C
c&c
Guest
Any ideas?
-
Required reading for all forum users!!!
Welcome!
Register to access the full functionality of the GSResources forum. Until you register and activate your account you will not have full forum access, nor will you be able to post or reply to messages.A note to new registrants...
All new forum registrations must be activated via email before you have full access to the forum.A Special Note about Email accounts!
DO NOT SIGN UP USING hotmail, outlook, gmx, sbcglobal, att, bellsouth or email.com. They delete our forum signup emails.A note to old forum members...
I receive numerous requests from people who can no longer log in because their accounts were deleted. As mentioned in the forum FAQ, user accounts are deleted if you haven't logged in for the past 6 months. If you can't log in, then create a new forum account. If you don't get an error message, then check your email account for an activation message. If you get a message stating that the email address is already in use, then your account still exists so follow the instructions in the forum FAQ for resetting your password.Have you forgotten your password or have a new email address? Then read the forum FAQ for details on how to reset it.
Any email requests for "can't log in anymore" problems or "lost my password" problems will be deleted. Read the forum FAQ and follow the instructions there - that's what we have one for...
-
Returning Visitors
If you are a returning visitor who never received your confirmation email, then odds are your email provider is blockinig emails from our server. The only thing that can be done to get around this is you will have to try creating another forum account using an email address from another domain.
If you are a returning visitor to the forum and can't log in using your old forum name and password but used to be able to then chances are your account is deleted. Purges of the databases are done regularly. You will have to create a new forum account and you should be all set.
G
GateKeeper
Guest
none...
but what have you done lately to the bike, clean the carbs, new O rings etc, was it running before or not, something change, or was it like this from day one ?
the more you tell, the more we can help
.
but what have you done lately to the bike, clean the carbs, new O rings etc, was it running before or not, something change, or was it like this from day one ?
the more you tell, the more we can help
.
K
koolaid_kid
Guest
Yes. If you found anything in the fuel bowls at all, then a complete rebuild is in order. Ed (Nessism) wrote a tutorial on the process. He has a link in his signature and Cliff has one on his web page. Main ingredients include Berryman's carb dip, a set of o-rings from cycleorings.com, and a set of fuel bowl gaskets. Assorted tools, a six pack of your favorite carbonated beverage, etc. helps as well.
K
Katarat
Guest
Are the slides lifting in the carbs ?
C
c&c
Guest
U must have read my other post.
Yes I did find junk in the bowls. I will have to do a tear down rebuild.
I just found a page on 4 stroke card tuning which was very easy to read.
http://www.4strokes.com/tech/4sjetting.asp
So what I understood was there are 3 jets. Idle - Mid - high.
And to know when to switch jets is when your adjustment screw is ether 2 turns or 1 turn. 2 switch higher 1 switch lower.
SO I have a 1981 GS1100E 16valves with pods and a 4 in one.
Before jetting should I start with the Air intake tuning?
My goal is to get her going so I can ride her a bit. After that I will iron out her kinks.
K
koolaid_kid
Guest
Yes, I did read the other post, just thought I would bring it up here, since apparently some others did not read it.
The first thing to do is the carb rebuild. When you start tearing everything apart, check the jets. With those mods a jet kit is pretty much required and may already be installed. I have been pleased with my DynoJet Stage 3 kit, but others are available.
Ed's tutorial will walk you through everything. There is also a jetting using plug chops on Cliff's site. I used this one: Jetting CV Carbs
You are mostly correct, there are 3 stages. First you dial in the main, then the needle height, then the pilot jet. The fuel bowl height can also aid in fine tuning the pilot.
When to change the pilot is debatable. As long as the air mixture screw can dial you in, I am not sure why you would want to change it. While it is much easier with pods, it is still a pain to swap them out.
The first thing to do is the carb rebuild. When you start tearing everything apart, check the jets. With those mods a jet kit is pretty much required and may already be installed. I have been pleased with my DynoJet Stage 3 kit, but others are available.
Ed's tutorial will walk you through everything. There is also a jetting using plug chops on Cliff's site. I used this one: Jetting CV Carbs
You are mostly correct, there are 3 stages. First you dial in the main, then the needle height, then the pilot jet. The fuel bowl height can also aid in fine tuning the pilot.
