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Offsets for 4.5 and 5.5 answers

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I have been getting inquireries about using a 4.5" wheel to lessin the offset and gain more frame clearance. It just isn't so. the 4.5/5.5 wheels are the same distance between the bearings so to center the wheel they both will require a 5/8 offset front sprocket.

I know there has been debate about this so I am posting pics of the measurements I have taken. They are both 7 1/16" wide at the bearings. If anyone has a loose "86 gsxr 3.5" wheel to check I think you will find the same measurements as the 5.5 as well.

So the best I can figure is they are the same so go BIG or go home.

wdiff.jpg

wdiff2.jpg
 
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Katman,

The issue (for me) has only to do with the chain rubbing on the frame, other than that I agree with you, go big. I agree with your assessment about rear hub spacing of various options not being a problem. I have a 170 RF900 rear wheel, mounted with the GS hub, and the rear sprocket mounted in reverse with 3/8" offset front sprocket on 82 1100 with a bandit swingarm.

Will a 5/8" front offset provide proper chain alignment with a 180 wheel without the chain rubbing the frame? I seem to remember you having issues with chain rubbing during your Katana build.

Also won't the 180 tire be wider and closer to the chain guard? What are you doing about chain guards on your conversions?
 
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katman said:
I have been getting inquireries about using a 4.5" wheel to lessin the offset and gain more frame clearance. It just isn't so. the 4.5/5.5 wheels are the same distance between the bearings so to center the wheel they both will require a 5/8 offset front sprocket.

I know there has been debate about this so I am posting pics of the measurements I have taken. They are both 7 1/16" wide at the bearings. If anyone has a loose "86 gsxr 3.5" wheel to check I think you will find the same measurements as the 5.5 as well.

So the best I can figure is they are the same so go BIG or go home.

wdiff.jpg

wdiff2.jpg
Click to expand...
Rob, NOT true on the 18" GSXR wheel required offset. It only takes a 5 mm spacer behind the countershaft sprocket to get it right. I know because this was the setup I had on an 87 1100 wheel on one of my dragbikes. AND, it was still a 630 setup. I had Sprocket Specialists make the sprocket for it for the GSXR wheel. I believe that wheel was 18 X 4.00. Hope this helps. Ray.
 
isleoman said:
Katman,

The issue (for me) has only to do with the chain rubbing on the frame, other than that I agree with you, go big. I agree with your assessment about rear hub spacing of various options not being a problem. I have a 170 RF900 rear wheel, mounted with the GS hub, and the rear sprocket mounted in reverse with 3/8" offset front sprocket on 82 1100 with a bandit swingarm.

Will a 5/8" front offset provide proper chain alignment with a 180 wheel without the chain rubbing the frame? I seem to remember you having issues with chain rubbing during your Katana build.

Also won't the 180 tire be wider and closer to the chain guard? What are you doing about chain guards on your conversions?
Click to expand...

Thats where it can make a difference. if with a 160 or 170 tire you can machine down the sprocket carrier, flip around the sprocket if it has relief and bring the chain closer to the center line of the wheel. 3/8?? thats 1/4" diff. the spocket turned around doesn't gain you that distance.

also make sure you don't use the gsxr sprocket carrier. It is a couple mm closer to the frame than the gs.

I don't run a chain guard as the dual shock mounts run right through the chain guard mount. I believe "Solosuzuki" has made a custom fabbed guard and has done a bang up job on it. Looks real good. He has cut into the guard so it wraps the shock.

My issue is with the front end of hte guard. It has to be cut short cuz it won't fit between the frame and the chain.
 
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I just checked and I'm using the GS sprocket carrier.

I think were in total agreement now. The notch to the frame to allow the use of 5/8 offset may be a minor thing but I didn't want to have to go that route.

My set up doesn't tickle frame and sprockets seem to be well aligned and after 5000 miles are not wearing abnormally.

Here is a thread on how I modified my Bandit Chain guard.
http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=120364&highlight=chain

Do you use the rubber Bandit chain scuff pad on the top of the swing arm? I'm using mine but you have to hog out a lot of rubber with a retractable knife to make it fit in the frame.
 
