One more question about stator and RR.

[Eliseo Monteverde]

Hi GSR brothers

I read this on the net:

If not already toasted by a faulty reg/rec-unit there is a precaution you might want to take. There are three wires running from the alternator to the reg/rec-unit. One of these however is by-passed by the light switch. By switching of the lights of your bike the third sector of the alternator is deactivated. This suposedly decreases the charging load on the reg/reg-unit. But meanwhile the alternator is slowly burning up.. So eliminate the by-pass to the light switch and directly connect the third lead to the rectifier.

Is it possible to do that ?
How?

 

[earlfor]

Re: One more question about stator and RR.

I always connect the three yellow output wires of the stator to the three yellow input wires of the regulator/rectifier. The answer is YES.

Earl

Hi GSR brothers

I read this on the net:

If not already toasted by a faulty reg/rec-unit there is a precaution you might want to take. There are three wires running from the alternator to the reg/rec-unit. One of these however is by-passed by the light switch. By switching of the lights of your bike the third sector of the alternator is deactivated. This suposedly decreases the charging load on the reg/reg-unit. But meanwhile the alternator is slowly burning up.. So eliminate the by-pass to the light switch and directly connect the third lead to the rectifier.

Is it possible to do that ?
How?

 

[SqDancerLynn1]

Running the third stator wire direct to the reg and adding an extra ground wire is the best thing you can do to make your reg happy

 

[Eliseo Monteverde]

What I have is 2 output wires of the stator conect to the RR and the third conect to the wiring harness.
Being possible to conect the 3 Sator wires to the RR, how I could connect
the wire that I have conect to the wiring harness to the RR ?

Thanks.

 

[earlfor]

If I remember correctly (its been a while), the 3rd stator leg lighting branch is a dual purpose low voltage AC gated feed to a DC main circuit. Anyway, all you need to do is disconnect the 3rd yellow stator output wire from the wiring harness and tape over the now unused wiring harness wire end. Disconnect the 3rd yellow input lead on the regulator from its connection to the wiring harness and tape over that unused harness wire end. Then connect the yellow stator output wire to the yellow input regulator rectifier wire. Tape over the connection so the wire cannot short or ground out against anything. Your lighting will work normally. Power available to the lighting will be the same but you have modified the pathway. I did this a few years ago on my 750, and there has never been a problem with it. This is not a guess.

Earl

What I have is 2 output wires of the stator conect to the RR and the third conect to the wiring harness.
Being possible to conect the 3 Sator wires to the RR, how I could connect
the wire that I have conect to the wiring harness to the RR ?

Thanks.

 

[Eliseo Monteverde]

If I remember correctly (its been a while), the 3rd stator leg lighting branch is a dual purpose low voltage AC gated feed to a DC main circuit. Anyway, all you need to do is disconnect the 3rd yellow stator output wire from the wiring harness and tape over the now unused wiring harness wire end. Disconnect the 3rd yellow input lead on the regulator from its connection to the wiring harness and tape over that unused harness wire end, then connect the yellow stator output wire to the yellow input regulator rectifier wire. Tape over the connection so the wire cannot short or ground out against anything. You lighting will work normally. Power available to the lighting will be the same but you have modified the pathway it will take. I did this a few years ago on my 750, and there has never been a problem with it. This is not a guess.

Earl

Thanks Earl, I?ll try to do as soon as I can :!: :!: :!:



Eliseo.

What I have is 2 output wires of the stator conect to the RR and the third conect to the wiring harness.
Being possible to conect the 3 Sator wires to the RR, how I could connect
the wire that I have conect to the wiring harness to the RR ?

Thanks.

 

[focus frenzy]

What I have is 2 output wires of the stator conect to the RR and the third conect to the wiring harness.
Being possible to conect the 3 Sator wires to the RR, how I could connect
the wire that I have conect to the wiring harness to the RR ?

Thanks.

the third wire goes to the light switch and comes right back to the regulator, it does not connect to anything else, the purpose of doing this is so when the headlight is turned off, the extra current does not burn out the regulator.

 

[Eliseo Monteverde]

the third wire goes to the light switch and comes right back to the regulator, it does not connect to anything else, the purpose of doing this is so when the headlight is turned off, the extra current does not burn out the regulator.

Thanks Leon :!: :!:

.....but where it goes the extra current when the headlight is turned off?
To the battery?

 

[chuckycheese]

Cuious

Cuious

I'm curious about that, too. I have occasion to run my bike without my light on sometimes.....if I make that wiring change, am I taking a chance on ruining my charging system? :?:

Also, if this modification is done....what difference will I notice? :?:

Thanks

 

[Anonymous]

Hello everyone,

I'm New on Here, Just got my 82 gs850gl and found a problem and did a search on here and found this (GREAT SITE ALSO) and thought that it might be something to be watched by others and I am planning on not using the original wiring path like you guys were talking about and just connecting them down with the rest.

