Aftermarket paint job will never be as good as the factory?

[Anonymous]

Re: Paint

Re: Paint

Steve, the guys at the body shops didn't say new paint isn't better than old paint. The point both made was that older, highly cured paint would be more resistant to gasoline. They said spilled gas would take off new "clear coat" and ruin the paint very easily. But, I guess they're BOTH just dummies.......(me, too, 'cause I figured they probably should know what they were talking about ). I always learn a lot on this fourm. :wink:

P.S. I also gathered from what they said that the reason factory paint jobs are so durable is because they employ a "baking process" that can't be duplicated by a commercial body shop. Now I'm doubting that, as well. :roll:

Yeah, I think they're pretty much wrong on both counts. Some might debate it though.

A good catylized(sp?) clear coat will resist gasoline. I just repainted my bike's tank a couple months ago, using R&M's 5100 clear. Even the area under the gas cap, around the filler neck seems unaffected by gas and gas fumes.

Most quality paint shops now have heated paint booths. They paint a car, or whatever, and then turn the heat up to around 150 degrees F. I don't know how this affects the long term durability, but it's definitely baked.

I've found that the durability of a paint job to things like the innevitable wrench drop has a lot to do with the materials used, the prep work, and the timing of applying the materials. If you spray the base coat, then wait a couple weeks to clear it for whatever reason, there's a good likelyhood the clear will delaminate from the base if it's struck. I've had the same thing happen when using a lower quality etching primer. ALWAYS use the best materials you can afford. I've been hosed in the past by paint store guys trying to make me happy by saving me some money on primers and paints. In the long run, they screwed themselves because I had bad luck with the paints and had to redo the jobs.

 

[earlfor]

Re: Paint

Re: Paint

Part of my job description for the past 25 years has been yacht paint and finish restoration. 25 year old (automotive type) paint is normally very resistant to gasoline and other chemicals. The new multipart, catalyzed paint systems are also. Most of the new paints (as a rough aproximation) cure about 30% in the first 6 hours, then perhaps another 50% in the next 30 days, with the last 20% requiring 6 months. Beyond 6 months of cure time, they are more resistant than the 25 year old paint and the surface is harder. Newly painted surfaces should not be waxed for at least 30 days and only washed/wiped off with a soft rag and clear water. Final hardness and succeptability to chemicals varies with paint brand and paint base as well as with modifiers added to the paint and climatic conditions during application.

Earl

Steve, the guys at the body shops didn't say new paint isn't better than old paint. The point both made was that older, highly cured paint would be more resistant to gasoline. They said spilled gas would take off new "clear coat" and ruin the paint very easily. But, I guess they're BOTH just dummies.......(me, too, 'cause I figured they probably should know what they were talking about ). I always learn a lot on this fourm. :wink:

 

[chuckycheese]

Side covers

Side covers

Can the plastic side covers be painted as easily as the gas tank..or is there some trick to preparing and painting plastic?? :?: Thanks! :!:

 

[duaneage]

YOu have to use a bonding agent and this is not a problem. Look at all the plastic bumpers on cars nowadays.

 

[earlfor]

Yep, a bonding agent (often called adhesion agent) is probably the most simple approach. There are also some paints formulated specifically for plastics.

I have not had any problem with adhesion and durability on plastic motorcycle parts using multipart automotive type finishes. Sanding the part and applying a quality catalyzed epoxy auto primer as prep to painting has worked fine for me. Nothing tricky needed. Dupont Corlar is my favorite primer for adhesion and toughness. Corlar does not sand easily, so apply it as smoothly as you can.

Earl

YOu have to use a bonding agent and this is not a problem. Look at all the plastic bumpers on cars nowadays.

 

[Griffin]

I'm going to have to ship my parts to Reproduction Decals so they can duplicate the decals, I may just go ahead and have their recommended painter finish the job, depending upon cost. This guy also does dent removal, rust removal/refurbishing, and all prep work. A bonus is that I know that he'll know how to properly apply the decals as well.

Here's some of his work, using Repro's decals:

Before:

After:

I expect to pay somewhere between $700 -$1200 for the painting (1/2 fairing, fender, side panels, tank, tail) plus some more for a couple of dents to be removed. I've been quoted locally by three shops, and they were in this range.

 

[chuckycheese]

Bumpers

Bumpers

I didn't realize that plastic car bumpers were painted...I thought maybe the color was mixed into the plastic! :!:

 

[earlfor]

Re: Bumpers

Re: Bumpers

I would guess they are manufactured both ways.

E.