When to change the pilot is debatable. As long as the air mixture screw can dial you in, I am not sure why you would want to change it. While it is much easier with pods, it is still a pain to swap them out.
C
c&c
Guest
The previous owner bought a DynoJet kit but I do not know which one.
I will remove the carb tonight. Look at the jets and post back the markings / part numbers I see.
Can you tell my how junk got in the fuel bowl? Did it come from petcock?
When in the prime position is it a free flow or does it still get filtered?
I also would like to know which rebuild kit I should get. Minus the Jets since I might already have the correct ones and if not I will order the DynoJet stage 3.
I will remove the carb tonight. Look at the jets and post back the markings / part numbers I see.
Can you tell my how junk got in the fuel bowl? Did it come from petcock?
When in the prime position is it a free flow or does it still get filtered?
I also would like to know which rebuild kit I should get. Minus the Jets since I might already have the correct ones and if not I will order the DynoJet stage 3.
G
GateKeeper
Guest
if your petcock does not have the screen or a damaged one, junk will get into the bowls, probably stuff from the inside of the tank.
if your petcock has the filter and in good shape it don't matter what position it's in, it will get filtered first.
no rebuild kits, just get all the O rings from www.cycleorings.com and get new bowl gaskets if need be, get the intake O rings as well at cycleorings, take apart the carbs, dip for 24 hours clean out all the jets, unless your getting new ones, and put it all back together.....
that's it
if your petcock has the filter and in good shape it don't matter what position it's in, it will get filtered first.
no rebuild kits, just get all the O rings from www.cycleorings.com and get new bowl gaskets if need be, get the intake O rings as well at cycleorings, take apart the carbs, dip for 24 hours clean out all the jets, unless your getting new ones, and put it all back together.....
that's it
C
c&c
Guest
Awh man! I will have to empty my gas tank again and take a look at the petcock.
Will I need to get a new petcock gasket?
Will I need to get a new petcock gasket?
B
BassCliff
Guest
Hi,
How many of the following have been properly addressed?
These are some edited quotes from one of our dear beloved gurus, Mr. bwringer, with ideas on basic needs (depending on initial condition), parts, and accessories.
***********Quoted from Mr. bwringer************
Every GS850 [and most other models] has (or had) a set of well-known issues that MUST be addressed before you have a solid baseline for further troubleshooting. It's a vintage bike, and it's quite common (as in, every single GS850 I have had contact with) that there are multiple problems that have crept up and slowly gotten worse over the years. It's not like a newer vehicle, where there's generally one problem at a time.
These common issues are:
1. Intake O-rings (install NEW OEM or Viton only - common nitrile O-rings will quickly deteriorate from heat)
2. Intake Boots (install NEW -- these cannot be repaired)
3. Valve clearances (more important than most people think)
4. Carb/airbox boots
5. Airbox sealing
6. Air filter sealing
7. Petcock (install a NEW one)
8. On '79 models, install new points or Dyna electronic ignition (or at least verify that the old points are working correctly)
9. On all models, it's fairly common to have problems with the spark plug caps. These are $3 or $4 each, and often worth replacing if you're keeping the stock coils/wires.
10. Stock exhaust with NO leaks or holes -- good seals at the head and at the junctions underneath.
What I have noticed at the rallies is that very, very few 850Gs are actually running right. Make VERY sure it's actually running the way it's supposed to before busting out the modifications.
Brian's E-Z and fun plan for GS850 happiness:
1) Seal the airbox and air filter with weatherstripping.
2) Ensure no intake leaks. Spraying WD-40 or water doesn't tell you much, since very small air leaks can cause problems even though they won't suck in enough WD-40 to make a difference. Replace your intake boot o-rings and boots if needed, and seriously consider spending the lousy $28 for new airbox/carb boots.
3) Ensure clean carbs with correct settings, new o-rings, and original OEM jets. No, not just squirted with something. I mean completely disassembled.
4) Check/adjust valve clearances (Manual calls for every 4,000 miles. This is not optional.)
