Spark issue on all four plugs

[Guest]

Bike just suddenly died on idle and won't start, kept trying to start it untill battery died.

I charged the battery over night voltage now is 12.7 connected it to the bike and tried to start it, I hear 1 cylinder fire when I let go of the start button it back fires, atried a couple of times and it did the same thing, removed the spark plugs and they are all wet and smells like gas, check for compression and it's good, gas is definitely there, checked the spark plug and they looked fouled, cleaned the spark plug and tested it on the valve cover for spark, spark plug from cylinder 1 and 4 has no spark, but the plugs on cylinder 2 and 3 when I press the start button it will spark once only then when I release the start button it will spark continuesly for a few seconds maybe 5-8 seconds, so I traced the wires from the ignition coils to the igniter unit no wires seems to be stripped so I decided to clean the contacts with a contact cleaner, plug it back in and check all plugs again, this time all 4 plugs has spark, put it all back together and start the bike and it did no problem, did it couple of times rev it and check if battery is charging, everything seems to be good or so I thought, at one point after reving the bike up to 5000rpm it went back to idle then after a few seconds it bogs done and died again and again it won't start and back fires, removed all plugs again this time plug 1 and 4 has no spark plug 2 and 3 only spark once while start button is pressed then sparks once again after releasing the start button I re checked the cables again repluging them making sure everyrhing is connected properly but still the same no spark on cylinder 1 and 4 and just one spark when pressing the start button and another spark when I release the start button on cylinder 2 and 3... Help!

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

Wow. That is the longest sentence I’ve ever tried to read. Sorry, no help with the issue. But maybe edit your post and throw in a period once in a while. Hit the return button a few time in the middle.

 

[pdqford]

And maybe add the make, year, and model of the bike so when the experts arrive they can get right to it.

 

[Guest]

And maybe add the make, year, and model of the bike so when the experts arrive they can get right to it.

The make and model of my bike is on my signature

 

[pdqford]

The make and model of my bike is on my signature

Many Thanks.

 

[Redman]

Bike just suddenly died on idle and won't start, kept trying to start it untill battery died.

I charged the battery over night

voltage now is 12.7

connected it to the bike and tried to start it,

I hear 1 cylinder fire when I let go of the start button it back fires, atried a couple of times and it did the same thing, removed the spark plugs and they are all wet and smells like gas,

check for compression and it's good, gas is definitely there, checked the spark plug and they looked fouled,
cleaned the spark plug and tested it on the valve cover for spark, spark plug from cylinder 1 and 4 has no spark, but the plugs on cylinder 2 and 3 when I press the start button it will spark once only then when I release the start button it will spark continuesly for a few seconds maybe 5-8 seconds,

so I traced the wires from the ignition coils to the igniter unit no wires seems to be stripped so I decided to clean the contacts with a contact cleaner, plug it back in and check all plugs again,
this time all 4 plugs has spark, put it all back together and start the bike and it did no problem,

did it couple of times rev it and check if battery is charging, everything seems to be good or so I thought, at one point after reving the bike up to 5000rpm it went back to idle then after a few seconds it bogs done and died again and again it won't start and back fires,
removed all plugs again this time plug 1 and 4 has no spark plug 2 and 3 only spark once while start button is pressed then sparks once again after releasing the start button

I re checked the cables again repluging them making sure everyrhing is connected properly but still the same no spark on cylinder 1 and 4 and just one spark when pressing the start button and another spark when I release the start button on cylinder 2 and 3... Help!

Let me read it now.

.
.....
.... when I release the start button it will spark continuesly for a few seconds maybe 5-8 seconds,.
.
.
.....plug 2 and 3 only spark once while start button is pressed then sparks once again after releasing the start button. .
....
.....
...... one spark when pressing the start button and another spark when I release the start button on cylinder 2 and 3... Help!

Classic sign of weak-marginal battery or maybe battery is just not well charged. WHile cranking the draw of the starter is a big load on the battrery which is lowering the voltage enough that the ignition system cant work well enough. A good battery well charged can handle that, but a weak-old-marginal battery can not, or maybe battery is good but not welll charged due to problem with the charging system.
ANd you did say it did start after charging the battery with a charger, so that supports my idea.

SOme things to do:

- Charge battery again.