I didn't realize that plastic car bumpers were painted...I thought maybe the color was mixed into the plastic! :!:

 

[Cajun Cycler]

I can testify that an automotive lacquer finish is durable and beautiful. Son in law works at a Dodge dealer, painted my bike PT Cruiser red. The paint has never chipped, clear coat is just as fine as the day he painted it. No gas has so far been able to dull the finish. It always helps to keep the painted surface waxed though.

 

[Planecrazy]

Hey Chucky, you haven't cornered the market on learning here ... I've picked up several useful tips myself just from reading the other posts in this one thread :wink:

The GSR rocks as usual!!

Regards,
Steve 8)

 

[Doze]

Not to be niggling over terms here, but Imron is a Polyurethane paint not Epoxy or Urethane. Just a clarification so that someone unfamiliar with the different paints won't get confused.
Doze.

 

[rek]

just bought a great book on the subject a couple weeks ago.

Automotive Paint Handbook by John Pfanstiehl. :arrow:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1557882916/104-3770675-8003905?v=glance

it starts with a history of auto paint (as in before the 1926 use of spray guns) and goes thought the latest HVLP tech. i highly recommend it just to get to know the process and terms even if you are not contemplating a DIY paint job.

one of the things i learned that was relevant to this thread is that the OEM paint is a special mix that you nor the body shop can buy. it is designed to dry very quickly in ovens as hot as 450 degrees F! this is needed by the mfgr for assembly line flow. the paint we buy isn't formulated this way, but is still durable. i had an oem paint start to go away after a few years (6) and then had it painted by an awesome painter and it lasted 12yrs out in the weather 24/7. as others have said quality paint and lots of prep work will pay off.

i plan to paint my GS1000 myself just for the experience, along with my old CJ-7 . my current plan is a 1000s pattern in yellow and white instead of blue or red and white, maybe w/ the 1/4 fairing and a chin spoiler and maybe not. :roll:

thanks.. my 2cents. :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

well...

well...

I had my 1980 GS1100 painted last winter. The guy who did it is a rep for DuPont, who paints in his spare time. (i.e., he gets the paint for free...).

He did the tank and side covers for $250, though I lost a cover and had to get a new one done.

Pics are here http://www.chrisberg.net/cbnet/gs1100L.htm

 

[Anonymous]

The fact is, no aftermarket paint job can be as good as the original, especially on the gas tank. Auto and motorcycle manufacturers at the time actually baked the metal parts that received clear-coats, like gas tanks, in large moisture-free "ovens" as soon as they were painted, making the paint as tough and permanent as possible. Aftermarket paint jobs don't involve that. For that reason, they will never be as resistant to the effects of time/gasoline, etc. even if they are shinier to begin with.

 

[Anonymous]

Typo - I meant "no, the aftermarket paint can't be as good as the original."

 

[duaneage]

Considering the major advances in paint technology over the last 25 years I cannot imagine that the original finish on these bikes is better because they allegedly baked them on in special ovens, which I doubt because of the costs involved. As long as you take the work to someone who knows what they are doing and uses quality products it should look as good as new, save for special effects like metalic finishes . Metalic finishes can be tough to match exactly, but these are GS road bikes, not 66 Shelby roadsters so the collectable price concerns don't apply here.

 

[gspaul]

Yes! All after market paint job's applied by somebody with the know how,will be better,paint tech has come so much farther than twenty years ago

 

[Hoomgar]

Your friends are wrong. Actually the opposite is true. It depends though. Like many have said it totally depends on who does the work. I would think that a lot of Joe Shmoe paint shops out there may live up the reputation your friends say they do. However, if you find the right painter he or she will be able to deliver a paint job for you that can well out do any factory paint job in both quality & durability. Just remember the old adage though:

You get what you pay for.

Also most things fall under the three ways rule:

You can have your work done in three ways...
1. Fast
2. Cheap
3. Good

You can pick any two of the three.

 

[earlfor]

Yeah, assuming skill, cost is proportional to degree of perfection. If a customer expects perfect, there is no way to do it cheap.

Earl

You can have your work done in three ways...
1. Fast
2. Cheap
3. Good

You can pick any two of the three.

 

[Hoomgar]

Yeah, assuming skill, cost is proportional to degree of perfection. If a customer expects perfect, there is no way to do it cheap.

Earl

You can have your work done in three ways...
1. Fast
2. Cheap
3. Good

You can pick any two of the three.

It's words of wisdom huh Earl? Some older mechanic told me that


So with what you said, no way to do it cheap. Thus, "You get what you pay for" also comes true.

Bottom line is, if you are willing to shell out the bucks and have a good painter. You can have a paint job that far exceeds the quality of a factory one.