Electrosport R/R and Stator still not doing the job...

[phillygrimace]

Hey guys,
First post on the GS Forms for me! I have a 1982 GS1100ez. I've had my share of charging problems with the bike, and decided to just replace the whole darn thing with the Electrosport combo package. My first go around, my mechanic had the thing up and charging (or so he said). It killed the next battery I bought. I took it back -- he said the Reg/Rectifier was defective (a 1% chance according to electrosport). Got the warranty R/R from e-sport and got it on the bike. Again the mechanic told me the bike was charging "like a champ". Again, battery is killed. I borrowed my pop's digital voltage meter and got in there to test the thing myself. Battery read out was a solid 12.6 volts while the bike was off. Not too much of a dip with the ignition turned on. Once the bike is running and throttle is applied, the meter sloooowly climbs to 14 volts. I'm holding the engine at 3500 rpm, and it seems to take a full 30 seconds for the charging system to get to where it needs to be.

Has anyone else experienced this kind of thing? The Electro Sport package is basically bypassing the bikes original charging system route, and hooks from the R/R straight to the battery. I'm so confused!!

 

[JEEPRUSTY]

Are you driving alot at engine speeds below 3500 rpm?
The battery will rain if your revs are not high enough to actually charge the battery.

 

[phillygrimace]

I just got home from a long trip..mostly highway miles -- mostly revving about 5k rpm. The battery died towards the end of the trip. The most confusing thing to me is that I thought at any rev the voltage should jump fairly quickly to 14 something volts? The battery was also brand new before the trip, and trickle charged correctly...

 

[Triam]

Here's a link to a diagram that helps find your charging problem.

http://www.electrosport.com/media/pdf/fault-finding-diagram.pdf

I actually found this before I had even heard of a Suzuki GS850, back when I rode a Kawi.

 

[lemonshindig]

Bad grounds can cause a whole bunch of charging problems.

Or you have a short, causing the battery to be drained once you shut it off.

 

[posplayr]

Do a "quick test" so we have some quantitative data.

 

[phillygrimace]

Thanks for the replies,
I'm going to get everything apart again tomorrow and go through the fault finding diagram again. Seems like from what i've been reading it maybe time to go through my wiring harness and clean things out. I'm definitely getting 14.6 volts at 4-5k rpm, it just takes its time getting up to that voltage after the engine gets there. Could this something simple like replacing a headlamp bulb? Another thing of interest is that my horn never fully worked, and only was getting 9volts at the horn leads..

 

[phillygrimace]

The quick test checks out that everything is ok. The misleading thing is the 30-45 seconds it takes for the voltage to reach 14.6. I always thought that this should be an immediate spike in voltage when the rpms reached charging speed?

 

[posplayr]

The quick test checks out that everything is ok. The misleading thing is the 30-45 seconds it takes for the voltage to reach 14.6. I always thought that this should be an immediate spike in voltage when the rpms reached charging speed?

if you reported your number , maybe I can see something in the data. You should realize that the charging system only charges a battery slowly and if the battery is low it will hold the voltage low. That is why the first part of the test is to check the battery voltage.

 

[trippivot]

ok I'm pretty good at this stuff - I had a bike come into the shop not charging -- after I installed new stator/R&R and battery it went out but came back with a problem such as this. --just like you described.

I checked everything and it worked but just weak and the break even speed was way above idle. well after I went round and around because it came back 3 times -- voltage was ok at high revvs -- amperage rate was low but positive. all the stuff was electrosport and new - I put it all in --

Finally I went 100% thru the problem bike and I found that the headlight was home wired with both low beam and high beam on at all times.
It came on properly I couldn't tell until I opened the bucket ... change back to 1 beam at a time and BINGO!!!

 

[Guest]

You should go through your entire harness, connectors plugs and switches, coat everything with dielectric grease, install a single point ground system and then check your charging system. I don't think the Electrosport R/R's are any better than the stock R/R. I remember a stator thread where someone went through three Electrosport stators and it turned out to be an Electrosport R/R. I use an Electrosport stator and it has been great. They were excellent, at least back when I bought mine. I installed a CompuFire series R/R and have had no trouble. I have a lot of miles on that combination.

 

[phillygrimace]

ok I'm pretty good at this stuff - I had a bike come into the shop not charging -- after I installed new stator/R&R and battery it went out but came back with a problem such as this. --just like you described.

I checked everything and it worked but just weak and the break even speed was way above idle. well after I went round and around because it came back 3 times -- voltage was ok at high revvs -- amperage rate was low but positive. all the stuff was electrosport and new - I put it all in --

Finally I went 100% thru the problem bike and I found that the headlight was home wired with both low beam and high beam on at all times.
It came on properly I couldn't tell until I opened the bucket ... change back to 1 beam at a time and BINGO!!!

I think you are onto something with this -- I'm going to open up my bucket right now and check this. I've always thought something was odd because when I switch the headlight from low to high, essentially just the low beam goes away. Thinking on it now, this would make sense that they are both on at the same time! How did you end up fixing the beams? Wow if this turns out to be the case I will be A) relieved, and B) frustrated that I spent all this $ on Labor (twice over) and Parts.

 

[phillygrimace]

1.) key off................Normal 12.7 volts-12.9 volts
12.7
2.) key on (but not cranking with lights for 10 sec).....Normal 12.2-12.5 volts
12.4
3.) at idle (1500 rpm).....12.6volts - 13.2volts
12.6
4.) at 2500 rpm 13.5 -14.0 volts
12.9
5.) at 5000 rpm.....14.0 -15.0 volts
13.1 this test -- have seen as high as 14 though in past couple of days
6.) key off.....slightly higher than measurements # 1 (12.8-13.0 v)
12.8

 

[phillygrimace]

I think you are onto something with this -- I'm going to open up my bucket right now and check this. I've always thought something was odd because when I switch the headlight from low to high, essentially just the low beam goes away. Thinking on it now, this would make sense that they are both on at the same time! How did you end up fixing the beams? Wow if this turns out to be the case I will be A) relieved, and B) frustrated that I spent all this $ on Labor (twice over) and Parts.

I just tested this -- it seems like on "Low beam" both beams are on. Voltage wise - it is taking about .1/ .15 volts extra for this combo when compared to the draw from the "high beam" setting.

When I pulled the fuse for the headlamps, the meter was reading much much more like a "healthy" system would readout according to the links and advice i've been going through on the forums. Also there was no hesitation/lag with the voltage jump when throttle is applied with the headlamp circuit disconnected.

Should I maybe just get a new headlamp bulb?

 

[phillygrimace]

Ok -- so i've pulled the headlamp basket, and it's looking like a few things are melty and there are some bypassed wires. I've taken pictures of

View attachment 20327
The black wire, and the two brown wires that are connected together were not connected to anything, and the black wiring harness was connected to the headlamp.

 

[phillygrimace]

View attachment 20328
This harness seems to be pretty melted, and has a few cancelled wires right on the harness (snipped at both ends). Does anyone know what this one is attached to?

 

[Guest]

That's a proper mess. fifteen volts will cook your battery. I hope you meant at 5.000 rpm it was between 14 and 15 volts. Download your shop manual, it should have a wiring diagram. http://www.mtsac.edu/~cliff/storage/gs/80-83_GS1100T-LT-EX-1000SZ-EZ-SD-ED-ESD.pdf

 

[phillygrimace]

That's a proper mess. fifteen volts will cook your battery. I hope you meant at 5.000 rpm it was between 14 and 15 volts. Download your shop manual, it should have a wiring diagram. http://www.mtsac.edu/~cliff/storage/gs/80-83_GS1100T-LT-EX-1000SZ-EZ-SD-ED-ESD.pdf

Will sort through the wiring diagram to figure out what that may be. I was just saying that a fifteenth of a volt extra is being drawn with the "low beam" setting, which I believe now to actually be both low and high beams at the same time. Not fifteen .

Is this a common issue with these wiring harnesses, or old wiring harnesses in general? What i mean by common issue is - melty connectors. What normally causes this

Thanks for stickin with me guys, i'm the first to admit i'm a newby and need all the help I can get!

 

[JEEPRUSTY]

What a mess POs all suck.

 

[tom203]

If your low beam filament and high beam filament came on at same time, this would draw maybe extra 5 amps from bulb ground to frame/harness ground. But I'm suprised bulb didn't overheat and just flame out.