Still Won't Idle! I think I'm done.

[UncleMike]

Have you tried re-torquing the exhaust?

I have not. Something to try next?

 

[t3rmin]

Well if my bike were ticking it's something I'd check. I was pleasently surprised to find none of my exhaust bolts frozen when I re-torqued them the other day -- watch for that.

 

[UncleMike]

Well if my bike were ticking it's something I'd check. I was pleasently surprised to find none of my exhaust bolts frozen when I re-torqued them the other day -- watch for that.

I feel like an idiot, but I just noticed that my clutch isn't fully engaging, which could certainly account for the stalling at the very least. The bike always seems to roll so freely with the clutch in, but on the centerstand the rear wheel is noticeably harder to move with the clutch in and in gear than in nuetral.

Anyone wanna walk me through adjusting that? The instructions in the Clymer manual are terrible.

Anyway, if I do re-torque the exhaust bolts, I'll soak 'em in PB Blaster for a couple of days first. At least they've got the allen heads on 'em.

Thanks,
~Mike

 

[t3rmin]

If you've got allen bolts in the exhaust then somebody took the time to replace 'em and I doubt any are frozen. I'd just crank on them a little bit and see if they move before waiting several days for penetrating oil...

Adjusting clutch cable is easy. My manual says you want 2-3mm of free play before the lever engages. Just use a screwdriver and (8mm?) wrench at the clutch actuation lever down by your rear brake pedal (on the same case/cover that your oil sight glass is on) to adjust cable tension until you've got the proper amount of play in the lever. Then you can use the thumb wheel adjuster at the handlebar lever to fine tune.

You shouldn't be able to roll the bike in gear without extreme effort with your hand off the clutch. However it is normal to still have have slight drag, with the clutch squeezed (vs neutral).

 

[UncleMike]

If you've got allen bolts in the exhaust then somebody took the time to replace 'em and I doubt any are frozen. I'd just crank on them a little bit and see if they move before waiting several days for penetrating oil...

Adjusting clutch cable is easy. My manual says you want 2-3mm of free play before the lever engages. Just use a screwdriver and (8mm?) wrench at the clutch actuation lever down by your rear brake pedal (on the same case/cover that your oil sight glass is on) to adjust cable tension until you've got the proper amount of play in the lever. Then you can use the thumb wheel adjuster at the handlebar lever to fine tune.

You shouldn't be able to roll the bike in gear without extreme effort with your hand off the clutch. However it is normal to still have have slight drag, with the clutch squeezed (vs neutral).

Seems no matter what direction I turn those bolts in down at the case, I'm not getting any more play at the lever. Perhaps a new cable is in order.

And there is almost no difference between the clutch in and out when in gear, as far as tension at the rear wheel.

Thanks, by the way.
~Mike

 

[t3rmin]

Remember there's a locknut on that cable adjuster. You have to loosen the locknut then hold the long nut while turning the screw at the end with the screwdriver.

 

[UncleMike]

Remember there's a locknut on that cable adjuster. You have to loosen the locknut then hold the long nut while turning the screw at the end with the screwdriver.

Hmmm,...no screw.

 

[t3rmin]

Maybe yours is different from mine...? Can you post a picture?

 

[UncleMike]

Maybe yours is different from mine...? Can you post a picture?

Unfortunately, no. Perhaps tonight, if my friend has a digital camera, and I'm not sure that he does.

I still use my old 35mm Konica, much to the chagrin of the editors I work with when submitting pictures!

 

[t3rmin]

Unfortunately, no. Perhaps tonight, if my friend has a digital camera, and I'm not sure that he does.

I still use my old 35mm Konica, much to the chagrin of the editors I work with when submitting pictures!

Well I guess we'll have to wait for those pictures unless somebody else can chime in. I had a look at BikeBandit and it looks like your cable adjuster is different from mine, but I can't make much sense out of it on the crappy resolution microfiche.

If it helps, I like to watch the actuation arm (down there at the clutch cover) as I adjust the cable. You should be able to observe it move in and out as you tighten or loosen the cable. Keep adjusting it out until it's at the end of its travel and you have some slack. Then you'll see the handlebar lever is wiggly (or should). Then just adjust until you have 2-3mm of wiggle.

 

[KEITH KRAUSE]

Fully warmed up, the bike was idling at 2500rpms.

