New tires, alignment / brake issues

[scott]

I don't know what you're looking at either. But I'm pretty sure it aint good. You had better pull the pads for inspection.

That stuff was just sitting on the pads, it pulled off. I don't see any shoulder on the pads as described in the manual but I assume the depth of the notch is what indicates the pads are still good.

Here's the calipers:

 

[bccap]

Looks like there is still meat there. But they also look damaged. Take a good picture of the disk as well. I would pm Nessim and ask him to have a look at this thread. He knows brakes really well. Also add those pads to the list of things that shop should replace for free.

 

[scott]

Looks like there is still meat there. But they also look damaged.

I sanded the brake pads so maybe that will help. I sprayed a little brake cleaner in the calipers and put them back on. My brakes SEEM simpler than the ones in BassCliff's guide - I just stuck the pads in and put the calipers around them. Maybe I did something wrong but I didn't have to hold things place (my model doesn't have a shim pad on the brake pad and if there was a top guide pad, I didn't have to hold it in place.

I picked up a 14mm washer (no luck at Lowes, had to get a 25 pack at a store called Fastenal). I reassembled to hand-tight and did the rocking/shaking routine. It doesn't seem like the washer made that much of a difference in the location of the disk between the pads. There's still light resistance.

I took a video of the wheel rotating. Everything is only hand tight at this point though. Is this amount of resistance okay? There's a bit of rattling too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjNOFTgCzQ

Take a good picture of the disk as well. I would pm Nessim and ask him to have a look at this thread. He knows brakes really well. Also add those pads to the list of things that shop should replace for free.

Here's a pic of the inside of the brake disc:

 

[bccap]

Viewed your video. I'd say your good to go. Regarding the mounting of the pads. I don't know as mine has clips and 2 rods that hold them in place. Your disk is scored, which will probably result in shorter pad life. Go out and try it, carefully at first.

 

[bonanzadave]

Viewed your video.

Me too. Looks like the tire is better aligned with the fender

 

[Nessism]

Hi Scott,

That shop really screwed you over. Sorry to hear about this. Please don't ever take your bike to a shop again.

Sounds like you are getting sorted on this so keep going with it. Regarding your brakes, if I were you I'd take this situation as a clue and do a full tear down. It's actually very easy work, only a little messy. Pop the caliper piston out, clean out all the sludge in both the caliper and master cylinder, and replace that old spongy rubber brake line. I have some extra pads I'll let you have for cheap to get you started.

PM me with any specific questions you may have.

Good luck

Ed

 

[scott]

Viewed your video. I'd say your good to go. Regarding the mounting of the pads. I don't know as mine has clips and 2 rods that hold them in place. Your disk is scored, which will probably result in shorter pad life. Go out and try it, carefully at first.

Me too. Looks like the tire is better aligned with the fender

I'll get it all the bolts tight and give it a try.

That shop really screwed you over. Sorry to hear about this. Please don't ever take your bike to a shop again.

Ha - so I hear. Would it surprise you that the shop has a very good reputation and seem to specialize in old bikes?

Sounds like you are getting sorted on this so keep going with it. Regarding your brakes, if I were you I'd take this situation as a clue and do a full tear down. It's actually very easy work, only a little messy. Pop the caliper piston out, clean out all the sludge in both the caliper and master cylinder, and replace that old spongy rubber brake line. I have some extra pads I'll let you have for cheap to get you started.

Thanks for your input. I'll definitely look into the brake rebuild. I assume it's a top priority but not a "you're risking your life riding on those brakes" kind of thing.

 

[bccap]

Just one last thing. Check your tire pressures. My shop sent me out the door with 50 lb.'s. Which is the pressure they use to pop the bead. Also tighten fender brace bolts last.

 

[scott]

I wasn't able to get the axle nut torqued to even the minimum 26 lb-ft. There's not really anything to wedge a screw driver on.

The fork pinch bolts are torqued to 16 lb-ft which is in the middle of the range. The caps are not completely "closed" on either side with that torque. Also, I forced the right fork flush with the spacer before tightening the fork caps but the left fork doesn't look exactly flush now. Maybe my forks are bent or it's the fork springs like TCK was saying.

Just one last thing. Check your tire pressures. My shop sent me out the door with 50 lb.'s. Which is the pressure they use to pop the bead. Also tighten fender brace bolts last.

My tire pressures actually seem a bit low - Front 26 PSI, Rear 29 PSI

 

[scott]

I wasn't able to get the axle nut torqued to even the minimum 26 lb-ft. There's not really anything to wedge a screw driver on.