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I run a Bandit rear end too and I didn't use the rubber guard at the front of the swing arm. I just took 2 pieces of neoprene and glued them on with a decent adhesive. Served the same purpose.
 
I also put on a set of 95 GSXR 17 x 5.5 wheels have a bandit 1200 swingarm on my GS1100 and kept my rubber chain gaurd. With my setup, the chain guard still keeps the chain from hitting the swingarm so I recommend that you use it. If I recall correctly, I think I had to shave it down a bit to keep it from binding near the pivot point and frame.

As for the chain clearance issues and frustrations, I have already been there dont that!! Here is what I did! I used the GS hub which is the way to go. As for the sprocket, I had no luck using a 5/8 offset like other have done. Had issues with the chain rubbing the frame.

I tryed out a AFAM 13MM 17 tooth 530 chain offset sprocket which has a little bit less of a offset compared to the 5/8 sprocket. I also ordered a rivet type master link for my chain too! I was pleased to find out that with this combo, I was able to resolve my frame to chain or chain to tire clearance problems.

Check out the link below for more photos and details.
http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=115688
 
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kichigai said:
I also put on a set of 95 GSXR 17 x 5.5 wheels have a bandit 1200 swingarm on my GS1100 and kept my rubber chain gaurd. With my setup, the chain guard still keeps the chain from hitting the swingarm so I recommend that you use it. If I recall correctly, I think I had to shave it down a bit to keep it from binding near the pivot point and frame.

As for the chain clearance issues and frustrations, I have already been there dont that!! Here is what I did! I used the GS hub which is the way to go. As for the sprocket, I had no luck using a 5/8 offset like other have done. Had issues with the chain rubbing the frame.

I tryed out a AFAM 13MM 17 tooth 530 chain offset sprocket which has a little bit less of a offset compared to the 5/8 sprocket. I also ordered a rivet type master link for my chain too! I was pleased to find out that with this combo, I was able to resolve my frame to chain or chain to tire clearance problems.

Check out the link below for more photos and details.
http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=115688
Click to expand...


Not to doubt you or anything man, but I just can't wrap my head around how your 13mm sprocket results in a straight chain run. Did you mill some material off of the sprocket carrier or something of the likes?
 
Just a quick one for your info katman some of the later model 5.5 wheels from the watercooled bikes are wider at the hub :rolleyes: ive just fallen foul of this one myself :oops:
 
liloaty said:
Not to doubt you or anything man, but I just can't wrap my head around how your 13mm sprocket results in a straight chain run. Did you mill some material off of the sprocket carrier or something of the likes?
Click to expand...

Nope no milling work for me, but did add a 3/4 flat washer between the sprocket carrier and the swingarm. I been riding my bike since I put her back together and hadnt had any problems as least not yet. The chain looks straight to me too!
Now, I heard from Katman that there was two types of 5.5 GSXR wheels that were available in 95. One being a regular GSXR and the other is a SRAD. Maybe this may explain why some setup works better with a 5/8 and some work better with a 13mm offset.

I still have a new 5/8 offset x 17 tooth sprocket that I bought and never used if anyone is interested.
 
kichigai said:
Nope no milling work for me, but did add a 3/4 flat washer between the sprocket carrier and the swingarm. I been riding my bike since I put her back together and hadnt had any problems as least not yet. The chain looks straight to me too!
Now, I heard from Katman that there was two types of 5.5 GSXR wheels that were available in 95. One being a regular GSXR and the other is a SRAD. Maybe this may explain why some setup works better with a 5/8 and some work better with a 13mm offset.

I still have a new 5/8 offset x 17 tooth sprocket that I bought and never used if anyone is interested.
Click to expand...

