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Dyna Ignition, no spark at all.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Guest
  • Start date Start date
Cassius086 said:
So wired as you suggest, this relay would power the Dyna & the coils, too? How exactly would I need to wire this relay? Would it be a 4 pin automotive relay? 2 pin? I know nothing about relays...:confused:
Click to expand...
Have a look at Cliffs website for a coil relay mod.
Use the hot end of the O/W wire as the switched wire and the other end to power the Dyna and coils. Plug the Dyna into the O/W that used to go to your ignitor. Make sure to use a fuse from the battery and use a good ground like the one at the engine case with the battery cable.
 
OK...found and can tap into a clean source of switched 12V for the Dyna S. So, I can go the quick way and just do a coil relay per Cliff's instructions, or do Jim's (posplayr) relay set up that powers both the Dyna AND the Coils at the same time. Slightly more complicated, so I poured over Jim's diagram on Cliff's site and sent him some questions.

He said he'd look over things and get back to me...I just wanted to clarify a few things with him before I did anything. Making progress.

All hail Posplayr and BassCliff :D
 
I am OFFICIALLY at my wits end. I installed Cliff's relay mod. I doubled checked EVERYTHING. Still NO voltage at the coils. What is going on?!?!?!
 
Is the relay tripping? 12v at the switched relay terminal when it's powered on?
 
12 V at the relay when ignition is switched on. Power lead (12 gauge wire) runs directly to battery with 30 amp in line fuse; relay grounded to the frame with 12 gauge wire. I am going to re-do the coil lead in the morning.
 
:mad::mad:

SO, even with a different relay, the switch isn't consistently getting tripped inside the relay...even when the blade to which battery power is plugged to shows 12V. Post 87 (output to coils) shows nothing WTH?? Battery shows 13.3 volts.

EDIT: This relay has an exposed "stud" where pole 87a would be on a 5 pin relay. When the ignition switch is turned ON, this has 12V to it while the poles 86 & 87 have very little (.2V or .1V w/ volt meter set on 20 DCV setting). Do I have something else wired backwards or something? This is absolutely maddening!!! What are the chances of getting 2 faulty relays in a row??

Dyna S is wired per directions with the kit:

Red lead: Switched 12V power (12V indicated with IGN turned ON)
Black lead: (-) post on 2/3 coil
White lead: (-) post on 1/4 coil

Coil relay wiring is as follows:

Pole 87: to the coils (+) lead on each coil. (shows nothing or very little V when IGN is switched ON)
Pole 86: to O/W wires coming out of the harness. (as above)
Pole 85: Common ground to the frame.
Pole 30: Power supply from (+) terminal of battery w/ 30A inline fuse. (Shows 12V when IGN is switched ON)
"pole" 87a: (This is flush with the surface of the relay, it does not offer a place to plug a spade connector, but I can touch it with the probe, and it indicates 12V when IGN is switched ON). It is in the same location (middle of relay) as Pole 87a would be on a 5 pin relay.
 
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Since we have no clue where you live we can't come over and take a look. (hint)
Please detail how each terminal is connected, similar to this:
30: 12V From battery
85: Ground
86: 12V O/W from coils
87: 12V out to coils
87a: N/C
 
Modded my last post to show the layout. I am in Charleston, SC...but will be in Terre Haute, IN to visit family for a week later in OCT. My brother has offered to help, but he isn't a motorcycle guy, let alone a GS enthusiast...but I geuss that doesn't matter.

AVP has one in stock...Dare I take a risk on a NOS wiring harness from them? I know they have a bad rep here...
 
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I suspect you don't have enough voltage at 86 to trip the relay..

as a test jump post 30 to 86 and see if you get 12v at 87..

30 should always be 12v.. ignition of or not..

Ignore 87A it appears to be live when the relay on not powered.. +12v to 86 and 87 is live.. no voltage to 86 and 87A is live..

bosch_relay.gif



hmm just for fun try reversing 85 and 86.. make 86 the ground and 85 the signal line..

That orange white wire that feeds the ignition has a long path to run..
It runs from the fuse box all the way up to the right grip kill switch..
From there it feeds both the ignition circuit (orange white)and the starter relay signal line (green yellow)..
the wires are easy to find in the headlight.. check the voltage there and clean the connectors.. If the voltage is low there check the connectors in the fuse holder.
 
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If I don't get this sorted soon, I think I'll break down and get the proper connector kits, label everything, take copius pics and pull the wiring harness...spread it out on a sheet of plywood, secure it in place and make a duplicate. Anybody know what gauge wire the harnes is made of predominantly?? 18 gauge? 20 gauge?

I just don't have confidence in AVP to buy a harness from them...
 
