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No power to rear wheel. Not the hub splines. HELP

  • Thread starter Thread starter jchaplick21
  • Start date Start date
You won't find it in the manual because it is not the official way of doing it. There should be lots of results to a search for "secondary drive". Its definitely less work than pulling the engine, but it still takes a great deal of effort.

I would check the clutch again first. You said you fixed it. What, exactly, did you do in there?
 
londonboards said:
Could this be your problem:

Bevel drive broken

See if you can remove the rubber housing at the end of the shaft (engine end) and see into the universal joint.
Click to expand...

I'll give it a look tomorrow when I have more light. What exactly am I looking for? I've peeled the boot back before but I didn't really know what to look for.
 
matt1100 said:
You won't find it in the manual because it is not the official way of doing it. There should be lots of results to a search for "secondary drive". Its definitely less work than pulling the engine, but it still takes a great deal of effort.

I would check the clutch again first. You said you fixed it. What, exactly, did you do in there?
Click to expand...

Well I took it apart obviously, the clutch plates were incredibly worn, they had zero friction surface left and a few nicks. The steel plates weren't too bad, a couple were pretty discolored but they weren't out of spec, I replaced them all anyway. There isn't Amy rocking or shifting in the basket. The basket isn't discolored or scored. I also pulled and inspected the bearings behind the pressure plate and relubricated them. The piano wire seal is also in good shape along with the metal gasket behind it.

Once reassembled the pressure plate and clutch plates spin together, either manually or while the bike is running. By looking at the drawings if the pressure plate spins with the clutch it should be transferring to the transmission I think.
 
Fair enough. Sounds Like a thorough job. It well may be in thte secondary then. I think the manual will walk you through removing the tire and swing arm. Then you are loosening the bolts which hold the cases together near the secondary to release some of the clamping force the cases have on the output chunk. At the point the chunk still won't quite clear the frame, so removing the rear mounting bolts and loosening most of the front ones allows the back of the engine to be tilted up a hair with a pry bar, jack, or hoist. At that point the output piece should come out with very gentle coaxing. From there you can examine the gear set.

Good Luck!
 
matt1100 said:
Fair enough. Sounds Like a thorough job. It well may be in thte secondary then. I think the manual will walk you through removing the tire and swing arm. Then you are loosening the bolts which hold the cases together near the secondary to release some of the clamping force the cases have on the output chunk. At the point the chunk still won't quite clear the frame, so removing the rear mounting bolts and loosening most of the front ones allows the back of the engine to be tilted up a hair with a pry bar, jack, or hoist. At that point the output piece should come out with very gentle coaxing. From there you can examine the gear set.

Good Luck!
Click to expand...

Thanks so much, this is exactly what I was looking for.

I started the breakdown last night, I replaced and relubricated the hub splines with a new unit, so at least that won't be an issue. Now I just have to slowly work through the rest of the breakdown.

Is it necessary to drain all the oil again to remove the drive gears like you explained?
 
jchaplick21 said:
I started the breakdown last night, I replaced and relubricated the hub splines with a new unit, so at least that won't be an issue.
Click to expand...

What kind of grease did you use on the spline? Honda Moly 60 is popular in that application although I think it's been discontinued.
 
Nessism said:
What kind of grease did you use on the spline? Honda Moly 60 is popular in that application although I think it's been discontinued.
Click to expand...

I searched for honda molly 60, but couldnt find it anywhere. I dont remember the brand, but I settled with the highest percent moly grease I could find.
 
jchaplick21 said:
I searched for honda molly 60, but couldnt find it anywhere. I dont remember the brand, but I settled with the highest percent moly grease I could find.
Click to expand...

Go to a Honda dealer. They now sell moly 77, which they say is as good (maybe better?).
 
jchaplick21, pm me. I fortunately still have the manual downloaded. I can try to email it to you, if it isn't too big to email. it's the manual from bassclif's site.
 
In the 1100 the gear oil and engine oil are separated. So, you can drain the gear oil without affecting the engine oil. Unless the seal between them goes, which is a whole other ugly can of worms. If the 650 is the same there is a drain below the drive half of the secondary gear (the big black circle under the cover the shifter sticks through.) You may puke when you see what comes out of there. I don't think mine had ever been changed before I got it 6 years ago.
 
The 650 shafties just use the crankcase oil to lubricate the secondary drive gears. There is a drain hole if you want to drain the small amount of oil that doesn't drift back to the main cavity.
 
matt1100 said:
Fair enough. Sounds Like a thorough job. It well may be in thte secondary then. I think the manual will walk you through removing the tire and swing arm. Then you are loosening the bolts which hold the cases together near the secondary to release some of the clamping force the cases have on the output chunk. At the point the chunk still won't quite clear the frame, so removing the rear mounting bolts and loosening most of the front ones allows the back of the engine to be tilted up a hair with a pry bar, jack, or hoist. At that point the output piece should come out with very gentle coaxing. From there you can examine the gear set.

Good Luck!
Click to expand...

Where exactly are the bolts to release tention? I have the entire rear end taken down, but I cant get the secondary to budge even a little. It doesnt look like I am going to have to tilt the frame on the 650, there doesnt SEEM to be a clearance issue. But like I said, I cant get the secondary to budge at all, I must be doing the release of tention incorrectly.
 
they are talking about loosening the case perimeter bolts around the secondary drive. you don't need to loosen them all, just enough to give you some wiggle on that thing
 
Ok, after that, if I pull on the drive shaft (I have that removed but Im not sure what to call the remaining piece thats there) the secondary drive should just pull free?
 
tom203 said:
Even with crankcase bolts loosened, it's likely to fight you- probably have to pry it loose. Mark the existing orientation of bearing housing (part #16) on a crankcase half for fitup later and note shims that come off. This was a precision fitup at factory to get those gears close to perfect mating

http://www.alpha-sports.com/spst/1981 GS650GL/45.htm?q=suzuki-parts
Click to expand...

Ok, good idea. If its that hard to get out, will it be impossible to get back in?
 
jchaplick21 said:
Ok, good idea. If its that hard to get out, will it be impossible to get back in?
Click to expand...
Nope- it will tap back nicely And mesh gears. I hope that you find a real obvious problem in the secondary drive gears, but I'm skeptical that the 650 has the umph to damage anything but the clutch itself .
 
Actually, before i started having issues with they dyna, i was able to get the front off the ground while doing some test rides. There's a street i use on the weekends that doesn't see much traffic, and i got the front off the ground just a bit. I'd say it has enough. And they are also supposed to have 73 rwhp
 
tom203 said:
Nope- it will tap back nicely And mesh gears. I hope that you find a real obvious problem in the secondary drive gears, but I'm skeptical that the 650 has the umph to damage anything but the clutch itself .
Click to expand...

I do too, after replacing the clutch drive and driven plates, along with the springs, what else do you think it could be? Im really starting to run out of ideas.
 
Get this thing in 5th gear- rotate rear wheel and shift until you're sure that you are in fifth. This trans is unique in that when in 5th the trans input shaft from clutch is locked to the output shaft to secondary bevel gears- no trans gears needed or used, direct drive from clutch to bevel gears. Can you test it to see if it still slips like this?
 
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