BIG Thanks to one GSR member????

[sscott]

This last Saturday, 11-7-09, I noticed how pretty of a day it was and decided to fire up my "L" (I really love those buck horn bars) and go for a nice ride. I mainly ride out in the country but decided to drift into the outter edges of Noblesville while ridding. I'm cruising along SR238 towards SR37 and notice to my right a pick up truck wanting to merge into traffic and I also notice a bit further a white car (opposite direction) wanting to do the same thing. I keep my eyes shifting from the truck to the car constantly and for some reason I slid 3 fingers from each hand onto to controls while my thumb and forefingers stay on the grips. I then shift my eyes and head to look at the truck cause its the hazard thats closest, I notice he stays put, BUT the car decided to pull out when I'm approximately 600' away from him. Actually it was 2 kids and they decided I wasn't there. I had to slam on my clutch, and both brakes to avoid any contact. Drifting to the right was not an option that I saw that quickly. By the time I almost make contact the driver decides to speed up. I'm sure its because they finally hear me blasting my horn. This is my FIRST near miss. I finally down shifted to second and very shaken and kept ridding a safe distance from that car.

My point to this story is that I once read a GSR member on here saying how he always rides with a couple of fingers on the clutch and brake and the rest of his fingers on the grips. When I read that I thought that it would indeed cut down on reaction time and so I have developed that habit and without noticing I did use it with out thinking about it.

So here is a BIG THANKS to the GSR member that suggested that!!

[Larry D]

That may be your first close call....but, it won't be the last. I'm glad you were prepared and being attentive.

This site is good for much, much more than wrenching !!

[sscott]

Thanks Larry and I'm sure you are correct. THe one thing no one ever told me was when it happens what happens next.

I was so shook up I rode a couple more miles to the VP, pulled in parked removed my helmet and shook for about 30 mins.

[steve murdoch]

A great test with a passing grade for you AND nobody got hurt.
Somebody here has the line in their avatar.."remember, they are all trying to kill you".
Nice escape, sscott.

[TheCafeKid]

Good Job! My only other suggestion would hav been to down shift the moment your "spidey senses" kicked up. This way you would have had the benifit of compression brakeing (also called tranny brakeing or engine braking) to aid in stopping you faster and possibly even avoiding this incident being as close as it was. Compression braking in my opinion is one of the best and most effective tools in a riders arsenal, not only for stopping but also for going faster! It goes a long way in aiding proper set up and entry speed for corners, keeping the revs up not only keeps the bike centered between it's base but helps keep it balanced and prevents you from " free wheeling " too hot into corners and having to adjust your speed and line with brakes which is a general no no when you're heeled over. Remember too that as a rider if something gets your hair up and feels wrong it probably is. Your intuition is also a very good ally in the battle against moron cagers. Take this in in incident and learn from it. Keep that little bit of fear in the back of your mind for it serves to keep you alive. But DONT let it overcome you. Again great job and it only
becomes more of second nature.

[Redman]

...........
................My point to this story is that I once read a GSR member on here saying how he always rides with a couple of fingers on the clutch and brake and the rest of his fingers on the grips. When I read that I thought that it would indeed cut down on reaction time and so I have developed that habit and without noticing I did use it with out thinking about it.

So here is a BIG THANKS to the GSR member that suggested that!!

scott,

Good that you reacted as you did. Even with multiple hazards to keep an eye on.

I too made a habit of riding with two fingers on clutch and brake lever. Did that for years and years. Then I took MSF class with my son. Man, the instructors really kept after me about some "bad habits" I had, fingers on clutch and brake being one of them. Eventually He pulled me off the course and asked me why I did that, and I told him pretty much about the same as what you said and I quoted the Hurt Report (from like 1980). "Oh, okay", the instructor says "but that is not what we teach and that will cause points to be deducted in the test." They wanted all fingers on grip and then all fingers on the lever. SO that is what I did - for the class. They did break me of my other "bad habits" but I have reverted back to covering the brake and clutch with two fingers.

Maybe thier concern is that in a panic that may squeeze lever onto the other fingers and not get the other fingers out to help with the braking. BUt I dont think so.

And I too do downshift at first concern for a traffic hazard and get all fingers on levers, and maybe flash headlight hi/low a couple times. And watch the cars front wheel as that is where can first see movement and get idea if just drifting or if accelerating, also see which way is steering. Watch the driver and the front wheel, but watch the front wheel more.

Thanks for sharing.

.

.

[salty_monk]

Engine braking doesn't make you stop any faster... the rear brake on a GS can easily overcome the traction available at the rear wheel without the benefit of engine braking especially with all the weight being thrown forward. Engine braking is just an additional brake on the rear wheel (don't believe me.. try it without a chain & see how much brake you get....)

Down shifting could be a good idea as you would be in the powerband in case you needed to throttle out of the problem... also slowing down & giving the idiots some room rather than just covering your brakes would have helped.

[DanTheMan]

scott,

Good that you reacted as you did. Even with multiple hazards to keep an eye on.

I too made a habit of riding with two fingers on clutch and brake lever. Did that for years and years. Then I took MSF class with my son. Man, the instructors really kept after me about some "bad habits" I had, fingers on clutch and brake being one of them. Eventually He pulled me off the course and asked me why I did that, and I told him pretty much about the same as what you said and I quoted the Hurt Report (from like 1980). "Oh, okay", the instructor says "but that is not what we teach and that will cause points to be deducted in the test." They wanted all fingers on grip and then all fingers on the lever. SO that is what I did - for the class. They did break me of my other "bad habits" but I have reverted back to covering the brake and clutch with two fingers.

