New Member, found an old GS650GL

[slickware]

Hm.

Wonder if I'd be better off installing something like a small 2" funnel then, instead of my high-class sink strainers.

I couldn't find a single other forum post from someone claiming to have accurately tuned K&N pods - most said "forget about ever getting it right", and the rest said "just go up a jet size".

I did find one post about a guy who installed velocity stacks inside the K&N pods. I believe his final thoughts were "I don't know if it works, but it sure looks like it should".

 

[tkent02]

Why not jet it properly and get a bunch of power and efficiency out of it?

 

[slickware]

I tried... I went up 3 jet sizes, in increments of 1, until I started having gas pour out of the carbs while still running too lean.
Ended up settling on +2 mains and a sink strainer.
What would your troubleshooting process be to get it to be jetted properly, in this case?

 

[tkent02]

I tried... I went up 3 jet sizes, in increments of 1, until I started having gas pour out of the carbs while still running too lean.

Pouring out of the carbs where? Sounds like a float problem. It shouldn't do this no matter what jets you use.

Stock main jets are 110 I believe? What size did you use? Which jet needle?
What else have you done to the carburetors?

Just lloooked bck through your earlier pictures, those are not K&N pods at all, but the crappy Emgo sand sifters. They flow no air, filter nothing, and are untuneable becuae they have terrible airflow. Start over, get some K&Ns and a real jet kit.. You still need to find out why it's overflowing.

 

[slickware]

Ok, well, 'pouring' might have been exaggerating. But when I removed the pods, there was a decent slick of gas on the inner air pod boot. (I also tried adding some foam inside the pods to create additional restriction, and the foam would also get saturated with gas - pretty sopping wet with gas, really.)

I changed out the mains, as per "post-K&N re-jetting" instructions. Stocks are 110. I tried 112.5, 115, 117 (IIRC... been a few weeks, but those were the only "next" sizes available.)

I also set the float heights on all 4 carbs with calipers. They're dead on (and were within ~1mm to begin with, surprisingly).

Other than that, all I've done to the carbs is taken them apart and cleaned/blown them out, made sure all pathways were clear. Believe the idle/air screws are 2.5 turns out.

The reason I went with restricting the K&Ns, rather than adding even more gas to the equation, was because something as simple as putting a sock over the K&Ns (when the 117 jets were in) would get the bike running close to correctly.
I really don't think the issue is the carbs, I think it's that the carbs were never designed to run with 0 air restriction - not without perhaps changing out ALL the jets AND making other exhaust and engine modifications, anyway. But there I'm just guessing, really.

 

[tkent02]

I edited my last post...

 

[slickware]

Damn dimecitycycles has them listed as "K&N style air pods".

How can they "flow no air", yet clearly be allowing unrestricted airflow?

And, not being rude here just genuinely curious - can there really be any serious performance difference between these and K&N-brand pods, airflow-wise? Where is the difference, just in the filter material? Or also in the shape?

Here's another question - should I be able to get the bike to idle and run without any filters on the carbs at all, just totally open? Assuming the rest of the bike is stock, what would you imagine the main jets would be at for this? (I'm not going to do it, I just want a baseline for zero-restriction on air)

 

[tkent02]

Damn dimecitycycles has them listed as "K&N style air pods".

How can they "flow no air", yet clearly be allowing unrestricted airflow?

And, not being rude here just genuinely curious - can there really be any serious performance difference between these and K&N-brand pods, airflow-wise? Where is the difference, just in the filter material? Or also in the shape?

Here's another question - should I be able to get the bike to idle and run without any filters on the carbs at all, just totally open? Assuming the rest of the bike is stock, what would you imagine the main jets would be at for this? (I'm not going to do it, I just want a baseline for zero-restriction on air)

K&N Style, is not K&N at all. Just means they look a little like K&Ns from a distance.
OK, first, the K&N are shaped like a velocity stack inside, the Emgos are not. The screw up the airflow, turbulence. They do not flow as much air, and they really don't filter well at all. Look inside after running a while, there will be all kinds of dust and crap in there. IT's just a screen, like a sifter. The K&N are gause, held in place by a screen, and covered with sticky oil.. Much different.
Totally open it wil start and idle, but wont run much at all when you open the throttle.
The main jet is the easy part, probably about a 130 to go with K&N pods. Maybe more or maybe less, but in that neighborhood. The hard part is th jet needle, that's where the jet kit comes in. It has different needles with more taper, designed for the use of pods.

 

[slickware]

Totally open it wil start and idle, but wont run much at all when you open the throttle.

This is exactly the experience I had with these pods on the bike, prior to installing the sink-drains.

IT's just a screen, like a sifter. The K&N are gause, held in place by a screen, and covered with sticky oil.. Much different.

I don't doubt that they are cheaper/crappier, but a visual inspection of the filter on the ones I have looks exactly like any K&N I've ever had. Dark grey foamy pad, sandwiched between a metal mesh, which I then sprayed K&N oil on to coat. It may be a lower quality filter, but it's definitely a filter of some kind.

The main jet is the easy part, probably about a 130 to go with K&N pods.

Curious - that's a big jump, what, nearly 7 or 10 jet sizes? Why does it seem that every other source online only wants a +1 jet increase for K&Ns?

~A

 

[Guest]

K&N Style, is not K&N at all. Just means they look a little like K&Ns from a distance.
OK, first, the K&N are shaped like a velocity stack inside, the Emgos are not. The screw up the airflow, turbulence. They do not flow as much air, and they really don't filter well at all. Look inside after running a while, there will be all kinds of dust and crap in there. IT's just a screen, like a sifter. The K&N are gause, held in place by a screen, and covered with sticky oil.. Much different.
Totally open it wil start and idle, but wont run much at all when you open the throttle.
The main jet is the easy part, probably about a 130 to go with K&N pods. Maybe more or maybe less, but in that neighborhood. The hard part is th jet needle, that's where the jet kit comes in. It has different needles with more taper, designed for the use of pods.

Hey tkent02, question for you...Ive had to replace the airbox on my GS650GL as well with pods and ended up with K&N "style" pods, you have any resources on where to find actual K&N pods? On their website i cant find anything that would work.