Procedure after crankcase full of gas????

[GSAddikt]

Ok y'all, I left my 85 GS700 ES on the sidestand for roughly 2 months (wasn't supposed to be that long but it happened), anyhow, put it back on the center stand and only ran it a short time to diagnose check my charging system (will be another post). I found my stator wasn't charging and when I drained the oil, it was full of gas. I discovered the petcock was leaking only when tilted.

Anyhow, found what I thought was the issue with the stator, put everything back together, even pulled the oil pan, checked the pick up screen, and replaced the oil pan gasket because it was leaking. New oil, new filter, started it up on an auxiliary fuel supply and my oil light was staying on... Pulled the drain plug by the filter and only a small amount of seemingly thin oil drained out (not even enough to half fill a coke can). I drained the oil again and pulled the filter, it still has a vague odor of gas but nowhere near what it was. That's where I'm at right now, I have about had it with this thing but I'm not giving up. Am I missing something or could I have done something wrong? What should I do next?? I realize this is a rather vague description but I can fill in details as needed.. I'm determined to get this thing straightened out but it's beating me down... Thanks

 

[bccap]

Replace the petcock.... The repair kits have spotty success.... There is a guy on ebay Georgefix who has reasonable prices if he has yours in stock......

 

[GSAddikt]

Thank you sir, already planning on that part.. I'm more concerned with the oil light staying on now, I never had that issue before now....

 

[Redman]

.
.................................. Am I missing something or could I have done something wrong? ..........

Are not leaving the petcock in PRIme position are you....?

 

[Redman]

Are not leaving the petcock in PRIme position are you....?

Yes, I have forgot and left there in PRIme position (but after that I have forced myself to stand there and hold it till I put back har har har).

And others have by misunderstanding which way the lever goes for which position.

 

[GSAddikt]

Are not leaving the petcock in PRIme position are you....?

No sir, it is in the ON position where it should be, I've already determined it needs to be replaced, with the tank off the bike, it leaks when I tilt it towards the petcock. My biggest issue now is why my oil light is staying on after changing the oil, oil filter, and replacing the oil pan gasket. Running the bike on a makeshift fuel source, it is not getting fuel in the crankcase. I'm assuming the small amount of fuel in the new oil was residual left over from the large amount that was in it before. I've basically got that, again, my main concern is why my oil light is staying on now...

 

[Grimly]

Thank you sir, already planning on that part.. I'm more concerned with the oil light staying on now, I never had that issue before now....

The oil pressure switches are pretty reliable, but double check the wiring to it by pulling off the wire and grounding it. That will bring the light on.
That rules out a wiring fault.

Second check is to put a meter or test light across the switch and see if it's making a connection - with the engine off, the switch should be conducting.
Only way to actually check if the switch is working properly is to put some pressure to it. You could either cobble up a pressure air feed, using a bicycle pump, or take the chance and start the engine.

I suspect that the complete drain-down and filter change simply means you have a few seconds to wait until normal service is resumed. Some engines are notorious for this, but don't suffer mechanically from it, fortunately.

How long did you give it with the oil light on?

 

[Redman]

I can confirm what Grimly said.

THe oil pressure switch turns on the light by connecting the wire to ground. So pull off the wire and if the light stays on then can suspect a problem in the wiring or in internals of the instrument cluster...

.... also pull up the sidestand, see if that makes a difference (long detailed discussion).

 

[GSAddikt]

The oil pressure switches are pretty reliable, but double check the wiring to it by pulling off the wire and grounding it. That will bring the light on.
That rules out a wiring fault.

Second check is to put a meter or test light across the switch and see if it's making a connection - with the engine off, the switch should be conducting.
Only way to actually check if the switch is working properly is to put some pressure to it. You could either cobble up a pressure air feed, using a bicycle pump, or take the chance and start the engine.

I suspect that the complete drain-down and filter change simply means you have a few seconds to wait until normal service is resumed. Some engines are notorious for this, but don't suffer mechanically from it, fortunately.

How long did you give it with the oil light on?

Thank you sir, I will be back at it in the morning and will do just that.. As far as running it, not very long because I got nervous, it was probably a good minute or so at least and I tried the same a couple more times, all together maybe a few minutes tops..