Maybe thier concern is that in a panic that may squeeze lever onto the other fingers and not get the other fingers out to help with the braking. BUt I dont think so.

And I too do downshift at first concern for a traffic hazard and get all fingers on levers, and maybe flash headlight hi/low a couple times. And watch the cars front wheel as that is where can first see movement and get idea if just drifting or if accelerating, also see which way is steering. Watch the driver and the front wheel, but watch the front wheel more.

Thanks for sharing.
.

.

The whole concern over using one or two fingers versus all four is the fact that sometimes a finger can be trapped under the lever, either pinching that finger or not allowing full brake or clutch action in the heat of the moment. Riding with brake and clutch covered isn't a bad idea in heavy traffic, but you have to remember not to have any pressure on the brake handle or your brake lights will be lit constantly and nobody behind you will know when you're actually applying the brakes (similar to the left foot braker syndrome).
I know track racers and off road riders use one or two fingers on the levers all the time, but take a look at the length of the levers.....they're shortened for that purpose and the brake and clutch systems are tuned to a light touch for maximum braking, quick clutch action, etc. They're also in a totally different situation than road riding.

[waterman]

scott,

Good that you reacted as you did. Even with multiple hazards to keep an eye on.

I too made a habit of riding with two fingers on clutch and brake lever. Did that for years and years. Then I took MSF class with my son. Man, the instructors really kept after me about some "bad habits" I had, fingers on clutch and brake being one of them. Eventually He pulled me off the course and asked me why I did that, and I told him pretty much about the same as what you said and I quoted the Hurt Report (from like 1980). "Oh, okay", the instructor says "but that is not what we teach and that will cause points to be deducted in the test." They wanted all fingers on grip and then all fingers on the lever. SO that is what I did - for the class. They did break me of my other "bad habits" but I have reverted back to covering the brake and clutch with two fingers.

Maybe thier concern is that in a panic that may squeeze lever onto the other fingers and not get the other fingers out to help with the braking. BUt I dont think so.

And I too do downshift at first concern for a traffic hazard and get all fingers on levers, and maybe flash headlight hi/low a couple times. And watch the cars front wheel as that is where can first see movement and get idea if just drifting or if accelerating, also see which way is steering. Watch the driver and the front wheel, but watch the front wheel more.

Thanks for sharing.

.

.

Sscott, glad you were okay, whenever traffic flow changes, you have to be paying attention. It sounds like you gained some experience from others, this is a great since we can learn from other mistakes as well as our own.

Redman, I also had the pleasure of being corrected about my habit of wrapping fingers around the brake lever at MSF. I generally only use two fingers for braking and don't think the lever would get close to smashing fingers before front brake is near lockup. It is a little shorter in reach since I have a cruise control throttle lock that positions my lever inward.

The brake light hardly activates when braking anyway, I have it adjusted to come on as soon as possible, yet takes a fair amount of travel to get it to trigger light. This winter when I upgrade to stainless lines, Honda F3 rotors, and Kawasaki binders, then I will use the Kaw master cylinder with the integrated pressure switch for brake lights. Then I am sure 2 fingers will be able to lock.

[sscott]

salty_monk
also slowing down & giving the idiots some room rather than just covering your brakes would have helped.

I might have misunderstood, but are you suggesting a rider slow down to give more room at any intersection when the rider has the right of way? I understand giving and making more room for safety sake and I always ride with at least 2-3 seconds behind the vehicle in front of me. But I had the right of way and was not demanding of my space on the road. I was just cruising as any other driver would be car, truck or bike. I feel that if I slow down to give more room to the others I could get hit from behind from the moron cagers behind me. Again, did I misunderstand what was ment here?

[tkent02]

I feel that if I slow down to give more room to the others I could get hit from behind from the moron cagers behind me.

Every scenario is different, what I am picturing reading about this incident is certainly different than what you were picturing while you wrote it.
Slow down, speed up, whatever it takes to change the timing of this event so he does not want to hit you, whether he sees you or not. That's the biggest safety feature on a motorcycle, the ability to change speed quickly, either way. Use it. If you are worried about slowing down with some guy behind you, slow him down early.

[gs scott]

Finger Position? Attitude is safer

What works for me is
1. Assume everyone is trying to kill you.
2. Assume nobody sees you.
3. Every intersection, every joining of streets, driveways, parking lots, whatever, EXPECT some idiot to pull out of it without seeing you. Same for left turns across the road in front of you... I don't keep my fingers on the levers as a habit or resting spot - I shift to that position because I'm mentally and actively preparing to maneauver

Depending on the speed you're carrying - Bikes don't really stop that well. Yes, you can jump on the binders and they'll slow you pretty well, but I don't mentally plan on stopping to avoid an incident if I'm carrying any significant speed. Bikes ARE pretty maneuverable, so the habit to keep is an escape path.

So depending on the speed you're carrying, escape options available, road conditions, traffic conditions... it's your life, you adjust your speed accordingly. You better believe this is a heads up game! And keep your bike (tires especially) in top shape too! I've gotton the shakes more times than I can count on both my hands - and I've slowed down over the years!

[Octain]

I always assume Im invisable.

Good job!