Well, I found out my RR was bad and I noticed that the connectors to the wiring harness that goes up the frame to a spliter(W/R from the RR & W/G from the stator), were a little hard and showed signs of almost welding. Well I followed it up the harness to that connector (and looked at the wiring diagram) and on the other side of the plastic connector, there was a factory bypass jumper that connect the 2 together on the opposite plastic connector (it appears other models need it to go up there), It appears that the plastic was cracking from the engine heat or had pulled apart alittle and it appears to have sparked to an adjacent wire and started to melt the plastic connectors till i suspect the RR fried.

So check for cracks and tight connections or do the by pass thingy if it is not required up that direction.

thanks
Lennie

 

[Eliseo Monteverde]

Hello everyone,

I'm New on Here

Hello Lennie,

Here you?re welcome.

 

[cdngeorge]

Clarification of lighting bypass, please.

Clarification of lighting bypass, please.

I just installed a new Electrex stator last night, and will be installing the R/R tomorrow a.m.
As things stand, I have the three yellow leads from the stator - to bypass the light circuit as Earl described, would I simply wire those directly to the stator inputs on the R/R and wire the red and black leads from the RR to the stock connection (assuming it's not melted or otherwise wrecked?)
My GS650GL specifies a RR9 R/R unit (out of stock) but they sent me a RR13 - same unit, different ends, so I snipped the ends off and will be wiring it in tomorrow.
As my bike is a Canadian 81 model, the headlight switch is "locked" on, so my bike always runs with lights on - would the bypass make any difference in the circumstance?
Lastly, does the Electrex stator and R/R unit put out more power than the stock unit - sufficent to run a pair of running lights for night riding without killing the charging system?

Thanks

Cdngeorge
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada

 

[saaz]

The light bypass is still a god idea in the long run. The circuit up through the light switch looses voltage.

 

[Eliseo Monteverde]

Well...

Finally I did the by-pass....
Yeah!!!! I have increased 1.2 V. in the battery (when the lights are off),even with the fried charging system.
Now I have 13.2 V.
As soon as I can I?ll fix the charging system up.
Thanks for yours advices!!!!

Eliseo.

 

[Anonymous]

I've been following a lot of these "stator" posts for quite some time now and have been amused by the various myths and misconceptions I've seen. Even the so called stator papers are, shall we say. less than perfect.

I'm still working on this but, let's clear some stuff up right now. BTW, I am an electrical engineer.

1. The stator is one of two components which make up the alternator. That's right, your GS has an alternator, just like your car. The other component is the rotor, which is a permanent magnet that spins within the stator and causes enduced current flow within the stator windings.

2. The stator has three windings called phases. Normally, we would call these; phase A, phase B and phase C. For our purposes, we'll call the phase that is switched on when the lights are on, phase A. The other two are phase B and C.

3. The GS charging system is a bit unconventional as the regulator is located before the rectifier and regulates AC, not DC and it only regulates the voltage on two of the three phases. This, unfortunately, is a vulnerability of the GS charging system. When the regulator shorts out, bye bye stator windings! In a normal DC regulated system, the rectifiers would act as fuses and protect the alternator.

4. The alternator only supplies enough current to meet the demands of the load. No more, no less. Current from the alternator is directly proportional to load. The higher the load, the higher the current. This is empirical.

5 The alternator's voltage output is directly proportional to rotor RPM and inversely proportional to load. That means as the engine rpm increases, the output voltage increases and as the electrical load increases (current) the voltage decreases.

6. The alternator cannot "burn itself out", that is impossible. I won't go into the technical details but counter EMF prevents an internal current overload in the alternator without an external load.

9. The only thing that can destroy an alternator is heat! Excessive heat can be caused by an external source or, more likely, the heat generated from too much current caused by an excessive load. It can come all at once, as in the case of a short circuit, or a little at a time, as in the case of an excessive but deliverable load.

So there you have it, very simple. What causes the stator windings to fail? Too much current!

How does that happen? Lots of ways, maybe the regulator shorts a phase to ground or two phases together. I don't have a schematic for a regulator and have never taken one apart (maybe I should) but that is certainly possible. On the other hand, if the contacts in the headlamp switch that control phase A should somehow corrode and open up, then you have only two phases trying to deliver current for a load that is normally taken up by three phases. This is because the headlamp circuit is completely independent of phase A. Phase A can open up and the headlamp continues to draw current from the remaining phases which start overheating and eventually lead to a melt down over time.

Simply turning off your headlamp, would never cause your alternator to "burn out" even if that phase opens up (which it should do normally).