 

[GSAddikt]

I can confirm what Grimly said.

THe oil pressure switch turns on the light by connecting the wire to ground. So pull off the wire and if the light stays on then can suspect a problem in the wiring or in internals of the instrument cluster...

.... also pull up the sidestand, see if that makes a difference (long detailed discussion).

Interesting you would bring up the sidestand, it is on the center stand with the sidestand up but the light is lit up on the cluster. Interestingly enough, that light has never worked before... Hmm. I even tried moving the switch manually and it will not go off either... I thought it was odd but really didn't think of any correlation between the two as I didn't manipulate any wiring.

 

[Redman]

Interesting you would bring up the sidestand, .
.
.....................really didn't think of any correlation between the two ..................

Correlation is this:
- oil sensor is suppose to light up both the oil light and the sidestand light (I suppose that is to have the sidestand light be a backup, I quess, if the oil light were to burn out).
- sidestand light should operate the sidestand light only
- how this is possible is due to having a diode in-between those two circuits. Diode is to allow current only in one direction. The diode can be found in the headlight shell.

If diode were to fail such that conducts in both directions then either the oil switch or the sidestand switch would light both lights.(what I was half suspecting.)
If diode were to fail (or is disconnected) such that conducts in neiter directions then each switch would light only its own light.
If diode installed backwards then the sidestand would light both lights, and oil swtich light only the oil light.

In your case: with the sidestand up, engine not running, and both lights on: pull off the oil sensor wire, both lights should go off. Then maybe you can see the sidestand operate the sidestand light.

 

[Grimly]

Thank you sir, I will be back at it in the morning and will do just that.. As far as running it, not very long because I got nervous, it was probably a good minute or so at least and I tried the same a couple more times, all together maybe a few minutes tops..

Well, I don't like the sound of that. The longest I recall ever having to wait for any engine to get oil pressure up was about ten seconds and it seemed much much longer because of the "shouldn't be doing that" factor. The last complete oil change on my GS took an age to get pressure up but eventually it worked (within the ten seconds).
Assuming the OP light is actually working, I wonder if the oil pump has lost prime.
Not sure exactly where the pump on yours is, but if it's behind the clutch it's accessible with a relative lack of fuss and you might have to pack it with vaseline or similar.

 

[GSAddikt]

Correlation is this:
- oil sensor is suppose to light up both the oil light and the sidestand light (I suppose that is to have the sidestand light be a backup, I quess, if the oil light were to burn out).
- sidestand light should operate the sidestand light only
- how this is possible is due to having a diode in-between those two circuits. Diode is to allow current only in one direction. The diode can be found in the headlight shell.

If diode were to fail such that conducts in both directions then either the oil switch or the sidestand switch would light both lights.(what I was half suspecting.)
If diode were to fail (or is disconnected) such that conducts in neiter directions then each switch would light only its own light.
If diode installed backwards then the sidestand would light both lights, and oil swtich light only the oil light.

In your case: with the sidestand up, engine not running, and both lights on: pull off the oil sensor wire, both lights should go off. Then maybe you can see the sidestand operate the sidestand light.

Interesting information, thank you sir.. I can honestly say I probably would have never figured that one out. That solves the mystery as to why the sidestand light is on at this point.

 

[GSAddikt]

Well, I don't like the sound of that. The longest I recall ever having to wait for any engine to get oil pressure up was about ten seconds and it seemed much much longer because of the "shouldn't be doing that" factor. The last complete oil change on my GS took an age to get pressure up but eventually it worked (within the ten seconds).
Assuming the OP light is actually working, I wonder if the oil pump has lost prime.
Not sure exactly where the pump on yours is, but if it's behind the clutch it's accessible with a relative lack of fuss and you might have to pack it with vaseline or similar.

My first initial thought was to give it a little time to pick up but I had to come to the realization that was not going to happen, I admittedly gave it way more time than I was comfortable with. I honestly don't know where the pump is located myself but I'll find out. If the electrical tests check out and I actually do need to prime the pump as a next step, could you elaborate a bit on packing it with vaseline? It's not a procedure that I am familiar with and lord knows I don't want to take any chances at this point.. Thank you sir..