*SIGH*

OK, I have exchanged PMs with Jim, and performed his Coil/ignition relay mod per instructions. STILL NOTHING to the coils. I tried switching the ground and signal wires @ the relay as sschering suggested. No dice. Jim's mod takes the O/W from the kill switch out of the loop with a wire direct to the relay from the switch while bypassing the long O/W run thru the harness. Starter button does nothing, and no voltage @ coils. I think I stated earlier that the starter WILL turn the motor over when I jump the solenoid with a screw driver....


Anderson Vintage Parts has a NOS harness...if only I could get somebody to answer the damn phone or reply to an email. :mad:

I have put A LOT of work into this bike, and it is REALLY frustrating that I'm stuck @ an electrical problem...:(
 
Mike,
Part of the problem has got to be that you dont have a schematic. Granted I left some details out, in my schematics as I assumed it was just a detail for the reader.

What Koolaid said............EXCEPT Edited in RED..................

Since we have no clue where you live we can't come over and take a look. (hint)
Please detail how each terminal is connected, similar to this:
30: 12V From battery
85: Ground
86: [[12V O/W from coils]] CORRECTED Switch 12V O/W from Kill Switch
87: 12V out to coils
87a: N/C
Click to expand...
 
I was very careful to follow your directions from the last PM you sent (which is what you list above from Koolaid with your correction). Still no dice.

Too add to the confusion, when I did so I lost all the idiot lights and gear position indicator display. Only things that lit up when I turned on the ignition were the lights that illumninate the gauges. :confused:

UGH. It has to be something overwhelmingly simple that I am overlooking.

The 12V from batt to the Relay is a fused (30A) 12 gauge wire. Ground is a 12 gauge wire grounded to the frame (yes, the frame was scrubbed to assure clealiness). Should the ground be a heavier gauge wire?? The relay just isn't getting tripped...
 
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Cassius086 said:
*SIGH*

OK, I have exchanged PMs with Jim, and performed his Coil/ignition relay mod per instructions. STILL NOTHING to the coils. I tried switching the ground and signal wires @ the relay as sschering suggested. No dice. Jim's mod takes the O/W from the kill switch out of the loop with a wire direct to the relay from the switch while bypassing the long O/W run thru the harness. Starter button does nothing, and no voltage @ coils. I think I stated earlier that the starter WILL turn the motor over when I jump the solenoid with a screw driver....


Anderson Vintage Parts has a NOS harness...if only I could get somebody to answer the damn phone or reply to an email. :mad:

I have put A LOT of work into this bike, and it is REALLY frustrating that I'm stuck @ an electrical problem...:(
Click to expand...
Mike, don't screw with Anderson, they are on the deadbeat list. They are the reason we have a deadbeat section here. They'll take your money and not respond to email, phone calls, or anything else. I had to threaten to report them to the FBI Internet Fraud Division to get their attention. They haven't been worth a crap in years. http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=85641
 
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Take a reading and see what voltage you have on both sides of the ign switch..
 
poss battery

poss battery

Maybe im being too simple about this, but ive had a similar prob before w/ my bike and a dyna ign. Not sure what model youve got, ive got the 4k w/ all the goodies and if my batt gets low it wont fire. Somewhere around 7-8v you notice the performance difference, much lower than that it does mostly nada. Even w/ a charger on it in the bike, its not happy w/ the battery that low. Hope this helps.
 
Thascrambler said:
Maybe im being too simple about this, but ive had a similar prob before w/ my bike and a dyna ign. Not sure what model youve got, ive got the 4k w/ all the goodies and if my batt gets low it wont fire. Somewhere around 7-8v you notice the performance difference, much lower than that it does mostly nada. Even w/ a charger on it in the bike, its not happy w/ the battery that low. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

All Dyna ignitions are designed to operate on 12v or more. They quit working reliably at 11v or so.

Earl
 
Static voltage reading on my Shorai was 14.2 V...taking it with me on vacation to see family. My brother is quite a good auto electrican...
 
Just an odd question, when you tapped into the O/W wire to trigger the relay, you did make sure the O/W wire circuit is still intact just splicing the relay in. The O/W wire needs to remain a circuit, or you get NADA at the coils or the ignitor.

I got a little confused at this point in the install of mine and had to re read that part to make sure I wasn't cutting the O/W wire out.
 
I didn't tap into the circuit, I bypassed it with posplyr's relay set up. We seem to have found an issue with the fusebox. Voltage is just not consisent. My brother says there are two seperate issues, not one. We now have spark @ the coils when starting at the solenoid, but the starter button does nothing. I'll update more as we find out more...

Thanks a ton for all the help, guys!!

Edit: Well, after re-checking things, we tried several fuses, but still don't get any voltage @ the fuse block from the ignition's fuse slot or the signal fuse slot. Going to order a new fuse block from BB or somebody tomorrow.
 
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