Well I addressed this. I held on to the screwdriver and had my wife (gotta use what's around - ha) put her weight on the torque wrench. It was surprisingly easy - makes me wonder why I had so much trouble doing it with one hand. Anyway, it's torqued to around 31 lb-ft which is right in the middle of the manual's range.

I still have the issues with the forks not being flush with the spacers and the potential issue with the fork caps not being "closed" all the way even though they are torqued correctly. But I was most concerned with the axle bolt.

I think it may be safe enough to give it a try at least.

 

[bccap]

I assume everything was fine before you went into the shop ? Therefore I don't think your fork is bent, and I don't think the spring is causing this. With the fork brace bolts really slack, slack enough that it will rattle around. Start again, with everything slackened. Shake each fork a bit, then get on the bike and pump them up and down. A little space in the caps is fine. Look at your original photos. The washer you bought might be thinner than OEM. Give the wheel another spin, to make sure everything is free. Tighten the cap nuts, then torque the axle nut. When you reach minimum torque, start lining it up with the cotter pin. Once that is all done tighten the fork brace bolts. If you can't torque it down enough, drive it over to friend and get his help. Just make sure that cotter pin is in.

 

[scott]

I assume everything was fine before you went into the shop ? Therefore I don't think your fork is bent, and I don't think the spring is causing this.

I never checked the forks before so I can't say for sure.

With the fork brace bolts really slack, slack enough that it will rattle around. Start again, with everything slackened. Shake each fork a bit, then get on the bike and pump them up and down. A little space in the caps is fine. Look at your original photos. The washer you bought might be thinner than OEM. Give the wheel another spin, to make sure everything is free. Tighten the cap nuts, then torque the axle nut. When you reach minimum torque, start lining it up with the cotter pin. Once that is all done tighten the fork brace bolts. If you can't torque it down enough, drive it over to friend and get his help. Just make sure that cotter pin is in.

That's how I did it. I went for a quick spin. It seemed okay - no problems pushing it either. I'll give it another inspection to see if everything still looks right. I may loosen the fender bolts again and try to get it straighter.

 

[Guest]

Just about the same thing happened to me when I first got my bike. The shop broke my speedometer cable (granted, it was almost rusted through, but it worked), they flipped one of the spacers around putting the flanged end on the outside of the fork cap. This caused the assembly to be the width of that flange short, binding the disk and clipping the rivets on the disk against the caliper when the axle bolt was tightened. They also changed the tires using the old tubes. No more shop trained Orangutangs working on my bike.

 

[scott]

Just about the same thing happened to me when I first got my bike. The shop broke my speedometer cable (granted, it was almost rusted through, but it worked), they flipped one of the spacers around putting the flanged end on the outside of the fork cap. This caused the assembly to be the width of that flange short, binding the disk and clipping the rivets on the disk against the caliper when the axle bolt was tightened. They also changed the tires using the old tubes. No more shop trained Orangutangs working on my bike.

Hmm - maybe it's a thing with Virginia shops ...

 

[scott]

Well I had planned to take a ride yesterday to see how the front wheel / brakes were working. I had just turned out of my neighborhood on a steep downhill and *pop* - my clutch cable snapped! I turned off at the next road, made a u-turn and was going to try to return home without stopping (probably not a wise plan). I couldn't make the turn back onto the road home because a car was coming so I had to stop, stalling it in the road at a stop sign. Eventually I figured out I could get it into neutral by pushing the bike a little to ease it into neutral (didn't think that would work without the clutch). So I rolled it to the side of the road.

I had my wife come pick me up. I packed up some tools and a clutch cable (lucky I had one on hand already) and changed it out on the side of the road using the guide on BassCliff's site. The guide says "replacement time is 10-15 minutes for an experienced mechanic" , well it probably took me an hour but I didn't run into any hiccups. I couldn't believe there were about 2 handfuls of dirt behind that cover! While annoying, I was pretty fortunate: it happened close to home, I had a spare cable on hand, and I didn't really encounter any issues doing the replacement.

I was able to ride the bike home just as it started storming. It was a very brief ride but the front wheel and brakes SEEM to be working well. We're expecting more storms for the next few days but I'll see if I can get ride in during the breaks to get a more appropriate test.

Thanks for all the help getting me back on the road!

 

[Guest]

If it was in Leesburg, maybe it was the same shop. That experience along with others lead me to learn to do it myself.