Custom Painting Question(s)

[Schweisshund]

Ok I went to walmart tonight (because they are open 24 hours) and looked for Duplicolor products. The only duplicolor products this wal-mart carried was for truck liners (Guys, I live in hillbilly territory). In any case, I went to look at the House of Kolor paints I mentioned earlier and came to find out they are automotive paints but used for an airbrush and reduced accordingly. I really like the wide variety of colors to choose from House of Kolor, they have mettalics, candies, pearlescents - you name it they had it. I also looked at the rustoleum products as well. I will be repainting both of my motorcycles and have already decided to paint my Honda Nighthawk black with metallic silver graphics. Any recommendations for Rustoleum paints? Is it good product?

I do know that advance auto, pep boys and autozone carry the dupli - color products but they were not open. I have a LOT of prep work to do before I actually get any painting done. I have ordered some parts for both motorcycles and they are en route. While I am waiting I am gonna go ahead and do some prep work.

I was able to pick up a product called "Bondo Glazing and Spot Putty" It says I can use this on metal, wood, fiberglass and sanded primer and paint. Is this also good for plastic side covers? I also got plastic spreaders of various sizes to apply this product.

I picked up a red cream hardener (Bondo product) as I already have a can of Bondo but no hardener.

I also got a Black & Decker 5" Sanding & Polishing kit for a drill, 3M wetordry sandpaper assorted 220-320-400, paint thinner and tack cloth.

I also got a coke - all of this cost $23.00

I think what I am gonna do at some point is get an aluminum can and test Dupli-color products and House of Kolor paint and see if it is any good and if it is worth painting my Suzuki with. There is a reason why I want a bright color for this bike (breaking in a new rider and want people to see this bike on the road). That leaves me with four colors that really reach out and grab your attention - neon yellow, Kosmos red, fluorescent green, and bright orange. I know ... please spare me the criticism. :-D

 

[txironhead]

And don't forget the different color primers! Perfect for finding low spots. I prefer alternating light grey and dark grey, but sometimes I'll alternate grey and rust color. I finally got the side covers smoothed out, little bit of sandable primer to double check, then sealer primer and paint. I haven't decided exactly what paint to use yet, I have a weak little pancake compressor that will run an airbrush but not a full-blown paint gun. I may get my brother to paint it, he's got more experience plus the advantage of a full FBO hanger to operate in. He just got done painting a Bell helicopter the other day. Too bad I don't want my motorcycle three-tone blue, he had paint left over......

Now that the side covers are done, I guess it's time to give in and order that POR-15 tank liner kit. That's one thing we haven't covered in this post: Line the tank BEFORE painting it! Or acid etch or whatever process you're going to use to prep your tank. The same stuff that takes the varnish, old liner and rust out of your tank will destroy even the best paint job. Still can't find phosphoric acid locally, all the concrete etcher at Lowe's and Home Depot is crappy environmentally-friendly junk with absolutely no phosphoric acid in it. Not even the industrial supply stores here carry it. The strongest stuff the paint shop had was Ospho, which is a weaker acid mix and won't completely get rid of the rust. I'd bead blast the inside, but then you run the risk of having grit in the tank and not being 100% sure you got the rust in the seams, etc.

 

[Schweisshund]

This might be a stupid question but ....

This might be a stupid question but ....

Will battery acid work? I have plenty left over in plastic containers when I got new batteries for the honda and suzuki. Just curious if anyone has ever lined their tanks with it before and if it is strong enough to remove rust and varnish. You can buy the stuff at any autoparts store for about 5 bucks.

 

[Nessism]

Will battery acid work? I have plenty left over in plastic containers when I got new batteries for the honda and suzuki. Just curious if anyone has ever lined their tanks with it before and if it is strong enough to remove rust and varnish. You can buy the stuff at any autoparts store for about 5 bucks.

Negative on the battery acid. You want phosphoric acid for cleaning metal.

Regarding the Duplicolor and HOC hobby paint you mention, they will look okay but the first time gas hits the surface it will soften the paint pronto. The catalyzed paints are far more gas resistant, and more scratch/chip resistant as well. If you just want to get some bright color on the bike, and have it look decent, there was a post a while back about someone that used Rustolium paint on a car...using a foam brush to apply. At any rate, the paint can be color sanded and polished according to the link provided. Might be a reasonable approach as long as you don't have too high an expectation.

 

[txironhead]

Would that apply to the Dupli-Color Engine Enamel as well? Seems like they'd make the engine paint more chemical resistant. I've used it on bike and car engines for years with outstanding results. Of course, I'm not in the habit of pouring gasoline all over my engines.......

 

[Schweisshund]

Perhaps there is a gas resistant clear coat? Anyone know of one? I did see the post about applying rustoleum with foam rollers - amazing photos. Does Rustoleum make a clear coat?

