Anyone ever done their own valve job?

[Nessism]

I?m toying with the idea of buying the tools to be able to do my own valve jobs. I?ve never done this type of work before but I?m reasonably capable and know my way around a machine shop doing simple tasks.

Looks like about $400 will buy a set of Neway valve seat cutters and the necessary accessories to change the guides and hone them to size. Quotes I?ve received to install guides, size them to the valves, and then touch up the seats to match the new guide is running more than $200 for labor.


Has anyone ever done this kind of work before and if so, any advice? Is it worth the hassle or should I just pay to have the work done by a pro?

On a related topic, I?m going to buy a bottle brush hone to break the glaze on some cylinders. Does anyone know what grit hone to use? Seems like 120 grit is popular but not sure.

 

[almarconi]

I?m toying with the idea of buying the tools to be able to do my own valve jobs. I?ve never done this type of work before but I?m reasonably capable and know my way around a machine shop doing simple tasks.

Life is about learning new things..if doing a valve job is interesting to you I say go for it. There is nothing more satisfying than learning to do something for the first time and have it work. I'd get a used head to practice on and the tools and have at it.

 

[GS1100ez]

ive done it on small engines

reseated my brothers bolens 10hp
in the block
and ground down the valves
and chopped them shorter to fit with specs

 

[progas]

valve jobs

valve jobs

Hi Ed, I have done valve jobs with Neway cutters for years now, and it gives me a lot of satisfaction when I get done doing one. But, it is a lot of hand work and requires a lot of prep work and cleaning afterwards to do it right. I have much more than $400.00 invested in cutters to do a variety of heads, not to mention the guides for them. You also must have a means to grind the valves themselves, which means more money. Let me tell you the Neway tool for doing that doesn't work well, the machine or the hand one! On top of that, you almost need a glass beader to get the heads cleaned up before you start on them. Unless you want to do that for a living, it would be much easier to have a Serdi valve job done at one of the hot rod shops in town. Just my thoughts, oh yeah, you get a nice little blister in the middle of your palm from twisting the cutters, ask me how I know!!............Bob

 

[Big T]

Is the Neway the one that will give you a 5 angle valve job?

You could recoup your investment fairly easily.

 

[progas]

Is the Neway the one that will give you a 5 angle valve job?

You could recoup your investment fairly easily.

I think you must be thinking of the Serdi valve job. Five angles in one cut from a custom designed tool. What a beautiful job they do!!

 

[waterman]

On a related topic, I’m going to buy a bottle brush hone to break the glaze on some cylinders. Does anyone know what grit hone to use? Seems like 120 grit is popular but not sure.

I used a 180 grit silicon carbide similar to this one on ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2-3-...Z260316178652QQptZMotorsQ5fAutomotiveQ5fTools

Watched a youtube video on it, may have taken 5 minutes to do all 4 cylinders. Was very simple and I will almost say fool proof, but there are some very persistant people. I used 5w20 oil for lubricant, just make sure when finished to thoroughly clean cylinders.

 

[rustybronco]

Yes I have, but its been a long time! the dealership I worked at had valve/ valve seat refacing equipment, both kwik way and (IIRC) neway?. I prefer the kwik way stone method of refacing seats and valves over the Tungston? cutters. the stone method gives a nice finish to the seats.
with the neway, it left too much chatter on the seats for my taste. I guess you could lap them when you are finished.

yes, I have done more than a few...

 

[Nessism]

Hi Ed, I have done valve jobs with Neway cutters for years now, and it gives me a lot of satisfaction when I get done doing one. But, it is a lot of hand work and requires a lot of prep work and cleaning afterwards to do it right. I have much more than $400.00 invested in cutters to do a variety of heads, not to mention the guides for them. You also must have a means to grind the valves themselves, which means more money. Let me tell you the Neway tool for doing that doesn't work well, the machine or the hand one! On top of that, you almost need a glass beader to get the heads cleaned up before you start on them. Unless you want to do that for a living, it would be much easier to have a Serdi valve job done at one of the hot rod shops in town. Just my thoughts, oh yeah, you get a nice little blister in the middle of your palm from twisting the cutters, ask me how I know!!............Bob

Thanks for the feedback Bob.

I recently bought a second hand blast cabinet and use it all the time. Best purchase I?ve made in a long time.

My tentative plan is to buy the bare minimum in terms of cutters and related tools. Looks like three cutters are required, a guide driving tool, guide hone, pilot to guide the cutters, and a handle to turn the cutters. If the valves need to be refinished, I?ll take them somewhere.

Since you?ve done this before could you tell me if a simple guide hone is adequate or do I need to purchase a reamer? And when removing/installing the guides, is it necessary to heat the head first?

Thanks.

 

[Nessism]

Yes I have, but its been a long time! the dealership I worked at had valve/ valve seat refacing equipment, both kwik way and (IIRC) neway?. I prefer the kwik way stone method of refacing seats and valves over the Tungston? cutters. the stone method gives a nice finish to the seats.
with the neway, it left too much chatter on the seats for my taste. I guess you could lap them when you are finished.

yes, I have done more than a few...

Hey Rusty,

I looked at the Kwik-way stones but they seem to be more expensive than the Neway cutters. Maybe more research is needed. The arbor to hold the stones seems particularly expensive for some reason ? I think it anchors in the guide and the stone spins on bearings or something. Stones require a motor to spin them as well which is very expensive.

