Custom Painting Question(s)

[Schweisshund]

In my "Jack of all trades" life, I was also once a professional housepainter. I am pretty good too as this was a family profession that started with my great great grandfather in Kentucky. I was "weened" on home remodeling from my father. However, painting metal is a whole different ballgame and I do realize this fully.

I am looking at "House of Color" paints but am having trouble finding the products outside of the Wal-Mart toy model section. I realize that talking to a professional custom painter, the two best paints to use are PPG or House of Color.

The thing that I like about the Wal-Mart toy model section is that the House of Color paint is sold in small 1/2 pint containers for $3.00 each. :-D

This paint is for metal models - anyone familiar with what I am talking about? - and this is automotive grade paint sold at toy prices. I can buy enough of this paint for a motorcycle in small increments instead of getting a pint or gallon of it.

Also - for txironhead - the best paint strainer I have come across is women's pantyhose.

[Schweisshund]

I meant to spell it "House of Kolor" .... sorry for that. If you google it spelled like that it will direct you right to their home page.

[txironhead]

Also - for txironhead - the best paint strainer I have come across is women's pantyhose.

Ah, yes, I've used that before, but if you don't remember to ask her for her old pair with runs and just grab any pair out of the drawer, it can get VERY expensive indeed........

[Schweisshund]

As soon as I get my scanner working again, I'll post some pics of my "spray bomb" Shadow. It looked like a pro job and lasted at least seven months before I sold it with no fading, discoloration, etc. I know catalyzed paint is more durable and produces better results, but there is something to be said for us poor guys. And yes, I told the buyer it was a spray paint job, he didn't believe me.

Yes, please post pics of this. I have no idea what a spray bomb is.

[txironhead]

Spray bomb is slang for spray paint.

[rickt]

More Paint Info

Just a couple of additional comments and I'll let it rest. In the days before catalyzed paints became available, lacquer was the product of choice - easy to spray, color sand, polish, repair, etc. lacquer is a simple mixture of solvent, pigments (color), and resin (the glue that holds the pigments together). The toxicity of lacquer-based products is rather minimal and many painters sprayed with no breathing protection. Unfortunately, the solvents used to formulate lacquer (often called VOCs or volatile organic compounds) are quite unkind to our environment. They tend to destroy things like the ozone layer. As far as I know, lacquer-based products are banned from commercial use in most if not all states. Of course you can still pick up the typical "spray bomb" at the local hardware or auto supply store.

Now, with catalyzed paints, the toxicity risk is dramatically greater. Certainly in a high-flow air booth, the majority of fumes are eliminated before the painter has a chance to inhale them. But, the painter will inhale a certain amount, no mattter how efficient the spray booth. We must keep in mind that the effects of these chemicals can be, and usually are, cumulative which means a little this time added to a little the next time the painter works and so on. Probably not a big deal for the hobbyist who is painting a bike tank and a couple of fenders. To the question of determining when a dangerous level is reached - impossible to predict. Each individual will react differently to exposure. I have heard of individuals who had one exposure to isocyantes and at the next exposure experienced an incredibly painful reaction similar to an allergic response. If you're really curious about toxicity, go to a paint manufactuer's website and look for a product MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet). This will provide a host of toxicity information, but interpretation will be very difficult since all of the tox studies are carried out with animal models. What it does say is that these chemicals are toxic and should be handled with great care.

Yes, I've used a cannister mask when spraying a couple of small items. As long as the cartridges are fresh and the mask fits correctly, the risk is low. When I moved up to a car, I felt the fresh air system was a requirement.

If we have any readers who remember the Union Carbide disaster many years ago in Bohbal India, the chemical that was released into the atmosphere was methyl isocyanate. The same class of chemical that is found in catalyzed paints. Many thousands died and many many more suffered servere neuological damage. Basecoat normally does not contain isocyanates - epoxy-based primers are higher on the risk scale - and finally clears are the worst.

I don't intend to scare anyone with all this mumo-jumbo, but the user at the very least needs to be aware of the risks. It's an individual's decision on how much risk to take.

rickt

[txironhead]

So what about the "low-tox" Paint Shop series of enamels that Dupli-Color just came out with?

[rickt]

I am not familar with this product. If I have a chance over the weekend, I'll try to investigate.

rickt

[txironhead]

http://www.duplicolor.com/products/paintshop.html

Here's the link to get ya started. Curious minds want to know!

[Schweisshund]

thanks for that link txironhead :-D reading up on it now

[Schweisshund]

Does this sound right?

I have a friend who used to paint automotives professionally. He told me that he would strip off the old paint by sandblasting or aircraft stripper and get to the bare metal. He would then use bondo where needed - sand again. Clean then apply clearcoat first (???) Then he would apply the primer, base coat (4-5 coats) then 2 coats of clear.

Why would he apply clearcoat first? He also said he would use a water supply of some sort (garden hose) and leave it trickling to capture the paint dust that accumulated on the floor.

[Schweisshund]

For RickT

What would be your recommendation for safety precautions for the garage mechanics?

Examples : What type of mask - brandname? How often should filters be replaced? What type of airflow -Fans?

Even though many who read this may already know certain safety precautions for custom painting - I am a babe in the woods - and others are as well. It would be nice to have a detailed list of safety precautions for this task.

Thanks in advance.

[txironhead]

I know that the safety precautions vary according to what you're spraying. Enamel, laquer, epoxy-based, etc.

Anyone feel free to answer his question, but I'll up the ante: What specifically do you need to spray Imron? I've sprayed it before with just a charcoal filter, but it was in a really large aircraft hanger.

I've also toyed with the idea of building a small downdraft booth, big enough to spray a motorcycle frame and tins. Could a fresh air system be rigged (I know I'm about to get chewed out for this) by using exterior vents, exhaust fans from a computer case to circulate the air, large ID tubing and a gas mask? You'd basically be breathing the same air that's outside the building, and you could even incorporate an A/C filter for dust.

BTW, I've sprayed a car with enamel using a compressor made out of an old automotive A/C compressor, washing machine motor, and a pressure tank from god knows where. Redneck engineering at it's finest!

Also, a good online source for painting supplies (masks, suits, etc.) would be greatly appreciated.

[Nessism]

3M sells a nice disposable spray mask that has two filter cartridges. I can't varify but one other person in this thread stated they last for about 8 hours of actual spray time which sounds about right to me. Keep it in the included zip closed pouch between uses.

[rustybronco]

Anyone feel free to answer his question, but I'll up the ante: What specifically do you need to spray Imron? I've sprayed it before with just a charcoal filter, but it was in a really large aircraft hanger.

A friend of mine swore on using Imron, painted at home in his garage using just a charcoal mask, covered his body with long sleeve shirt and pants, sprayed it all the time.
he's still alive and kicking to this day. credentials? Jack Roush's 1969 boss 429, Edsel? Ford's gt40 though it was just a touch-up with a brush (somewhere I've got pictures) lots of pro-stock cars, restos...aara cuda's, drag pack torinos, a few retractable t-birds, shelbys and many many more.
I don't think the hobbyist needs to worry when taking proper precautions.

in answer to your question, a fresh air system would be the way to go.