If you bypass the pase A contacts in the headlamp switch and then run without your headlamp on, you will increase the DC voltage to your battery and cause it to overcharge and also decrease the life of all your electrical equipment such as your light bulbs. Therefore, I do not recommend bypassing the contacts and wiring the phase directly to the rectifier unless you intend never to run without your headlamp on. This is OK until the bulb burns out and then you may have problems. On the other hand, it may make sense to bypass the contacts and turn off your headlamp when warming up. This will allow a higher voltage to your battery and to your coils for improved engine performance during the warm up period. (It's not a bad idea at all!) Again, you have to bypass the contacts and turn off your headlamp which means you would have to break the tab on the switch (very easy to do).

I would strongly suggest checking the proper operation of your phase A switch and make sure it has zero resistance when closed. Since almost all US and Canadian GS's of the era were shipped with the headlamp switch locked in the on position, the switch never gets exercised and therefore the corrosion that bulids up over time in any switch is not wiped away by frequent operation of the switch. I personally, have defeated the locking tab on my headlamp switch and turn off the headlamp when I'm warming the bike up for a run. This keeps the switch working properly through normal use.

I believe this to be the cause of many alternator failures in GS's. The switch opens up (from corrosion) and the headlamp continues to draw current from an alternator with 33% of it's capacity reduced with the operator not even knowing it! The indicator would be the actual charging voltage to the battery would be reduced and therefore the battery would be going dead quicker, the first sign of problems!!

Hope this helps, I'm still researching this subject. I will have more on this later.

 

[SqDancerLynn1]

No matter how technical you want to get 99.9 % of us ride with our headlights on, some states it is the law! SO bypassing the loop thru the switch eliminates the extra resistance of dirty contacts and an extra 6 ft of wire allowing the stator to run cooler THE voltage the battery sees will NOT increase beyond the capacity of the regulator

 

[Dave_A]

Ahh...

So THIS is why I've had charging problems - even though my system passes the 'stator papers' test - since I jerry-rigged the new wiring harness...

My light is no longer running on the 'light circuit, but is being powered by a jumpered-in lead to the light switch... Which would mean I'm running at ~66% capacity, since the light circuit is never operable...

Time to do the RR snip tomoorrow, then...

 

[Anonymous]

THE voltage the battery sees will NOT increase beyond the capacity of the regulator

If I understood James' post, yes it will as only two of three phases are regulated on the GS's in question, and on early 750's only 1 of three!

You should really only bypass the light switch when fitting a proper 3 phase RR. If your charging system still has the original components (not many by now I would have thought....) then clean up all the connections and the light switch, fit an extra earth direct to the battery from the reg and rec, and you should be OK.

 

[Anonymous]

No matter how technical you want to get 99.9 % of us ride with our headlights on, some states it is the law! SO bypassing the loop thru the switch eliminates the extra resistance of dirty contacts and an extra 6 ft of wire allowing the stator to run cooler THE voltage the battery sees will NOT increase beyond the capacity of the regulator

Actually it will, since the regulator only shunts voltage on two of the three phases and on the AC side, not the DC side which would be at the battery (read my post!). With a decrease in load (headlamp off) and the phase A switch bypassed, you will see an increase in the voltage at the battery. This is proven by the fact that the switch even exists in the design. And trust me, batteries DO NOT like more than about 13.8V for any length of time. If you run during the day and your headlamp burns out, you will probably fry your battery without the ability to turn that phase off, due to a bypass.

The system should work perfectly if you switch your headlamps on and off occasionally. I do prefer this feature as it is a good way to signal a pass or to warn oncoming traffic, or cars exiting a driveway, etc. of my presence. I personally think it is a good idea to "flash"your headlamps often and use this trick all the time with great effectiveness. Simply flashing your high beams on and off does not have the same visual impact as completely switching the headlamp on and off. It really does work, people take notice of flashing lights.

A lot of guys here on this forum preach the "total control" philosophy of motorcycling by criticizing ABS or some such thing and yet never think to have control of one of the most vital tools of visibility on your machine, the headlamp.

If you NEVER use your headlamp switch, I would think a bypass of the phase A switch would be a good idea. If you do use your headlamp switch (I highly recommend it), the bypass is totally unnecessary. I DO NOT recommend driving around without a headlamp on but, there's no reason in the world you shouldn't be able to flick it off from time to time.

Does this make sense??

 

[Anonymous]

THE voltage the battery sees will NOT increase beyond the capacity of the regulator

If I understood James' post, yes it will as only two of three phases are regulated on the GS's in question, and on early 750's only 1 of three!

You should really only bypass the light switch when fitting a proper 3 phase RR. If your charging system still has the original components (not many by now I would have thought....) then clean up all the connections and the light switch, fit an extra earth direct to the battery from the reg and rec, and you should be OK.

Bravo!