Ducati Cucciolo

[Guest]

Maybe plated steel? Not sure what they used for wet clutches in the 40's

Yeah it's probably hiding on the mailing list somewhere if I look for it.

Oh, and the oiling on this is interesting... it's a splash system! You may have noticed there's no such thing as an oil pump and no sump as such, so you fill it to just below the filler hole and the rotation of the gears splashes oil around to keep things oily...

[surviverguy]

Back into it tonight, and I got as far as splitting the cases.

Sorry for the horrid photos, but I had to deal with some dodgy screws and I'll be replacing them all before putting it back together:





Stuck all the screws in some cardboard so I know where they belong, although as it turns out all but two are identical:



And I have no idea why but these two have a raised head and two perpendicular holes going through them:



And the case cover taken off the left side:





And no caged roller bearings here!





Got those rollers cleaned up and in some engine oil to preserve them until they need to go back in:



Next I need to delve into the workshop manual and work out how to proceed from here without damaging anything.

I'd guess those two screws with the perpendicular holes use mechanic's wire to lock them in place....

[surviverguy]

It won't have the zippy responce of the 450 when you "twisty da throttle" but fuel econmy should be great. The nostalgia factor, antique, and rareness are top notch. Nice tear down. I'm subscribed and looking forward to the build and first run!

[Mark Harrop]

I'd guess those two screws with the perpendicular holes use mechanic's wire to lock them in place....

Yep....safety wire. Twist them so they are both pulling clockwise (tightening) against each other. It will look more like a race bike!

[Guest]

I'd guess those two screws with the perpendicular holes use mechanic's wire to lock them in place....

Thanks for reminding me! I'd completely forgot about them but I found the answer!

They're actually where the Ducati factory threaded some wire through with a seal so they could see if anyone had tampered with it during the warranty period.

Wonder if I can find what the seal looked like for when it's back together? Now that would be an "authentic" touch! haha

It won't have the zippy responce of the 450 when you "twisty da throttle" but fuel econmy should be great. The nostalgia factor, antique, and rareness are top notch. Nice tear down. I'm subscribed and looking forward to the build and first run!

Cool... it's certainly a whole different world to the 450... and yeah I certainly expect to see some good economy out of it

Yep....safety wire. Twist them so they are both pulling clockwise (tightening) against each other. It will look more like a race bike!

Hahahahhaha you know they did make race bikes with this engine... now that'd be scary! Haha

[rustybronco]

They're actually where the Ducati factory threaded some wire through with a seal so they could see if anyone had tampered with it during the warranty period.

Wonder if I can find what the seal looked like for when it's back together? Now that would be an "authentic" touch! haha

Similar to this with a Ducati stamp on it I suspect?

http://www.seals.com/info-wire-seals-lws.asp

[Guest]

Similar to this with a Ducati stamp on it I suspect?
http://www.seals.com/info-wire-seals-lws.asp

I reckon you'd be right Dale! Don't know that I'd need 100 of them though

[Guest]

Winner!

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&&item=130713345440

It's apparently 1940's frame and forks and I'd guess handlebars but has modern wheels etc. For $61 I reckon it's worth the gamble compared to the others on eBay that seem to be $150 and upwards regardless of condition...

A good start though and I should be able to pick it up next week as the guy is away for work this weekend.

[surviverguy]

That's a very modern looking frame. I wouldn't have guessed that it was from the forties. Don't forget to get some brakes! You're gonna need good stopping power with all the "get up and go" you're building. What color will it become? Where will the stripes go?

[Guest]

That's a very modern looking frame. I wouldn't have guessed that it was from the forties. Don't forget to get some brakes! You're gonna need good stopping power with all the "get up and go" you're building. What color will it become? Where will the stripes go?

Yeah apparently that's how Malvern Star did it back then... not as flamboyant as an Italian frame of the same era that's for sure!

From what I can see around the traps, the frame looks like it will be genuine '40's but I'm questioning the forks as I believe they should have an embossed star at the top of each leg like on the headstock. Wheels/hubs/pedals are definitely modern, not sure about the handlebars.

And yes, will definitely need some brakes! 40mph top speed... hahaha

No idea on colour yet but if they had no stripes post WWII then she ain't gettin' stripes... this one's going to be as "authentic" as I can get...

[surviverguy]

Will the final drive allow you to add pedal power for climbing steep hills or pedal power only in stealth mode or for when fuel runs out?

[Guest]

This part replaces the standard right side pedal crank and you can see the teeth inside:



It drives the counter sprocket on the drive shaft shown here:



There is a separate sprocket on the drive shaft that drives the chain to the rear sprocket on the rear wheel.

So, when the engine is running, you don't have to pedal as the counter sprocket will free wheel, but if the engine is stopped or in neutral, you can pedal and drive the chain.

Here's the guts of the counter sprocket, sort of like the starter clutch on the Suzukis:

[cdnoel]

Wow

All I can say is WOW! You got this from your Dad? Geepers! As a colector of motorcycles ,just getting started, I've kicked around the idea of getting one of these. They are in fact the very first Ducati's. So far, I have determined that if I ever want to own one I'll have to send some guy in Brasil gobs of cash and hope he doesn't just keep it. If I do get something in the mail it surely won't be a compleet motor.

[Guest]

All I can say is WOW! You got this from your Dad? Geepers! As a colector of motorcycles ,just getting started, I've kicked around the idea of getting one of these. They are in fact the very first Ducati's. So far, I have determined that if I ever want to own one I'll have to send some guy in Brasil gobs of cash and hope he doesn't just keep it. If I do get something in the mail it surely won't be a compleet motor.

Yeah it's pretty cool to have "landed" in my lap so to speak. Not sure how my dad came to have one lying around...

If you're in the vicinity of the Barber museum, I believe they have a vintage festival each year and it looks like some of the guys from the Ducati Pushrod mailing list are in attendance there, so you should be able to get a look see at them in person.

As for getting your hands on one, yes they come up on eBay now and then but aren't cheap and tend to be in far off places...

So far I've only seen one other in person and that was at the Australian Motorcycle Museum where our GSR run ended up last week. It was a T1 or Siata though, which is earlier than this one.

The first was the Siata, the second the Cucciolo T1, and this is the T2 which is the third generation, but essentially all still the first motorcycle engine Ducati made...

[Guest]

I finished pulling the clutch apart tonight as far as I need to and cleaned it up.





The oil on the plates has to be old... like 40 or 50 years I reckon. It's yellow and not so oily and smells wrong to me, so I gave the plates a good clean with the kerosene and will soak in fresh engine oil when it's time for them to go back in.

They all look used but in serviceable condition:





I wired them up in the right order so they can go back together in the same order they've bedded in and this way I know which way is up and down also.



I didn't see an easy way to fully dismantle the clutch assembly but I also don't see a need to as it cleaned up pretty well:



Then I pulled out the other bits and pieces that were lying loose in the crate:



Gave them all a good clean in the kero, but those spark plugs are very well used so won't be going back in.

The spanner has surface rust but is serviceable.

Two of the clutch plates look ok but the other three have surface rust also.



The spring is probably from a control cable and there's a threaded cable adjuster there as well.

I'm not sure what the round cover is for.



I believe this part attaches the crank that turns the counter sprocket onto the pedal crank: