliminator, 1999 Bandit 1200S, 2005 Bandit 1200S, 2000 Kaw. ZRX 1100

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I picked up a good enough dial indicator at harbor fright for low $$. Also, I just forwarded an old article to ya, to the email in your profile....
                          1983 GS 1100 ESD

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I think those frustrating bikes that just don't respond to carb tuning, could be poor cam timing. Another possibility to eliminate in any case.
                            "Only fe' collected the old way, has any value." from His Majesty O'Keefe (1954 film)
                            1982 GS1100G- road bike, body, seat and suspension modded
                            1990 GSX750F-(1127cc '92 GSXR engine) track bike, much re-engineered
                            1987 Honda CBR600F Hurricane; hooligan bike, restored

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by posplayr View Post
                              On the 16V bikes the Exhaust cam on the 750E and the 1100E is the same, so you can boost up the 750 intake side with the 80-82 1100E intake cams. On a bone stock 81 GS750EX I had a noticeable increase in pep and had to bump-up the main 1 step size.

                              If i was going to degree a cam, I would see if there are any step up cam option that would not break the bank.
                              I have an '83 750 engine. Can I put the intake cam from an '80 1100 ? I have a blown up '80 1100 engine, and the original '83 750 needs a valve job. Would be a great time to change out the cam.
                              '83 GS 1100T
                              The Jet


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                              The Rocket

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