- Take charger off for half hour or more. Key off. Measure battery voltage. Key On, measure battery voltage. Measure voltage at the coils org/wht wire (need to take tank off.) Measure battery voltage while cranking starter. Measure voltage at coils while cranking starter. Report back here.

.

 

[Guest]

Let me read it now.






Classic sign of weak-marginal battery or maybe battery is just not well charged. WHile cranking the draw of the starter is a big load on the battrery which is lowering the voltage enough that the ignition system cant work well enough. A good battery well charged can handle that, but a weak-old-marginal battery can not, or maybe battery is good but not welll charged due to problem with the charging system.
ANd you did say it did start after charging the battery with a charger, so that supports my idea.

SOme things to do:

- Charge battery again.

- Take charger off for half hour or more. Key off. Measure battery voltage. Key On, measure battery voltage. Measure voltage at the coils org/wht wire (need to take tank off.) Measure battery voltage while cranking starter. Measure voltage at coils while cranking starter. Report back here.

.

Thanks will do that. I did notice something weird while double checking the wires, I notice one of the ignition coil is hot the one for cylinder 2 and 3 while the ignition coil for 1and4 is cold

 

[tom203]

Thanks will do that. I did notice something weird while double checking the wires, I notice one of the ignition coil is hot the one for cylinder 2 and 3 while the ignition coil for 1and4 is cold

If you mean when it?s not running,but ignition is ?on? ,this is normal. The ignitor powers one set of coils...then breaks the electrical connection to produce a spark just like a contact point would.

 

[xkaes]

Bike just suddenly died on idle and won't start, kept trying to start it untill battery died. ... Help!

Either you had an almost dead battery to begin with, or you started out on the wrong foot. If a bike won't start after a few tries, don't keep trying -- find out what the problem is.

Do you have a service manual or at least a trouble-shooting guide? We can help, but having one of these will tell you step by step what to check out. What you are likely to get here is 100 well-intentioned things to try in no particular order -- much like what you are already doing.

Have you had any problems in the past? What is the most recent servicing/maintenance on the bike -- when and by whom? How old is the battery?

 

[Gorminrider]

One coil or its connection seems bad. (the 1+4 one). Or the TCI (ignitor) on that works that coil. Or the sensor that fires the TCI for that coil....first check the wiring because apparently it works sometimes...

 

[Guest]

One coil or its connection seems bad. (the 1+4 one). Or the TCI (ignitor) on that works that coil. Or the sensor that fires the TCI for that coil....first check the wiring because apparently it works sometimes...

What confuses me is if its the TCI should it not give spark at all? Because what happening is when I press the start button it gives one spark on all four then when I release the button it gives another spark.

 

[Guest]

Either you had an almost dead battery to begin with, or you started out on the wrong foot. If a bike won't start after a few tries, don't keep trying -- find out what the problem is.

Do you have a service manual or at least a trouble-shooting guide? We can help, but having one of these will tell you step by step what to check out. What you are likely to get here is 100 well-intentioned things to try in no particular order -- much like what you are already doing.

Have you had any problems in the past? What is the most recent servicing/maintenance on the bike -- when and by whom? How old is the battery?

Yes I have a copy of the service manual.

Battery is a year and a half I just finish charging the battery its giving 12.8v

Issues I had in the past was only the ground wire plug contacts from the battery was dirty so I replaced the contacts.

Servicing was almost 2 months ago, full carb clean, oil change, throttle cable change, break fluid change, that's it. Brought it to a mech I know personaly.

 

[Gorminrider]

What confuses me is if its the TCI should it not give spark at all? Because what happening is when I press the start button it gives one spark on all four then when I release the button it gives another spark.

Just remember a coil of wire with voltage and current is a magnet and turning OFF that voltage and current creates a collapsing magnetic field cutting the coils wire creating it's own electricity! When you turn off the power to a coil, the field collapses. So turning off power to a coil does not exactly end everything instantly. There is thereby some electricity looking for a home and it will jump an airspace if that's the only possible way..
The starting button spins the engine with the starter motor via the solenoid. If the spin of the engine stops, and gives no signal to the tci, the coils remain "charged" until you turn the key or the kill switch off, when, they might then cause another spark at the plugs as the coil collapses. I'm not saying your TCI is blown. But it can still allow spark if it's allowing power through the coils and that power is then cut off another way.

