Laying it down?

[argonsagas]

You don't have to practice or know how to lay a bike down. If an impact is unavoidable reflexes are going to cause you to steer away from the impact at the last second and the bike is going down.

Agreed.



Creating the circumstances that permit practicing this, however, seems to be a negative, even destructive, type of effort.

[Jethro]

Anyways, a few people at work are asking if I know how to lay a bike down properly because it's very important. Some of these people actually ride.

These people are insane. You should stop communicating with them as soon as possible so that their foolishness, stupidity and lack of common sense doesn't seep into your head. Just looking out for you, as stupidity can be contagious.

Laying it down is the same exact thing as an accident. No different. Trust me on this, you do not have to practice accidents. If you happen to find yourself in one, you will instantly become an expert.

[dpep]

I have read all of the responses and agree with the bulk of the advice.

I will say however that if you are involved in turning such as in making a curve that is too tight or trying to avoid an object in your path, bring it on over as much as you can even if it risks going down in a lowside. You have the chance that you will make it around, but even if you don't a lowside is almost always preferable to a highside. Even that is a general rule, not an absolute one. Every accident scenario is different.

That isn't the same thing "laying down" on purpose, but it is the closest I would come to anything that met that description.

[tkent02]

I will say however that if you are involved in turning such as in making a curve that is too tight or trying to avoid an object in your path, bring it on over as much as you can even if it risks going down in a lowside. You have the chance that you will make it around, but even if you don't a lowside is almost always preferable to a highside.

+1 on this.
Amazingly, the bike almost always makes the curve, unless panic gets the rider.
Gentle braking can help too, unless the tires' traction is already maxed out from cornering. (It's not maxed out on a stock GS, unless the rubber is stone age or we are on wet roads. They just can't lean that far)
A lowside like this is preferable to a highside or just driving off the road right side up.
A good argument for track day practice.
We've all gone into a corner too hot.
Some of us have lived through it.

[GSXXZRX]

Here's a pretty good example of no front brake. But we all
know he did this to avoid hitting the dumpster.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7wH7WDUvF0

[posplayr]

Lay down situation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDKSgoixAU8&NR=1

NOT

Keep the rubber side down

[82Shafty]

+1 on this.
Amazingly, the bike almost always makes the curve, unless panic gets the rider.
Gentle braking can help too, unless the tires' traction is already maxed out from cornering. (It's not maxed out on a stock GS, unless the rubber is stone age or we are on wet roads. They just can't lean that far)
A lowside like this is preferable to a highside or just driving off the road right side up.
A good argument for track day practice.
We've all gone into a corner too hot.
Some of us have lived through it.

I certainly won't bs anyone. We all have talked the talk in such a manner as only people who don't have experience lock up the rear tire or panic when they shouldn't, but the truth is, I found myself in a real tight spot heading into work the other day and after I came out of it, I thought to myself what did I do wrong.

One, I was going around a guy keeping up with Big Bear on his HD and in the process, I gave the bike more throttle than it really needed to have. This was the #1 problem; I gave it too much juice.

Two, as I came around and went to get back into the lane, a turn was approaching with slippery RR tracks faster than I could comprehend. My mind struggled with leaning hard and needing to be upright for those tracks.

Three, I hit the back brake and the bike started to get a bit squirrely and the feel and the sound alone had me lay off of it (the back brake), but my response was to keep threshold braking as best as I could with the rear tire.

Four, there was a 4 inch curb that was going to make or break me and I could swear I scathed it, but my tires never had a mark on them. ( I focused on the wrong thing)

Five, I don't even recall touching the front brake because I felt as though I was leaning too much, nor do I recall pulling in the clutch. I honestly might have pulled in the clutch, just don't recall doing so.

I learned a lot from that situation, stuff I knew and how I should have reacted differently than I did, but you know what, I didn't and I certainly can admit that. I can only hope that by continuing to recite, practice, and by keeping my motorcycle senses up that the next situation will be handled more-appropriately.

[earlfor]

Here's a pretty good example of no front brake. But we all
know he did this to avoid hitting the dumpster.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7wH7WDUvF0

Hmmmm, learned how to do a wheelie, but not how to stop. I guess his priorities are different than mine. LOL


Earl

[earlfor]

+1 on this.
Amazingly, the bike almost always makes the curve, unless panic gets the rider.
Gentle braking can help too, unless the tires' traction is already maxed out from cornering. (It's not maxed out on a stock GS, unless the rubber is stone age or we are on wet roads. They just can't lean that far)
A lowside like this is preferable to a highside or just driving off the road right side up.
A good argument for track day practice.
We've all gone into a corner too hot.
Some of us have lived through it.

If you decide to lay it down, you have already given up and resolved yourself to a crash. That is not an option to me.

My preset response if I'm too fast into a turn, assuming the turn is not conducive to momentarily braking, is to lean the bike until the damn mirrors are scraping if need be, and add the power needed to maintain suspension balance and good tracking through the turn. 99 times out of 100, the bike will make it. Its the riders mindset that causes the crash.
Never give up.

Earl

[Riding Again]

This site is great for learning and resources for new techniques. Gotta read a few books.

How about them corners with gravel causing involuntary bike laydowns?

[earlfor]

This site is great for learning and resources for new techniques. Gotta read a few books.

How about them corners with gravel causing involuntary bike laydowns?

Gravel and sand do not have to result in a lay down. The bike doesnt care if the rear wheel slides out a couple of feet. It doesnt know the difference.
Steer into the slide and look where you want to go. The bike will go where you tell it to. Most of the time, you will not crash until you give up and decide to. You have nothing to lose by continuing to save it.

Store in your mind the types of terrain and conditions that result in sand and gravel in the turns and what points they occur. Same thing for water run off and algae on the road. That will help.

On unknown roads, I rarely ride at more than about 50% skill level. I keep a lot in reserve for the unexpected. Thats another bit of insurance.

Ride at a speed that is comfortable. If you're not honestly relaxed, slow it down.

I've tried crashing three times, once through a Pontiac station wagon and I found it acutely annoying. I do whatever it takes not to now.

Earl

[Pete Logan]

Ride at a speed that is comfortable. If you're not honestly relaxed, slow it down.

The stock advice is that you should always be able to easily stop the bike completely inside the clear and clean road you can see ahead.

Stop should always be an option.

Of course, depending on traffic conditions, this is not always compatible with actually going anywhere

[scrapper]

bike bowling for people!

PS: One more thought. Layin' it down is THE way to go if you're trying to knee cap a group of people by sliding your bike into them. Staying up and in control will usually only get one or two at time.
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