 

[Nessism]

I receintly polished and cleared the top caps on my carbs. Used VHT header paint (clear) and baked it to harden. First time gas hit the carbs, during sync using a remote tank, the paint crinkled a little. Maybe it needed more time to gain chemical resistance but I just don't trust any rattle can paint to be truely chemical resistant.

 

[Schweisshund]

Prestigious Painter Award "House of Kolor" December 2007 - Joe Pyro Luedtke

Prestigious Painter Award "House of Kolor" December 2007 - Joe Pyro Luedtke

1998 Suzuki GSXR 750

 

[Schweisshund]

I want to learn how to do that :-D If I do, my life will be a little more complete \\/

 

[txironhead]

If you could learn to do that, you could ride any bike you wanted. That is a sweet paint job. No rattle can there.

I never bother clearcoating bare aluminum. Some good paste metal polish and a little wax every six months or so and I'm good to ride.

Now, for engine cases and such that are a complete pain in the posterior to keep spotless, I prefer beadblasting followed up by Dupli-Color Engine Enamel or Exhaust Enamel (with Ceramic!\\/) in black or aluminum.

I've been meaning to give that Flitz Ball a try, see if it lives up to the hype.

 

[Schweisshund]

TXironhead - I am right smack in the middle of "learning" about how scratch glaze works. I took one cover off my honda and could see all the mistakes I made on prepping that from my first attempt at painting. This time around, I have learned to be a bit more patient (I hope). I am using a bondo product and it sands down quite well (first time using it and yes I applied it too thick and it cracked). After much sanding, I got it smooth as glass.

I am now working on the Suzuki plastic. I am using 320 grit wet or dry sandpaper and am wetsanding these parts. After the attempt on the Honda plastic cover, I now now "apply in thin coats" means exactly that. :-D

Hopefully, tmw I will be satisified with the texture of the plastic and start the next step in the preparation for paint (primer). I picked up a product called "BullDog Adhesion Promoter - makes paint stick to all automotive surfaces". I also got Dupli-Color sandable primer in a spray can. I figure if its sandable and comes out in chunks, it can just be sanded down to the right texture.

 

[txironhead]

It won't come out in chunks, it's just a thicker primer. Make sure you spray it in thin coats, too, heavy coats have a tendency to build up (high spots) and sag (results in loud cursing).

If you want to be absolutely sure everything's smooth, spray a layer of red primer before you spray the sandable, if you strike red while sanding you've got a high spot. Alternately, you can sand almost all of the sandable primer off with a block sander and any remaining grey would be low spots. Sandable primer will fill in very fine scratches and very shallow low spots. You are using a block sander on the flat surfaces, right?

Never tried the adhesion promoter, except for Ospho on bare metal. Ospho is great stuff, especially if you're stripping/grinding/sanding a bare metal part now and won't get around to priming/painting immediately. It'll destroy and prevent surface rust, unfortunately it's not strong enough to etch something like a gas tank.

I learned the hard way about thick bodywork cracking. If you really have to do bodywork (not just scratch glazing), I'd recommend Dynaglass over Bondo brand. It's less prone to shrinking, cracking, etc. and it cures harder. It's available at O'Reilly's. For really large dents, cracks, etc. learn to use fiberglass mat or woven cloth to strengthen the epoxy. I knew a guy that was so good with Dynaglass and fiberglass that he put Testarossa panels on his Magna. Hand-formed, and did it look cool!

 

[Guest]

Now, for engine cases and such that are a complete pain in the posterior to keep spotless, I prefer beadblasting followed up by Dupli-Color Engine Enamel or Exhaust Enamel (with Ceramic!\\/) in black or aluminum.

How does the Duplicolor hold up? I'm doing a GS1000 motor in the same stuff.

 

[Schweisshund]

How does the Duplicolor hold up? I'm doing a GS1000 motor in the same stuff.

All I can say is ....wow. I really hope it holds up or your gonna get p*ssed:-D That is a beauty and I am envious of that job. When I was "experimenting" with metallic chrome (dupli-color 1000* heat resistant with ceramic) I noticed it dulled to a smoke gray 8-[ However, I did not have the patience at the time to let it completely cure. I am hoping I make enough mistakes to where I get a routine of doing things right :-D if that makes any sense.

I am wondering what the chances are of getting Joe Pyro Luedtke to join the GSR since his bike is a 1998 Suzuki GSXR 750. Anyone have any ideas how to do that? I am sure every GSer could benefit from any info he could impart to us lesser mortals (lol).

 

[Schweisshund]

I have another newbie question

I have another newbie question

Now, for engine cases and such that are a complete pain in the posterior to keep spotless, I prefer beadblasting followed up by Dupli-Color Engine Enamel or Exhaust Enamel (with Ceramic!\\/) in black or aluminum.

