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How low of stator voltage is OK?

  • Thread starter Thread starter mnferwerda
  • Start date Start date
M

mnferwerda

Guest
Hi,
I have an '83 Suzuki GR650. If I ride for awhile (say @ 30 minutes) and stop and restart, the bike barely kicks over. Waiting a bit, it kicks over more easily. I did the charging system quick tests in the sticky note and got these values
1 - key off: 12.8v
2 - key on: 12.2v
3 - idle: 12.75v
4 - 2500rpm: 13.9v
5 - 5000 rpm: 12.2v
#5 seems to indicate bad connections, so I checked the ground and power lines between the regulator and the battery and no impedance/resistance at all which was to be expected since I ran a ground wire straight to the battery.

So I moved onto the stator. Following BassCliffs Stator testing guide I did his 3 tests
1 - continuity between leads tests: all leads test @ .8 ohms between each other (all 3 pairings)
2 - continuity between leads and ground: no continuity/infinite impedance for all leads
3 - AC output between leads at @ 4000 rpms: @ 54Vac between each other (all 3 pairings)

BassCliff says that anything below 60v needs to be replaced. Factory manual says anything below 80v.

My 2 questions:
1 - Could the stator be the the problem that I am experiencing with starting? The R+R is not original but I cannot tell the make/model.
2 - How significant is the low voltage? I'm trying to convince myself that this OK :confused:

OK - 1 more question: If I need a new stator, any great/special place to purchase one. I know I can get one from online sources (e.g. Bike Bandit, ...)

Thanks!
Mark
'83 Suzuki GR650
 
You should note that all of the manuals call for stator voltage tests at 5000 RPM, not 4000. Yes, there will be enough of a difference to notice, so eliminate that one variable and let us know what the voltage is.

One reason for the tests that are put out there is so that variables are minimized, meaning you will know where the problem lies.

If the GR650 uses the same stator as the GS650, I think I have a rewound one for you that will be a LOT less money than one you will find at Bike BANDIT. Keep in mind that Bike BANDIT earned the name BANDIT. Probably because they are the second-most-expensive vendor on the interwebs. :oops:

.
 
OK. I'm kicking myself for realizing after that I did not do the final test correctly. I redo it tomorrow and post my results.
Thanks!
 
mnferwerda said:
Hi,
I have an '83 Suzuki GR650. If I ride for awhile (say @ 30 minutes) and stop and restart, the bike barely kicks over. Waiting a bit, it kicks over more easily. I did the charging system quick tests in the sticky note and got these values
1 - key off: 12.8v
2 - key on: 12.2v
3 - idle: 12.75v
4 - 2500rpm: 13.9v
5 - 5000 rpm: 12.2v
#5 seems to indicate bad connections, so I checked the ground and power lines between the regulator and the battery and no impedance/resistance at all which was to be expected since I ran a ground wire straight to the battery.

So I moved onto the stator. Following BassCliffs Stator testing guide I did his 3 tests
1 - continuity between leads tests: all leads test @ .8 ohms between each other (all 3 pairings)
2 - continuity between leads and ground: no continuity/infinite impedance for all leads
3 - AC output between leads at @ 4000 rpms: @ 54Vac between each other (all 3 pairings)

BassCliff says that anything below 60v needs to be replaced. Factory manual says anything below 80v.

My 2 questions:
1 - Could the stator be the the problem that I am experiencing with starting? The R+R is not original but I cannot tell the make/model.
2 - How significant is the low voltage? I'm trying to convince myself that this OK :confused:

OK - 1 more question: If I need a new stator, any great/special place to purchase one. I know I can get one from online sources (e.g. Bike Bandit, ...)

Thanks!
Mark
'83 Suzuki GR650
Click to expand...

You seem to have one or both of two problems:

  1. Really bad corrosion in the fuse box and the positive side of the battery.
  2. A failing stator

You test number one by measuring the voltage difference between your R/R(+) and the battery (+) while revving the engine to 5K RPM. This is Revised Phase A tests. That Drop off in voltage (between 2500 and 5000) is more than I have ever remember anybody reporting so I suspect it is at least something else as well. It is so bad that it could just easily be the stator failing at higher loads.

You should also do the revised Phase B stator tests which are leg to ground at 5K RPM. There should be no AC voltage between any leg and case ground. This is the most reliable test ; much better than using the ohm meter

If your stator is toasted, I would strongly recommend a SERIES R/R like the SH-775. The Stator pages have been revised or you can read GS stator in my signature.

If you take your VAC numbers at 4K RPM (54 VAC) and scale then by 5/4 (the ratio of 5K to 4K RPM) you get 67.5VAC which is borderline and would explain why you were able to get to 13.9V at 2500 RPM(a decent number). But after that the thing is falling flat on it's face.
 
Last edited:
Got my stator and RR. from www.electrosport.com great product.
Turns out the stator in my bike was fine, replaced the RR. and know i got 13.5v all day:cool:
 
G-3 said:
Got my stator and RR. from www.electrosport.com great product.
Turns out the stator in my bike was fine, replaced the RR. and know i got 13.5v all day:cool:
Click to expand...

13.5V is very low. :(

Do the quick test and report the results..............
 
So I spent some time cleaning connectors and re-ran the tests.

I now get 13.9v at the battery at 2500 RPMs and 13.9v at 5000 RPMs. No drop but no increase either.

For the between the legs stator test @ 5000RPMs, I get @ 78VAC.

For the legs to ground stator test @ 5000 RPMs, I get @ 38 VAC.

Based on the stator papers, it seems the stator is bad and I am in the market for another one.

Steve, based on the compatibility chart I saw on Amazon, a stator from 81-83 GS650 G or GL will work, or 81-82 GS650 E. Let me know if you have one that you are willing to sell. Otherwise is there a preferred place to get a new one?

Thanks for all your help!
Mark
 
"For the legs to ground stator test @ 5000 RPMs, I get @ 38 VAC. "

yes, you need a new stator - your current one might last a while, but......
PM Steve and also consider getting a SH-775 r/r to replace what you got now.
 
Yep, the voltage drop from stator leg to ground indicates some breakdown of the winding insulator. Stator replacement is in your future.
 
mnferwerda said:
So I spent some time cleaning connectors and re-ran the tests.

I now get 13.9v at the battery at 2500 RPMs and 13.9v at 5000 RPMs. No drop but no increase either.

For the between the legs stator test @ 5000RPMs, I get @ 78VAC.

For the legs to ground stator test @ 5000 RPMs, I get @ 38 VAC.

Based on the stator papers, it seems the stator is bad and I am in the market for another one.

Steve, based on the compatibility chart I saw on Amazon, a stator from 81-83 GS650 G or GL will work, or 81-82 GS650 E. Let me know if you have one that you are willing to sell. Otherwise is there a preferred place to get a new one?

Thanks for all your help!
Mark
Click to expand...


This is a perfect example why anything but fully loaded tests are nothing but an amusement for those looking to chase their own tail. While your leg to leg tests are fine, the leg to ground shows a clear problem with insulation break down.

The other cleaning will only help later provided you used something like DeOxit with it's preservative qualities.
 
So I replaced the stator (with one from a reputable vendor) and the regulator and rectifier (CompuFire). However when I check the stator doing the legs to ground test, I am getting approximately the same reading (40 VAC) as what I had with the previous one.

Before I go back to the vendor to complain about the stator, is there any other reason I am getting these readings? The other tests are good (resistance between legs are @ 1.5 ohms, @ 80VAC between legs).

FWIW, when I took out the old stator, it looked to be on pretty good shape. It was not burned anywhere and the coating on the wires looked to be in good shape. I'm wondering if I am looking in the wrong place...

Mark
 
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A little bump to see if anyone has ideas why I could be getting a bad reading on a brand new stator...
 
The only reason to get that reading is if the stator is shorted or you are not doing the measurement correctly.

Have you started the bike to see how it charges?


If you are really concerned you can buy one of these and it will improve a lot of voltage to test the windings. I would start on the lowest scale. On the lowest scale it produces +/-250V to look for break through of the insulation.

When you test your stator and it is producing 80 VAC then it is sort of a megger as well to check for short to ground.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VICHY-VC60B...781?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4874e97b25
 
Last edited:
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