5) Ensure healthy electrical system.
6) Seriously consider upgrading coils and plug wires.
7) Install new, stock NGK B8-ES plugs gapped to .031".
8 ) Fine-tune float height and idle mixture screw to ensure best off-idle transition.
9) Clean air filter and reinstall with only the lightest oil mist -- over-oiling and/or letting the filter get dirty is a common and critical mistake, and will make the bike run funny at low speeds and run rich. This may take a few tries.
10) Make sure the exhaust seals are sealing.
11) Ooh, much better now, huh? You're gonna need upgraded suspension - Progressive or better fork springs and shocks. Set suspension sag appropriately.
12) Upgrade brakes with new pads and stainless lines to deal with all that extra speed.
13) Install new petcock, since I'm going to head to the roof with a rifle if I have to read about yet another #2 plug fouling and failed hillbilly attempts to rebuild the petcock and/or deny there's a problem.
14) Oh yeah -- check compression somewhere in there to ensure the valves and rings are reasonably healthy.
15) You'll probably need new OEM clutch springs -- the clutches last forever, but the springs get tired after 20 years or so under pressure. E-Z and cheap.
***************End Quote****************
You will find most of the procedures documented on my little website.
And don't forget... New Members, CLICK HERE!!
Thank you for your indulgence,
BassCliff
How many of the following have been properly addressed?
These are some edited quotes from one of our dear beloved gurus, Mr. bwringer, with ideas on basic needs (depending on initial condition), parts, and accessories.
***********Quoted from Mr. bwringer************
Every GS850 [and most other models] has (or had) a set of well-known issues that MUST be addressed before you have a solid baseline for further troubleshooting. It's a vintage bike, and it's quite common (as in, every single GS850 I have had contact with) that there are multiple problems that have crept up and slowly gotten worse over the years. It's not like a newer vehicle, where there's generally one problem at a time.
These common issues are:
1. Intake O-rings (install NEW OEM or Viton only - common nitrile O-rings will quickly deteriorate from heat)
2. Intake Boots (install NEW -- these cannot be repaired)
3. Valve clearances (more important than most people think)
4. Carb/airbox boots
5. Airbox sealing
6. Air filter sealing
7. Petcock (install a NEW one)
8. On '79 models, install new points or Dyna electronic ignition (or at least verify that the old points are working correctly)
9. On all models, it's fairly common to have problems with the spark plug caps. These are $3 or $4 each, and often worth replacing if you're keeping the stock coils/wires.
10. Stock exhaust with NO leaks or holes -- good seals at the head and at the junctions underneath.
What I have noticed at the rallies is that very, very few 850Gs are actually running right. Make VERY sure it's actually running the way it's supposed to before busting out the modifications.
Brian's E-Z and fun plan for GS850 happiness:
1) Seal the airbox and air filter with weatherstripping.
2) Ensure no intake leaks. Spraying WD-40 or water doesn't tell you much, since very small air leaks can cause problems even though they won't suck in enough WD-40 to make a difference. Replace your intake boot o-rings and boots if needed, and seriously consider spending the lousy $28 for new airbox/carb boots.
3) Ensure clean carbs with correct settings, new o-rings, and original OEM jets. No, not just squirted with something. I mean completely disassembled.
4) Check/adjust valve clearances (Manual calls for every 4,000 miles. This is not optional.)
5) Ensure healthy electrical system.
6) Seriously consider upgrading coils and plug wires.
7) Install new, stock NGK B8-ES plugs gapped to .031".
8 ) Fine-tune float height and idle mixture screw to ensure best off-idle transition.
9) Clean air filter and reinstall with only the lightest oil mist -- over-oiling and/or letting the filter get dirty is a common and critical mistake, and will make the bike run funny at low speeds and run rich. This may take a few tries.
10) Make sure the exhaust seals are sealing.
11) Ooh, much better now, huh? You're gonna need upgraded suspension - Progressive or better fork springs and shocks. Set suspension sag appropriately.
12) Upgrade brakes with new pads and stainless lines to deal with all that extra speed.