 

[Guest]

Just remember a coil of wire with voltage and current is a magnet and turning OFF that voltage and current creates a collapsing magnetic field cutting the coils wire creating it's own electricity! When you turn off the power to a coil, the field collapses. So turning off power to a coil does not exactly end everything instantly. There is thereby some electricity looking for a home and it will jump an airspace if that's the only possible way..
The starting button spins the engine with the starter motor via the solenoid. If the spin of the engine stops, and gives no signal to the tci, the coils remain "charged" until you turn the key or the kill switch off, when, they might then cause another spark at the plugs as the coil collapses. I'm not saying your TCI is blown. But it can still allow spark if it's allowing power through the coils and that power is then cut off another way.

Thanks for making me understand that not really good with electrical things but I want to learn

 

[Redman]

. . . . . . . I did notice something weird while double checking the wires, I notice one of the ignition coil is hot the one for cylinder 2 and 3 while the ignition coil for 1and4 is cold

I dont know.

 

[Redman]

. . . . . . . . . Because what happening is when I press the start button it gives one spark on all four then when I release the button it gives another spark.

Good that you observed that.

Check battery voltage with key off, then with key on, then when cranking starter, then at idle, than at mid rpm say 4500. Report here.

Also check voltage at coils org/wht wire with key on, and again when cranking starter.

I suspect what is happening is when cranking the voltage is dragging down such that coils cant work well. Due to either old-marginal battery, or battery not well charged due to problem with charging system. Maybe also made worse by loosing voltage between battery and the coils.
Charge up the battery and do the test, and report to here. If you dont have a volt meter, well, ah, you need one.

.

 

[Guest]

Good that you observed that.

Check battery voltage with key off, then with key on, then when cranking starter, then at idle, than at mid rpm say 4500. Report here.

Also check voltage at coils org/wht wire with key on, and again when cranking starter.

I suspect what is happening is when cranking the voltage is dragging down such that coils cant work well. Due to either old-marginal battery, or battery not well charged due to problem with charging system. Maybe also made worse by loosing voltage between battery and the coils.
Charge up the battery and do the test, and report to here. If you dont have a volt meter, well, ah, you need one.

.

Fully charge the battery its giving 12.7v - 12.8v
Key on 12.6v
Cranking starter 10.5v

Weird first push of the button bike started after a few seconds it bogs down and died again bike won't start again. Checked the battery again its now giving 12.5v key off 12.4 key on cranking 10.3v.

I wasn't able to get the voltage when the bike ran... Going to check the voltage at the coils.

 

[Guest]

I bet that battery is toast. If you charge it and it reads 12.7 that isn't good because it will have what is called a surface charge inflating the real number. Charge the battery, then turn the headlight on 2 or 3 minutes then check the charge after you turn the light off. If it is 12.6 or 12.7 it's got a chance of being good. A load test would tell the story.

 

[Gorminrider]

Reading your first post still makes me think you have a problem at the 1-4 side of the ignition. I don't see a reason yet to doubt your battery* unless it is going flat after one or two attempts.

Your first post says the bike starts, runs on all four cylinders for a little while and then quits. Am I wrong?
The rest of the posts suggest you have the dreaded electrical gremlin and these can be difficult to catch....
It might be you just need new spark plugs, or spark plug caps or the wire to the plug is shorting to the tank or your coil is burned out or your TCI has a chafed wire or.....so,my starting point is to fence the gremlin in , checking all the obvious places first...

But Yourfirst task is to read the manual very carefully and get an understanding of how the motorcycle is supposed to work. The Real Shop manuals are the best. Google too. Follow the manual's steps as much as you can. then, ask questions here as to what you don't understand from the manual or your search engine. That helps us follow along.

*Disconnect your headlamp fuse so you have a little more time and current to find the problem. But if you have a car battery handy, with a little bit of thick wire, you can put it on the floor nearby to REPLACE the MC battery and power the circuits much longer while you fiddle. That will take "the battery" out of the equation, "yea or nay", and save you re-charging the motorcycle battery often.

 

[Guest]

I bet that battery is toast. If you charge it and it reads 12.7 that isn't good because it will have what is called a surface charge inflating the real number. Charge the battery, then turn the headlight on 2 or 3 minutes then check the charge after you turn the light off. If it is 12.6 or 12.7 it's got a chance of being good. A load test would tell the story.

I did that and it did say 12.7v -12.6v with the head light on. I borrowed a well known good battery from a working bike and still that same bike won't start.