No change in rpms no matter where around the head gasket I sprayed. It's not weeping now, by the way. Maybe a little moist at the place it was weeping previously, but I'm not sure.

I turned it down to almost 1000, and the bike seemed like it was going to stall out, but still idled. Although the idle was wandering all over the place, and kept going up to 2000 rpms. It stayed around 1500 most of the time. No noticible change with the spraying, but it was hard to tell with the idle wandering all over the place.

What now?

Sure sounds like an intake leak to me, as I've said before.
Rising rpm with heat...wandering/erratic rpm. Has to be.
At the manifolds or head gasket. You say the manifolds are new, etc. I can only assume you're right about that, so that leaves the head gasket.
I mean, what else causes these symptoms? I said awhile back that certain ignition advancer mechanisms can loosen up and spin on the shaft or fail in other ways and cause hanging/fluctuating rpm's but I believe you said the ignition/advance operation was checked?
That takes us right back to the head gasket.
You need to have a compression test taken. That will prove it.

 

[UncleMike]

Sure sounds like an intake leak to me, as I've said before.
Rising rpm with heat...wandering/erratic rpm. Has to be.
At the manifolds or head gasket. You say the manifolds are new, etc. I can only assume you're right about that, so that leaves the head gasket.
I mean, what else causes these symptoms? I said awhile back that certain ignition advancer mechanisms can loosen up and spin on the shaft or fail in other ways and cause hanging/fluctuating rpm's but I believe you said the ignition/advance operation was checked?
That takes us right back to the head gasket.
You need to have a compression test taken. That will prove it.

Nope, I haven't had the ignition/advance operation checked.

The manifolds are new, I ordered them straight from BikeBandit and checked with Earl that I was ordering the right thing. It's the same manifold for all four ports, so I'm not really sure how I could install them incorrectly.

I'll do a compression test today.

Thanks,
~Mike

 

[UncleMike]

Here's the bad news.

Compression test results:

Cylinder #1 - 145psi
Cylinder #2 - 125psi
Cylinder #3 - 125psi
Cylinder #4 - 145psi

I poured a little Marvel Mystery Oil into cylinders 2 and 3 and got the following readings:

Cylinder #2 - 152psi
Cylinder #3 - 152psi

That's rings, right? Or could it just be that I re-torqued the head gasket incorrectly,...meaning not tight enough?

Tell me something good, please.

~Mike

 

[Dave8338]

If it were a gasket compression issue ie. head bolts not being torqued enough or in the wrong order, you shouldn't see the #2 and #3 jump 20+ psi when you add the Marvel Oil. Just for fun "because you have not had enough fun yet :? ", try the Marvel Oil on the #1 and #4 cylinders.

You may be closing in on the issue, I hope I'm wrong :-# .........

Dave

 

[UncleMike]

If it were a gasket compression issue ie. head bolts not being torqued enough or in the wrong order, you shouldn't see the #2 and #3 jump 20+ psi when you add the Marvel Oil. Just for fun "because you have not had enough fun yet :? ", try the Marvel Oil on the #1 and #4 cylinders.

You may be closing in on the issue, I hope I'm wrong :-# .........

Dave

Do I need to warm the engine up again, or can I just take a reading on 1 & 4 now and then drop the oil in and take another reading?

 

[Dave8338]

I guess I'd run the test with the engine temps where you had them in the first test, just to keep all the numbers as consistent as possible.

 

[UncleMike]

I guess I'd run the test with the engine temps where you had them in the first test, just to keep all the numbers as consistent as possible.

Sorry, I was too impatient. I already did cylinder #1.

Engine wasn't cold, but wasn't warm either.

I did a reading first just to check and got 135psi. Then I added a little oil and checked again. 215psi.

That doesn't seem to bode well.

 

[Dave8338]

Sorry, I was too impatient. I already did cylinder #1.

Engine wasn't cold, but wasn't warm either.

I did a reading first just to check and got 135psi. Then I added a little oil and checked again. 215psi.

That doesn't seem to bode well.

Well, thats plenty high! :shock:

 

[UncleMike]

Well, thats plenty high! :shock:

Yeah, so what the hell does that mean?

 

[Dave8338]

Though it May not be the silver bullet...that range in compression will make it hard to get your bike to balance out at an idle...