13) Install new petcock, since I'm going to head to the roof with a rifle if I have to read about yet another #2 plug fouling and failed hillbilly attempts to rebuild the petcock and/or deny there's a problem.
14) Oh yeah -- check compression somewhere in there to ensure the valves and rings are reasonably healthy.
15) You'll probably need new OEM clutch springs -- the clutches last forever, but the springs get tired after 20 years or so under pressure. E-Z and cheap.
***************End Quote****************
You will find most of the procedures documented on my little website.
And don't forget... New Members, CLICK HERE!!
Thank you for your indulgence,
BassCliff
C
c&c
Guest
BassCliff I'm organizing my self, mostly digesting all the things I need to know befor I do anything. Parts to order, tools to get.
I read your other post. I had forgot about those lists.
I'm reading "Top 10 Newbie Mistakes" because I do not want to be a noob for long
TO answer your question "How many of the following have been properly addressed?" None yet.:-\\\
I read your other post. I had forgot about those lists.
I'm reading "Top 10 Newbie Mistakes" because I do not want to be a noob for long
TO answer your question "How many of the following have been properly addressed?" None yet.:-\\\
Last edited:
C
cableguy
Guest
It's a lot to get your head wrapped around, but the sooner you establish your baseline of maintenance the better. I'll bet most of your issues will disappear just completing the list. For instance, you can try to fix a bad idle or poor acceleration issues all day long and never get it right if the valves are out of adjustment or one single o-ring is bad in the carbs. Good luck!
C
c&c
Guest
I know the previous owner rebuilt the carbs but I can not be 100% sure he did a perfect job.
Should I do a complete tear down and rebuild to be 100% sure it's done the proper way?
Besides if junk was found in the bows who knows what has been blocked and I will get to learn about the carb internals and be able to picture mentally what's happening in there.
I thin I just answered my own question...
Should I do a complete tear down and rebuild to be 100% sure it's done the proper way?
Besides if junk was found in the bows who knows what has been blocked and I will get to learn about the carb internals and be able to picture mentally what's happening in there.
I thin I just answered my own question...
Last edited:
A
AJ
Guest
The GS1100 engine will idle pretty well with only two cylinders running (amazing!), it only needs to have the idle screw give it enough throttle to keep it idling. However, the engine won't spin up if the pilot jets on one or more carbs are clogged, and this is very likely.
You do have the pod air filters installed, correct? If they are the oil type, take a rag and blot out as much oil as you can or remove them and see if that helps.
You do have the pod air filters installed, correct? If they are the oil type, take a rag and blot out as much oil as you can or remove them and see if that helps.
C
c&c
Guest
I had seen the Carbtune Pro. I thought it was more expensive.
That is what I will order.
Allright....
I just orderd my O-rings from cycleorings.com.
I will be ordering the following:
-Morgan Carbtune
-Morgan Colortune. 12mm. Get the 14mm colortune plug with a 12mm adapter. 14mm in a 12mm, yes it`s not logical.
-Dyna 2000 Kit : DDK3-2C* WITH 2.2 ohm COILS & FREE DW600 Wire Set http://www.dynoman.net
-Ballistic EVO2 8-Cell Lithium Battery Suzuki GS1100
-Valve cover gasket. http://www.realgaskets.com/ I got a new OEM one with the bike,.
-Oil Filter : http://www.schnitzracingstore.com/catalogs/catalog.asp?prodid=5118397&showprevnext=1
-Cylinder Compression Tester
-PetCock
To Do:
- Check the stator again but It should be good since I checked it when I picked it up and it was charging.
- Cean AirPods and oil very lightly.
- Valve adjustment. This scare me since I do not know if how I do it is ok.
- After 15 min of idling some wires started to smoke. Find and Fix bad wires.
- There is a ground from the battery to the crank case. It gets hot. Maybe should be changed with a heavier gauge.
That is what I will order.
Allright....
I just orderd my O-rings from cycleorings.com.
I will be ordering the following:
-Morgan Carbtune
-Morgan Colortune. 12mm. Get the 14mm colortune plug with a 12mm adapter. 14mm in a 12mm, yes it`s not logical.