 

[Grimly]

I've never had to prime a GS pump like that, but had to do it on a couple of car lumps over the years, after a rebuild.

Another thought that might save a load of hassle - on the older engines (not sure about yours) there is an oil gallery at the back of the cylinder block with a blanking plug in it (right hand side, behind the block, right on the top of the crankcase). I strongly suspect it would be possible to shoot some oil into that and refill the pump from the wrong side, if you like. It would have to fill the filter cavity first then make its way to the pump.
If I were going to do that on mine, I'd drop the oil out of the sump, remove the filter (to avoid the extra impedance of it and also remove the risk of damage to the element) and with a known quantity of oil start oiling it up via that port.
It might take some time, and you wouldn't be able to pressure feed it, because an unknown quantity would just shoot up to the head and be effectively wasted in this purpose. Gravity feed, to make sure it all flows downwards to the filter and then the pump, into the oil pan.

All this is just supposition, and you might find the problem is merely electrical, but the reason I wondered about loss of prime was the dilution of the oil with the fuel, making it very thin indeed. Even at that, there are hundreds of discoverers of old GSs that have been laid up and abandoned in barns for years, yet they pump up their oil no problem (shouldn't really do that, either, but hey-ho).

Just thought of another diagnostic shortcut - remove the oil filter and turn the engine over *with the plugs out to make it easier* and observe oil flow into the filter cavity. If it appears there, the pump is working.

 

[bobgroger]

THe GS700 I believe is a plain bearing crank and should have higher oil pressure than the roller bearing bikes. It will also be way less tolerant of low oil pressure. Get one of these and hook up a guage. https://www.summitracing.com/search...type/gauge-adapters/fitting-size-2/14mm-x-1-5 Note: I am assuming the GS700 is like the other bikes and has this plug on the side of the motor. Check before spending money.

 

[GSAddikt]

I can't thank you enough Mr. Grimly and everyone else that has chimed in, I have learned a lot from this site, so much so that I rarely have to ask anything. I can't wait to get back in the shop in the morning and hopefully get this figured out. At present, I have the oil filter out and all of the oil drained, I'm going to pick up some more oil and probably another filter in the morning as I don't want to reuse the new oil I drained today, it wasn't too bad but still had a slight odor of gas and appeared to be thinned out a bit. Hopefully it helped to remove any residual gas that may have been left inside.. It makes me sick this even happened but it's another opportunity to learn more I reckon..

Again, I appreciate all of the advice more than you know.. I will update and/or have more questions tomorrow.

 

[GSAddikt]

THe GS700 I believe is a plain bearing crank and should have higher oil pressure than the roller bearing bikes. It will also be way less tolerant of low oil pressure. Get one of these and hook up a guage. https://www.summitracing.com/search...type/gauge-adapters/fitting-size-2/14mm-x-1-5 Note: I am assuming the GS700 is like the other bikes and has this plug on the side of the motor. Check before spending money.

I will check, seems it would be a good idea regardless should any future issues arise.. Thank you sir.

 

[GregT]

The oil pump is behind the clutch in the usual Suzuki position. It is possible - with the clutch cover off and the clutch basket out- to put a drill on the pump shaft and prime that way.Note that the crank rotates clockwise as you look at that side, the clutch anti-clockwise and the pump will therefore rotate clockwiseI'd do it that way given the amount of doubt about the oil in this one. Oil light should go out quite quickly. The plain bearing motors don't like a lack of oil....

 

[GSAddikt]

The oil pump is behind the clutch in the usual Suzuki position. It is possible - with the clutch cover off and the clutch basket out- to put a drill on the pump shaft and prime that way.Note that the crank rotates clockwise as you look at that side, the clutch anti-clockwise and the pump will therefore rotate clockwiseI'd do it that way given the amount of doubt about the oil in this one. Oil light should go out quite quickly. The plain bearing motors don't like a lack of oil....

Thank you sir, I do not want to risk any damage to this thing for sure. This may be a stupid question, but how much oil should I have in it to do this? I've already drained it and have the oil filter out, I plan on going with fresh oil and another new filter..