Have you actually measured to see if your offset is correct? I know when I was fitting my setup I tried using the Bandit sprocket carrier and it looked straight as an arrow. Luckily 80GS1000 lent and later sold me a 520 5/8 offset and I measured with it on there. It looked straight, but it wasn't. I had to use the GS carrier and the difference between the two was minimal, but distinct in the measurements. I'm sure your setup will run like that, but I would measure just to make sure :D
 
Do you mean with a chain alignment tool like this one? http://www.cyclegear.com/spgm.cfm?L1=&L2=&L3=&L4=&item=TUC_15-0125&tier2=12
If so, no I never check it with a allignment tool but thats not a bad idea! I dont have too much wiggle room though with any other offset combo. With the current setup, my chain is perfectly in the middle of my frame and tire.
I know what you mean about the difference in sprocket carrier, I noticed it when I first tried using the GSXR carrier and had chain to frame clearance issues. The GS carrier was a bit narrower which made a huge difference.
 
Katman has a "how to" on building your own alignment tools. My advice to you is when you can muster up the cash, switch to a 520 setup. Gives you a lot more play. I mocked up my old 530 running gear and had the same problem as you and PJ suggested a 520 setup. Solved all my problems and the chains are plenty strong (especially the one he recommended you in the other thread). Sorry if it seems like I'm picking on your bike because I'm really not, I love it.
 
kichigai said:
Now, I heard from Katman that there was two types of 5.5 GSXR wheels that were available in 95. One being a regular GSXR and the other is a SRAD. Maybe this may explain why some setup works better with a 5/8 and some work better with a 13mm offset.
Click to expand...

YOu didn't hear that from me. SRAD's came out in 96. I have always said to use the gs carrier as its a couple mm closer the center than the gsxr. In fact I just posted some numbers and pics about that.

PUtting a washer on one side of the wheel doesn't push it over you also have to take away from the opposite side.

YOu can't argue with math. if you run a 1/2" offset and don't take an extra 1/8" off in back your wheel won't be centered/or straight. The bandit swingarms are identical to the gs1100 swingarm as far as spacing goes.

a 5/8" offset needs a 0.490" sprocket spacer to be straight. thats just plain math. You won't see 1/8" off with your eye.

What you can do if your tire allows and Pirelli's do... is lathe the 1/8" off the counter shaft spacer, add 1/8" onto the 0.490" spacer and remove 1/8 off the brake side and you will be good.

Don't know if anyone has read the 630/530/520 post but not all chains are alike and you can get 520's wider than 530's and 530's wider than 630's. So you can't say 530's don't work. I run one, put them on all my kats.

520's will work fine if you get one with low enough tensile strength.
 
No, I meant low enough. If you get the highest tensile is it will be wider than the 530 chain.
 
katman said:
YOu didn't hear that from me. SRAD's came out in 96. I have always said to use the gs carrier as its a couple mm closer the center than the gsxr.
Click to expand...


Katman,
My mistake! You are right! After re-reading one of your old emails, You said that it looks I have an 83 1100 rear wheel and armless caliper that only came with the 1100's. The spacer needed for the rear wheel is different than the one you use for the standard wheel with standard caliper and arm. I knew I recall you saying something about my wheels being different than standard wheels. Yes, I did take your advice though and used the GS carrier.
 
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liloaty said:
Katman has a "how to" on building your own alignment tools.
Click to expand...

I found this "MOTION PRO" chain alignment tool on ebay. I used the base and turned it into a laser alignment but it comes with a 1/4" rod (only about 8" long) to check chain direction. I picked up a 2' piece of 1/4 drill rod but decided to use the laser. I paid about 23.00 for it. The blue part is the MOtion PRo and the black top is my creation. The laser is a 5.00 dimestore keychain. This is a 520 tool. I am going to make the other side a 530 alignment.

laserchain2.jpg
 
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My chain alignment tool is slightly more basic & a hell of a lot cheaper :D

Its a dead straight piece of 12x30mm machined bar picked up from an engineering factory as a freebie :D use is super simple, infallible in fact, after checking wheel alignment simply clamp to rear sprocket & measure in to front sprocket

obviously thats for checking chain run after modification & before a chain is fitted :D
 
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