I've been meaning to give that Flitz Ball a try, see if it lives up to the hype.

what is beadblasting?

 

[Guest]

All I can say is ....wow. I really hope it holds up or your gonna get p*ssed:-D That is a beauty and I am envious of that job. When I was "experimenting" with metallic chrome (dupli-color 1000* heat resistant with ceramic) I noticed it dulled to a smoke gray 8-[ However, I did not have the patience at the time to let it completely cure. I am hoping I make enough mistakes to where I get a routine of doing things right :-D if that makes any sense.

Thanks. Hopefully it will hold up. All the pieces were primed and cured in an oven. I just have the jugs left to do, and she's ready for assembly!

 

[Guest]

what is beadblasting?

It's like sandblasting except you use a plastic media, which is less aggressive and easier to clean up.

 

[txironhead]

Actually, that's considered plastic media blasting. The beadblasting that I'm familiar with is used with small glass pellets. There's also baking soda, walnut shell and other medias.

The Dupli-Color engine paint I've used has all worked well. The curing has to be done low temp with gradually increasing heat. Harsh chemicals (think carb cleaner for prolonged periods) will damage the finish but it's easy to touch it up. I've never had any success with "chrome" paints. What you get is a concentration of glitter, which doesn't spray as easily or hold up as well. The aluminum colors and blacks hold up very well, although I prefer using semi-gloss over gloss for engines. I don't, ironically, use the exhaust paint on exhaust, it just doesn't hold up. I've heard the POR-15 is fantastic for header pipes and exhaust, if I get a chance to use it I'll post my results.

Normally when the gloss fades on a paint the curing was done too quickly or the heat was too great. If I could, I'd have a dedicated curing oven for mechanical parts. You want to start out slow, around 160 degrees, and gradually increase the temp to the optimal cure temp. If you go straight to 600+ it won't work, plus you stand a good chance of the fumes concentrating and that ain't good.

Honestly, if I had the money and equipment, I'd probably use a spray gun and POR-15 products on the engine and exhaust. But for the money you just can't beat the Dupli-Color products. I rode the hell out of my Shadow 700 after painting the engine, frame and body with Dupli-Color. No garage, carport or cover, I lived in a crappy apartment at the time. Washed it once a month, waxed it every six, and she still looked great when I sold her over a year later. I even painted the rims with the brushed aluminum paint. I have got to get my scanner fixed so I can post a pic.

I just found another Shadow, an '83 VT750, just like my old '85 700. It's only $100, but it's already got one foot in the grave. I had to pass it up. It would cost over a grand to get the thing roadworthy, and months of hardcore restoration. And that's at Ebay prices. It really hurt to pass that one up. Whoever treated such a fantastic bike that way does not appreciate a loyal steed.

 

[Schweisshund]

Ok Last night I finished scratch glazing and priming my sidecovers. Today, dear old dad, whom is in his mid 60's, ran a home construction company to support my family for over 40 years, is coming out to give me a few pointers. He also owned a body shop when I was 4 years old and used to paint cars old skool. If I think anything needs to be discussed after my dad gives me pointers, I will post on this thread.

 

[Schweisshund]

Campbell Hausfeld 34 peice gravity feed gun under $60

Campbell Hausfeld 34 peice gravity feed gun under $60

Ok - here is what I did today. I had luch with my dad then we went to Wal-Mart. I showed him the "House of Kolor" paints I had mentioned in earlier posts and that they are sold in 1 oz. containers for $4.00 (not $3.00 as previously mentioned). He then told me the sprayer I had would not be sufficient to use such paint and we looked at the the plastic airbrush kit that these bottles were made for. It was $20.00 and the compressor for it was $65.00 and the canned compressed air per bottle was $20.00. I was like sheesh! what con artists and almost decided to just use quart cans of paint from autozone when we went to the compressor section of wal-mart to get a 3/8 to 1/4 reducer fitting for the hose. That is when I spotted a 34 peice gravity feed spray gun kit. It came with everything and included a gravity feed spray gun as well as a gravity feed touch up spray gun.

The touch up spray gun has a smaller bottle that was actually perfect for the "House of Kolor" 1 oz. increments of paint I wanted to use. I got this kit for $58.00 (and even my dad said that was an excellent deal - as there was a seperate campbell hausfeld gravity sprayer by itself selling for $54.00).

He also told me a pearl today about when he used to own his body shop. He had custom painted an antique cadillac in his paint shop and had just applied the final coat of clear (12 coats) when an old man just walked carelessly through the paint shop (visiting customer) and much too close to the drying cadillac. The painters started shouting "Hey fella stay away from that car, its drying from wet paint" to which this old, clueless guy responded "That's ok, I got on old clothes".