No Spark either side till i release the starter button

[Guest]

1982 GS 450A.
I too am working a no spark and voltage loss issue.
No coils. but not 100% sure what's on it since I've not done that deep. just pulled off the right-side cover to make sure the engine was seized and it's an electronic setup

My tests results are below, but I only spent an hour so they are incomplete and will have to shelve the bike to work on something else.

12.67 volts at the battery (new battery but I didn't charge it up. but it will hold easily 13.6x volts when fully charge)
Lose about 2 volts at the orange and white wires when key is on and not cranking
Lose about 4 volts total when cranking.

I took the switch apart and seems I'm missing the metal plate that when you move the toggle to RUN, it bridges the 2 poles.

I did find the small spring had fallen sideways and it seems this was bridging when in the RUN position making contact before I took the switch apart.
I fixed that and put the ball bearing so it springs in the detent. Of course now. no bridge so no crank.

So I will either need to make a repair of find a substitute for the switch to fix that bridge part.

Now when manually bridging the switch poles with a screwdriver, I see a yellow spark (key on, not cranking) at the plugs.

Saw someone mentioned this seems to be common.
Plan is to fix or bypass the switch since if that's not working, nothing will.
Also made a cable to go from the hotside of the solenoid to both orange/white positive coil leads, but got busy on the switch and never tried the combo of bridging and cranking.

Best way to approach this when I work on it again in a month?

Sources for acceptable switches others have used? I could probably find a toggle and rig it in or just replace the entire switch / horn unit.

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[Guest]

Would anyone have a photo or schematic of the switch components?
Mostly looking for the elements of the red rocker part (springs, ball bearing, contact plate)

I may have to fabricate one, but since I'm missing they key element that makes the connection to the terminals I'm not quite sure what I'm fabricating, and how it will attach.

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[Rich82GS750TZ]

Had mine apart recently to clean. These were the only pics I took. The only thing that helped me reassemble it appeared to be heightened levels of swearing. Hope it helps.

 

[Guest]

Thank you for the photos.
Looks like I may be missing two parts. There is a spring behind the u shaped contact?

Does that contact just float on the spring?

On the big spring, was the order from outside, plastic starter button,copper hat, spring?

Hope I can make a replacement

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

I’ll try to get you some clearer pictures in the morning, it I can do it without taking it all apart.

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

File this under- ?No good deed goes unpunished?
I was only going to take the switch apart to just before point where the bb/ball bearing on top of the spring had to come out. Well, I couldn?t get clear pics that way, so I went all the way in. Hope the pics help. I can?t put that switch back together until I find that bb. I may have to deconstruct some shotgun shells to see if I can find one the right size.

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

Looks like #6 shot size might work. Wish me luck.

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

SUCCESS!

Back together. I hope to God I never have to take this switch apart again.

 

[Guest]

Thanks, those will help greatly.
I suspect when I opened it up. the copper plate shot a mile into the yard.
Should know better that to work on anything like this other that in a rubber room.
Will try to make the contact and find a spring to hold the tension, though my red switch may be broken some. Will tear it apart again and check the neighbors 3-d printer for use

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[Big T]

For disassembly, put the switch in a large zip lock bag and work on it in there

Flying parts are contained

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

For disassembly, put the switch in a large zip lock bag and work on it in there

Flying parts are contained

Yeah, I know better, but was trying to take pics for illustration purposes for the OP. Mine is back together thanks to a #6 410 shotgun shell. Got lots of extra BBs if anyone needs a couple.

 

[Guest]

For disassembly, put the switch in a large zip lock bag and work on it in there

Flying parts are contained

I had this same excellent idea. You know when? Right after the switch came apart in my hand over a leaves, dirt and the bike.
I should be able to make the parts, just takes some time and patience. Probably can find a suitable spring..

Or maybe I will replace the switch with something else that fits close and can be epoxied or affixed in.
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[Grimly]

Retractable ballpoint pens contain useful springs.

 

[Guest]

Retractable ballpoint pens contain useful springs.

Yup, right there with you. Hav e some copper pipe I will flatten a and bend for the contact

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[Guest]

So once I get the switch rebuilt, what is the issue with the no spark until the starter button is actually released? Is that just a recontact being made?

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[Guest]

In looking over other bikes and quads that had this issue it seems like it could be just about anything but the low-voltage condition certainly is not helping. So I?ll have to clean everything up. For my Honda I have three spare CDI?s for the Suzuki I have no spare CDI?s

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[pdqford]

So once I get the switch rebuilt, what is the issue with the no spark until the starter button is actually released? Is that just a recontact being made?alt

I suspect the starter button might some how be feeding voltage to the coils and when you release the starter button the primary coil circuit collapses, causing the secondary to throw a spark.

Have you ever seen this machine run?

 

[Grimly]

It's a fairly common fault on various vehicles for many decades back, that a starter pulls down the system voltage so far that the coils can't spark. So when you release the starter button, the engine is still spinning and the coils are momentarily fed with sufficient voltage to generate a spark. This applies to points and electronic systems alike.
The fault is commonly a dying battery or dirty connections, but might be caused by a starter drawing too much current.

 

[Guest]

I suspect the starter button might some how be feeding voltage to the coils and when you release the starter button the primary coil circuit collapses, causing the secondary to throw a spark.

Have you ever seen this machine run?

I have not seen it run yet. The bike has set since 2016 with the previous owner in the shed. So I picked it up and I?m working on it. I did do the stater check in the stander seems like it tastes OK but since it sat in the shed for a long time I suspect I?ll just need to clean all the electronic connections.

 

[Guest]

... for the Suzuki I have no spare CDI’s.

That is a very easy situation to acheive, as Suzuki never included a CDI on any of their bikes.