-Dyna 2000 Kit : DDK3-2C* WITH 2.2 ohm COILS & FREE DW600 Wire Set http://www.dynoman.net
-Ballistic EVO2 8-Cell Lithium Battery Suzuki GS1100
-Valve cover gasket. http://www.realgaskets.com/ I got a new OEM one with the bike,.
-Oil Filter : http://www.schnitzracingstore.com/catalogs/catalog.asp?prodid=5118397&showprevnext=1
-Cylinder Compression Tester
-PetCock
To Do:
- Check the stator again but It should be good since I checked it when I picked it up and it was charging.
- Cean AirPods and oil very lightly.
- Valve adjustment. This scare me since I do not know if how I do it is ok.
- After 15 min of idling some wires started to smoke. Find and Fix bad wires.
- There is a ground from the battery to the crank case. It gets hot. Maybe should be changed with a heavier gauge.
Last edited:
G
Guest
Guest
Me for one, I would go back to the stock air box system. Just my opinion.
C
c&c
Guest
Got my carb dismantled. Diped the bodies in pinesol except for the brass. I used what I had on hand which was seafoam.
Bought all new o-rings.
I found 2 plugged pilot jets, the holes at the tip and 1 petrified jet plug, one crushed Piolet screw o-ring.
I have a stock motor except for the air filter pods.
The previous owner bought a Main jet kit, it is a Dynojet Stage 1-3 Jet Kit, and swapped the 107.5's for 138's
Are those the correct jets for my setup?
I also have the Dyna 2000 kit and 4 into 1 pipes.
The spark plugs have a nice black carbon coating. I guess it's normal since it was not properly tuned.
I also adjusted the valves but should I have found the TTDC then using the notches in the cam shafts for TDC before adjusting the valves?
Bought all new o-rings.
I found 2 plugged pilot jets, the holes at the tip and 1 petrified jet plug, one crushed Piolet screw o-ring.
I have a stock motor except for the air filter pods.
The previous owner bought a Main jet kit, it is a Dynojet Stage 1-3 Jet Kit, and swapped the 107.5's for 138's
Are those the correct jets for my setup?
I also have the Dyna 2000 kit and 4 into 1 pipes.
The spark plugs have a nice black carbon coating. I guess it's normal since it was not properly tuned.
I also adjusted the valves but should I have found the TTDC then using the notches in the cam shafts for TDC before adjusting the valves?
Last edited:
C
c&c
Guest
Update.
Rebuilt the carb new o-rings and all is perfect except 1 thing,
The choke does not open all the way I have to pull on it , about 5mm, and it starts better.
Can any one upload a pic of the choke linkage on their carb?
Or a solution.
Thank you.
Rebuilt the carb new o-rings and all is perfect except 1 thing,
The choke does not open all the way I have to pull on it , about 5mm, and it starts better.
Can any one upload a pic of the choke linkage on their carb?
Or a solution.
Thank you.
C
c&c
Guest
Figured out how to fix the carb issue. I'll have to bend the the 4 u-forks to the right and make sure they move all chokes at the same time. It will be just enough.
Cold starts:
With the idle screw unscrewed completely and the choke open it still does not get enough gas. It just keeps burping.
I have my screws at ~1.5 turns. How low can I go before having to change jets?
I wonder if it really does not matter since once warm I'll be using the colour tune to get a perfect burn thus what ever the number of turns that's what will be available when choke is open.
I also read to adjust the mixture between 2000 and 2500 rpm. Apparently that is the range mostly used.
I have the Dynojet Stage 1-3 Jet Kit. Swapped the 107.5's for 138's as instructed to in the install instructions.
Cold starts:
With the idle screw unscrewed completely and the choke open it still does not get enough gas. It just keeps burping.
I have my screws at ~1.5 turns. How low can I go before having to change jets?
I wonder if it really does not matter since once warm I'll be using the colour tune to get a perfect burn thus what ever the number of turns that's what will be available when choke is open.
I also read to adjust the mixture between 2000 and 2500 rpm. Apparently that is the range mostly used.
I have the Dynojet Stage 1-3 Jet Kit. Swapped the 107.5's for 138's as instructed to in the install instructions.
Last edited: