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Is it my Starter?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bustedknuckles
  • Start date Start date
B

Bustedknuckles

Guest
1980 GS550E

First off, I have searched and looked through threads to try and sort my problem out but have had no luck in finding threads that actually relate to my problem...

So, I have rebuilt my carbs, replaced O-rings, intake boots and gaskets... the bike is stripped down and I am trying to dial-in the carbs while its running and trying to get it to run without the choke lever on (thats another issue i cant solve)...

I'll start it, try and tune it, eventually choke's out while I try to lower the choke lever while tuning and I'll start it back up. Done it about 8 times in a row by now... WELL, this last time I hit the starter button and *CLICK*. The solenoid is clicking but no starter action...

I have the battery charging just in case, but I left it on the charger overnight last night so I feel like it shouldn't be dead already. So I wanted to ask, Do you think my starter went out?

 
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8 starts in a short time?? And no recharging from the bike or a charger?? Yeah its that low and you need to recharge it. Its doesnt have the storage or cranking amps like a car battery. In fact, you can hook a car up with jumper cables as long as the car is not running. Many many many recranks with that.
 
well i already have an unfortunate update. Now i cant even get the solenoid to click. I turn the ignition and hit the start button and nothing. not even a click. Even worse, when i connect the two main posts on the solenoid (bypass everything) it still doesn't work, not even a spark...
 
If theres any charge at all in the battery it should at least make a spark. Hook up a car battery then report back. Riding lawn mower battery works well too.
 
Alrighty, so i hooked up my truck battery to the bike and the bike has gone back to just clicking when i hit the starter button. Still no starter action.

chuck hahn said:
8 starts in a short time?? And no recharging from the bike or a charger?? Yeah its that low and you need to recharge it. Its doesnt have the storage or cranking amps like a car battery. In fact, you can hook a car up with jumper cables as long as the car is not running. Many many many recranks with that.
Click to expand...

 
OK..so we have established the battery is way run down and the selinoid is good. Now take off the starter cover and check the connection there. And also give it a few decent knocks with your favorite hammer to see if its stuck. may be stuck and need to be opened up and get all the carbon fouling from the worn brushes out of the casing and bushings.
 
Once I had my starter motor quit suddenly. Turned out the lead wire rubber boot at the starter connection broke and the wire shorted out against the cover. So check for shorts.

Also, measure voltage at relay, if good before pullling the motor you may try bypassing the relay.

Hope that helps. Good luck.
 
Heck yea! so I popped the starter cover off and tapped it a couple times with my tac hammer. Tried it again and VROOM!

now I'm still dealing with the carb tuning issue though. I'm not sure if i have some issues I don't know about but I cant seem to get it to run consistently... I'll get it started, let it warm up for a second, then get it all the way off the choke and it SLOWLY reduces in RPM's all the way down to the point that it stalls.

I have adjusted the idle screw outside of normal parameters so I know that's not it. If i give it some throttle it livens back up but then slowly dies back down in RPM's until it stalls. I have the fuel screws turned out about 1-1.25 turns and the air screws out 1.25-1.75 turns... advice?

PS: I know it sounds similar to the classic "hanging Idle" due to intake leaks, but i have new intake boots, o rings and firmly clamped pod filters... So everything should be nice and tight...

chuck hahn said:
OK..so we have established the battery is way run down and the selinoid is good. Now take off the starter cover and check the connection there. And also give it a few decent knocks with your favorite hammer to see if its stuck. may be stuck and need to be opened up and get all the carbon fouling from the worn brushes out of the casing and bushings.
Click to expand...
 
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On a 1000, the bottom pilots react best at around 7/8 turns out..3/4 is a tad lean for my liking. Side mixture screws at 1 1/2 to 2 out as a start point. Basically she is way to rich and choking herself to death till you open the throttle so theres more air getting into the cylinders to make it a explosionable mixture again.

onve capable mixture.

On bikes with CV carbs, the mixture screw is at about 2 to 2 1/2 out as a good base point.
 
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chuck hahn said:
On a 1000, the bottom pilots react best at around 7/8 turns out..3/4 is a tad lean for my liking. Side mixture screws at 1 1/2 to 2 out as a start point.

On bikes with CV carbs, the mixture screw is at about 2 to 2 1/2 out as a good base point.
Click to expand...


Something important I may have left out, I have old VM carbs put on my bike with the help of some intake boot adapters. the bike is supposed to have CV's so that may be one of the reasons I'm having such issues tuning...
 
So we are talking about the 550 then?? Still at the 7/8 you should have enough fuel in the pilot circuit to make it run.and the 2 out on the mixtures should be about ok too. If not too happy, then try the bottoms at 3/4.but I think youll find 7/8 more likeable.

And then fine tun with the mixture screws up top. Turning them IN will RICHEN the mix and out will lean it out.
 
Yes the 550.

So, I have the fuel screws set to about 7/8 of a turn out. and the air screws set to about 2 turns out. I started the bike up with full choke and it will idle decently. but even after warming up It will stall out and die if I try to take the choke off. :-k

Soooo, too lean right? so i dialed the air screws in about 1/2 a turn but same thing, It wont run without having the choke on all the way, even after warming up. I've played around even more from there trying different air screw settings but same thing every time. There is frequent popping coming from some of the carbs but i cant remember what that means... any advice?
 
Popping is usally a lean situation and its periodically igniting the fuel that is getting there.

Have you rebuilt these carbs fully? I dont recall the specifics off hand. And when adjusting the mixture screws do little increments at a time..like 1/8 turns. You can very easily skip over that sweet spot and go from too ruich to too lean and get the same results. And also you have to give it a few seconds for the cylinders to restabalise from the setting changes. Work slow and in small bites.

When it dies, have you check the bowls to see how much fuel flows..decent amounts or just a trickle??? Are you positive the float hts are right...measured from the carb body WITHOUT a gasket in place? Roughly 26MM if I remember the VM settings right.

Will it stay running indefinitely with the choke out? If so, its at least getting "some " fuel to the bowls. But the question then is how much and at what levels???

Seems to me that if It was my bike, I would be pulling the carbs and rechecking everything again...float hts, piilot jets and emulsion tubes to see that no junk has reclogged something..especially the tiny hole at the very tip of the pilots. takes nect to nothing to clog that hole. A wire from a hand held wire brush works well to poke it out.
 
Carbs are fully rebuilt, Clean as heck, and everything has been checked and double checked, the floats are set correctly and all bowls are filling quickly with fuel.

As far as adjusting the screws, I have moved them all over the freakin place using small increments and its the same dang thing every single time... It wont run without having the choke on all the way...

Are my jets wrong? I bought new jets under several peoples recommendation but have now been told by a different GS'er that i should have kept the originals that were already in it. (wonderful, I already tossed them)

I cant think of anything else to try...




 
Stock is a 95 main and a 15 pilot. Seeing that these are the base jets for the 1000, why would you ADD more fuel flow in to an engine with way LESS CCs??? Doesnt that seem a a little ridiculous to you?

I would go back to the stockers and start all over again with the screws set like i said. And the manual state the float hts to be 23 to 25 MM. And look at the plugs..are they gas wet or got powdery looking soot on them??
 
chuck hahn said:
Stock is a 95 main and a 15 pilot. Seeing that these are the base jets for the 1000, why would you ADD more fuel flow in to an engine with way LESS CCs??? Doesnt that seem a a little ridiculous to you?

I would go back to the stockers and start all over again with the screws set like i said. And the manual state the float hts to be 23 to 25 MM. And look at the plugs..are they gas wet or got powdery looking soot on them??
Click to expand...

Thats a major part of my problem, I know nothing about these carbs and just have a basic understanding on jetting & tuning. The carbs arent even the right ones for the bike, so almost everything is guess work and I'm not educated enough on this stuff to get it right it appears...

On top of that everyone keeps giving me different information and recommending different jets. So now I don't even know where to re-start.

As for your recommendations, the carbs had #40 pilots in it when i opened them up and someone recommended bumping that up one size to 42.5 because of the pods, so i did. I'm not sure where you are getting #15 from. They also had 92.5 mains origionally. and it was recommended bumping that up 3 sizes due to the pods. So i did, up to the #100's that I currently have.

So again, at this point I have no idea where to even re-start. Ive had so many different jet sizes tossed at me, screw starting points recommended and general suggestions on "what most likely is my problem" that I don't even know who to listen to.
 
I am getting my information directly from my OEM Suzuki Factory Service Manual setting on my bench.
 
I apologize If I made it seem accusatory. I promise that wasnt the intention! But again thats part of my problem, These carbs arent the factory ones for the bike so many of the reccommendations I am getting are irrelevant or WAY off.

I understand I have a very unique issue and thats why I am reaching out to everyone. Do I go stock for the 550cc motor? or back to stock for the carbs? Again I dont even know what bike these carbs are off of, so even stock jets for the carbs would probably be way off... and If i try to go stock for the motor, I have to figure out what that would translate to on THESE carbs... I'm kinda clueless on how to proceed.

chuck hahn said:
I am getting my information directly from my OEM Suzuki Factory Service Manual setting on my bench.
Click to expand...
 
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I would go back to the stock for the carbs. The early early 550s had VM22s which are basically the exact same as the 26s but with a smaller throat bore. I am wondering if you got the stock jetting for the early 550 VM22s and set yopur carbs up that way it would be better??

Click on the STICKY at the top of the carb / exhaust section and fli[p thru and see if anyopne had added the early 550 specs to the archieves.
 
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