Master Link Sealant?

[Rich82GS750TZ]

Shortly after I bought my bike @ 15 yrs ago, I had someone put on new chain and sprockets. (At least I have no memory of doing it myself) Any-who, there appears to be some kind of gunk on the master link which I can only guess is there to help the link from popping off. Any ideas what this is, and should I use it or something else when I reassemble.

[Cipher]

There is some suggestion that RTV sealant prevents a clip from flyoing off
Dunno how though its pretty weak compard to the force it takes to get one on being springy steel and all.

[Big T]

I've used clip master links for decades and never had one fly off.

Overkill for a rare issue

[cowboyup3371]

You don't need to use that

[RichDesmond]

Sigh, the great master link debate will now commence.

Use a rivet master link. It is far more secure than a clip link. I’ve seen dozens of failed links, in every case it was a clip. Some installed by professional mechanics.

There will be lots of people who haven’t had a clip link fail, and claim that therefore there’s nothing wrong with them, and blame any failures on improper installation. Bad logic and false facts.

If for some reason you have to use a clip link, the RTV on the clip is a good idea. I’ve seen a clip go missing and the RTV held the side plate on. Not something to rely on, but it gives you a chance.

[GregT]

Sigh, the great master link debate will now commence.

Use a rivet master link. It is far more secure than a clip link. I’ve seen dozens of failed links, in every case it was a clip. Some installed by professional mechanics.

There will be lots of people who haven’t had a clip link fail, and claim that therefore there’s nothing wrong with them, and blame any failures on improper installation. Bad logic and false facts.

If for some reason you have to use a clip link, the RTV on the clip is a good idea. I’ve seen a clip go missing and the RTV held the side plate on. Not something to rely on, but it gives you a chance.

Agreed - with everything you said.
Some race sanctioning bodies require either RTV or wiring the clip. I've never done either on a road bike. But if I was prepping for a long trip, I would.

[Cipher]

Has anyone seen a link fail? I have only once though. I still think RTV would be slightly more useful and slightly less superstitious than lighting a candle.

[Grimly]

Has anyone seen a link fail?

I certainly have and it took out the crankcases of the first CB750 in my area. My mate was not pleased.
He was even less pleased when it was pointed out to him that cheaping out by joining two or more dog-ends of chain together with master links is not a good idea.
He tried to blame the mechanic who took it out for a road test, for ragging on it too much, but an autopsy showed the real culprit...

[Cipher]

I certainly have and it took out the crankcases of the first CB750 in my area. My mate was not pleased.
He was even less pleased when it was pointed out to him that cheaping out by joining two or more dog-ends of chain together with master links is not a good idea.
He tried to blame the mechanic who took it out for a road test, for ragging on it too much, but an autopsy showed the real culprit...

Well a patchwork drive chain Ill be damned.
DO they still sell endless drive chains or was that just an oem ploy to get you to buy a priocier chain.

My bike came with one and would have required removing the swingarm so not just a pricier chain some hours of shop time for dealers.

112 link takasago o-ring it was thing of beauty.

[RichDesmond]

Has anyone seen a link fail? I have only once though. I still think RTV would be slightly more useful and slightly less superstitious than lighting a candle.

Did you bother to read any posts other than the original?

[cowboyup3371]

RichD, though you have much more experience then I ever will, I can tell you emphatically that in the ten years I have owned my 550, I have never had the clip fail. I think personal experience should count for something instead of being told how my facts and logic is wrong

[RichDesmond]

RichD, though you have much more experience then I ever will, I can tell you emphatically that in the ten years I have owned my 550, I have never had the clip fail. I think personal experience should count for something instead of being told how my facts and logic is wrong

Sorry, but your logic is wrong.
You're making the classic mistake of overvaluing direct personal experience, and because of that not correctly assessing risk. Very common, very human thing to do.

So, a beginners guide to risk analysis.

There are three main things to consider

1) The probability of a particular failure
2) The probability, given that failure, that we'll have a bad outcome.
3) The cost of mitigating that failure mode.

In our little example here, failure mode is the clip coming off and the chain separating.
The possible bad outcomes range from the bike coasting to a halt on the side of the road, necessitating a trailer ride home, to the chain cracking the crankcase and basically destroying the engine, to you getting rear-ended and dying, because it happened in heavy traffic with a car right on your tail.
The mitigation cost is the extra effort it takes to use a rivet link instead of a clip.

The crucial mistake you're making is assessing the failure probability based only on your own experience. Given that this is a relatively low probability event, that will always cause you to underestimate, because you have zero occurrences.
I have, between racing and spending many hours in a bike service shop, a lot bigger sample to draw on. I've never had a chain fail myself. I know many, many people who have never had one fail. But I also had seen a lot chains that did come apart, and I've seen some bad consequences as a result.

The other thing people get wrong is thinking that any failures of clip link are due to improper installation. That's something that I can't refute with absolute certainty, but consider this: I've had a clip come off (RTV held the side plate on, luckily). I know at least two professional mechanics that have had it happen. So, either it can come off when properly installed, or it's possible for even a pro to get wrong. Statistically it's basically the same.

Finally, we get to mitigation. It cost very little, in either time or money, to use a rivet link instead of a clip.

In the end, we have this.
A low, but not negligibly low, risk of failure. A possibility of serious negative consequences of that failure. And a cheap and easy way of virtually eliminating that risk.

Add all that up and to me, using a rivet link is a no-brainer

[bonanzadave]

End of discussion.....

[Rob S.]

End of discussion.....

Much better looking than that black gunk.

[gs11ezrydr]

Sorry, but your logic is wrong.
You're making the classic mistake of overvaluing direct personal experience, and because of that not correctly assessing risk. Very common, very human thing to do.

So, a beginners guide to risk analysis.

There are three main things to consider

1) The probability of a particular failure
2) The probability, given that failure, that we'll have a bad outcome.
3) The cost of mitigating that failure mode.

In our little example here, failure mode is the clip coming off and the chain separating.
The possible bad outcomes range from the bike coasting to a halt on the side of the road, necessitating a trailer ride home, to the chain cracking the crankcase and basically destroying the engine, to you getting rear-ended and dying, because it happened in heavy traffic with a car right on your tail.
The mitigation cost is the extra effort it takes to use a rivet link instead of a clip.

The crucial mistake you're making is assessing the failure probability based only on your own experience. Given that this is a relatively low probability event, that will always cause you to underestimate, because you have zero occurrences.
I have, between racing and spending many hours in a bike service shop, a lot bigger sample to draw on. I've never had a chain fail myself. I know many, many people who have never had one fail. But I also had seen a lot chains that did come apart, and I've seen some bad consequences as a result.

The other thing people get wrong is thinking that any failures of clip link are due to improper installation. That's something that I can't refute with absolute certainty, but consider this: I've had a clip come off (RTV held the side plate on, luckily). I know at least two professional mechanics that have had it happen. So, either it can come off when properly installed, or it's possible for even a pro to get wrong. Statistically it's basically the same.

Finally, we get to mitigation. It cost very little, in either time or money, to use a rivet link instead of a clip.

In the end, we have this.
A low, but not negligibly low, risk of failure. A possibility of serious negative consequences of that failure. And a cheap and easy way of virtually eliminating that risk.

Add all that up and to me, using a rivet link is a no-brainer

Totally agree.Rivet type links are a no-brainer.Look at all the new bikes even in the 80's (rivets) and sport bikes now.Why roll the dice?