 

[76FJ55]

What engine are you doing the work on? I have a set of Neway cutters I bought and used on my 4 valve 750. they should work on all the 4V heads I would think, but don't know about the 2V. I may or may not be wanting to get rid of them, but if it's the experience of cutting valves your looking for and they'll fit your application we may be able to arange something.

 

[Nessism]

What engine are you doing the work on? I have a set of Neway cutters I bought and used on my 4 valve 750. they should work on all the 4V heads I would think, but don't know about the 2V. I may or may not be wanting to get rid of them, but if it's the experience of cutting valves your looking for and they'll fit your application we may be able to arange something.

I'm doing my 2V 1000 engine. Bummer. Just for grins, what cutters do you have?

 

[progas]

Hi Ed, you will need a reamer for sure and a hone for after reaming. Most people will heat the head to remove guides, if you don't, sometimes some material from the head is broken away, and when you install the new guide it won't sit flat on the surface, and it will affect your cut angle on the seat.
Most people have three cutters, including a 45, a 30 and a 60, that will get you going in the right direction, good luck....Bob

 

[rustybronco]

Hey Rusty,

I looked at the Kwik-way stones but they seem to be more expensive than the Neway cutters. Maybe more research is needed. The arbor to hold the stones seems particularly expensive for some reason ? I think it anchors in the guide and the stone spins on bearings or something. Stones require a motor to spin them as well which is very expensive.

You are correct, but you don't have to get new do you?
A dealership/machine shop that is going out of business is an option to purchase a used one from. half the time they are just gathering dust anyways.

 

[Dan Ruddock]

I did my GS1k head with neway cutters that I have had for 30 years. I also bought the suzuki guide hole reamer to install suzuki OS guides. No bigge. Dan

 

[Nessism]

I did my GS1k head with neway cutters that I have had for 30 years. I also bought the suzuki guide hole reamer to install suzuki OS guides. No bigge. Dan

Still have those cutters Dan? Care to rent them to me?

 

[Dan Ruddock]

PM sent. Dan

 

[omaharj]

http://omaha.craigslist.org/tls/1076553322.html

I don't know if this is relevant or not. I'm Sargent Schultz on this one..... "I know NOTHINK!"

 

[82Shafty]

I did my GS1k head with neway cutters that I have had for 30 years. I also bought the suzuki guide hole reamer to install suzuki OS guides. No bigge. Dan

Ed is she burning oil on start up, or have you done a cyl leak down test and discovered that your one or both valves per cyl aren't up to snuff? I would not go by a compression test alone?

Valves:

Check for stem run out and/or wear
Check tips for wear
On average the stem by the head is .001 inch less than by the tip
Ensure there is adequate margin left to allow a quick grind (this will raise stem height along with cutting the seat.)
Check keeper grooves for wear
Check valve Lock grooves
Check current seat contact---I'm not sure what Suzi specs, but on average I run with 1/16" for intake contact and 3/32" for exhaust valve to seat contact
Measure Valve overhang before hand as well
Make sure the guide is not flanged as this will determine what side it needs to be driven out from
On most alum heads, you drive the guide out towards combusion chamber side
Also, you can throw the head in the oven @ 400 for 15 mins to allow for an easier removal of the guides.

Dry ice works well for slipping in new guides as well as good ol lubrication

Also be sure to get a measurment of guide height before taking the old ones out.





I'm with Dan on this one:

If you have to replace guides, one way to measure wear is using the valve and a dial indicator, given the stem isn't worn out on the valve, or you can use a split ball or small bore gauge to measure the bore of the guide, the choice is yours. Maybe she just needs a new set of seals.

Replace the guides before you do any cutting.

Do you have a spec that has installed stem height measurement along with the valve margin spec? Some valves only allow so much to be taken off of the stem before you get to the innards usually no more than .020" inch; keep that in mind.

Are you installing new valve springs or having them tested at least?

As far as rings, I would check with the ring manufacturer what microinch finish you need to obtain. This will determine what grit stone you want to use to hone your cyl bores with.

You will also want to observe the cross hatch angle you finish the cyl with. Generally, the boring puts the foundation in for the angle, and the ball stones (honing) slimply plateau the peaks for the final microinch finish which acts as a bearing surface on which an oil film can form. The valleys allow for oil reservation, oil distribution, and offer a place for worn metal and abrasive particles to reside until washed away.

The true peformance nutters will torque the cylinders as they finish honing them.


When cleaning anything after the machining process, HOT SOAPY WATER is the only proven way as solvents alone will not wash away debris.


Sorry, was just going off the top of my head with some random thoughts, hope this helps.

 

[Nessism]

Good info 82Shafty, thanks.

I measured the valve to stem clearance using a dial indicator and the guides are worn. The valves all measure within the "standard", and well above the "limit" (which is pretty useless when it comes to valves I've decided). The exhaust valve guides show the most wear.

The seats all look good, but because of the guides, I'm going to have to touch them up after the new guides are in place. Hopefully, the amount of cutting will be minimal.

I'm using factory rings and there is no information on finish requirement in the service manual I could find...thus my question here.

Thanks again.