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They look but they do not see

  • Thread starter Thread starter Kerry
  • Start date Start date
Even vigilant drivers screw up

Even vigilant drivers screw up

I always look for bicycles and motorcycles, and don't use my cell phone, and still, I almost pulled out in front of a motorcycle. I didn't see him till my second, last check look, before I took my foot off the brake. It really shook me up that day and as a rider, I try to never forget that it's not just idiots that are a threat, but also simple human error.
 
Awareness

Awareness

coldwhiteguy said:
I always look for bicycles and motorcycles, and don't use my cell phone, and still, I almost pulled out in front of a motorcycle. I didn't see him till my second, last check look, before I took my foot off the brake. It really shook me up that day and as a rider, I try to never forget that it's not just idiots that are a threat, but also simple human error.
Click to expand...

You know...ever since I started riding in the Fall of 2011, I have become more aware of the hazards on the road. Not that I didn't know they existed (more like taking it for granted and thinking, "I'll never collide into any of these landmarks") but that now I'm on a bike--I have no frame to absorb the impact and seatbelt to keep me from going airborne!

Every time I see a rider my thought process is this:

1. Are they wearing gear?
2. What type of bike is it?
3. Are they making an ass of themselves?

Of course, these thoughts run through my mind with cars but unless it's a unique car, I won't bother.

Usually, I'll hear the motocycle from their loud pipes but there are times when I don't, so constant glancing at all mirrors helps me locate them.

I'm almost driving like I ride at times...with my head like a swivel. You never know who's gonna pull up beside you...maybe it will be a Hot chick? In any case, don't beat yourself up too bad for BARELY avoiding an accident. You know what you need to improve on; just do it. (And don't dwell on the incident. Learn to get over it and move on)


Ed
 
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koolaid_kid said:
We all know they are out to get us. Went to the bank yesterday and then to the grocery store. Two close calls in 17 miles (just filled up so my odometer was current). IDK, all we can do is be vigilant.
I don't give them anything more than a loud toot on my Fiamm Freeway Blasters, since one fellow pulled out a pistol and pointed it at me. Not worth it to me.
Click to expand...

A) take down plate of a$$ hole, and call or go see the police file complaint

B) pull out your pistol, shoot him, call police to report a self defense shooting

I am sure neither are all that great, but B would be my way of doing things....

I think....

.
 
koolaid_kid said:
I don't give them anything more than a loud toot on my Fiamm Freeway Blasters,



since one fellow pulled out a pistol and pointed it at me. Not worth it to me.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that is a felony. You should have taken his license number and called the police. They take that sort of thing SERIOUSLY. That is assault with a deadly weapon.
 
Kerry said:
..........
............................................. even when cagers are looking right at you, they sometimes just don't see you.
..
Click to expand...

They are not looking for empty road for a certain distance. They just point their face in that direction and without much analysis just somehow decide to go or to wait without a lot of thought involved.

Which is why I have learned to look at driver some, but more watch the front wheel. That will give first indication of movement and acceleration and direction. Sometimes at night, can not see driver anyway, but maybe can see light of the brake light going off.

Another way to say the above: They are not looking for empty clear road, but just if they don't see a car or truck, they may pull out. And this may include if something is blocking their view (like a car turning, or a pole or sign blocking view of your bike for half a second), they don't see a car or truck, so pull out.
So if I lost sight of them for half a second by a pole or sign or bush or car turning, I know they didn't see me for that time either.

Other thing I look for: If a car is stopped and looks like they are infact stopped and waiting, I think "are they stopped and waiting for me, or are they stopped and waiting for something else, such as; that other car coming from other direction, and are they going to pull out right after that other car". SO watch them more critically at that point after that other car goes by.

.
 
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I saw a cager with a "no texting" bumper sticker; guess what they were doing?
 
tkent02 said:
Drinking a beer?
Click to expand...
I couldn't tell; the passenger's head obscured my view.
(Actually, it wasn't that long ago that in MO and MN, you could drink a beer, while driving, as long as you were SOBER)
 
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Cagers look right through us......... An everyday experience for most riders which has fascinated me for many years. I would like to share my homespun philosophy on the particular subject of cagers not seeing riders.
Warning - I may have dreamed up all this stuff to stay sane.

What if it's actually true that cagers don't see us when they are looking right at us and it's not carelessness or disrespect?
Reading research in the 70's it was reported that to cagers, motorcycles were the least conspicuous vehicles on freeways, however the most conspicuous were police motorcycles.
At one point in the 80s Volvos pulling out in front of cycles in the UK got so bad you could buy aerosol cans of Volvo repellant for your bike. Most reckoned Volvo were too successful in their safety cage marketing and drivers felt invulnerable.
My IT friends tell me that there is no way the brain processes all the data collected by the eye - the brain applies a need to know filter based on perceived threats or opportunities and perhaps cultural conditioning.
It's famously said that if the human eye were an instrument it would be returned to it's maker for repair.
My first flight instructor taught me the difference between looking into a space and seeing into it - sort of the optical equivalent of hearing and listening.
We all know the stories about the sad lives of the immortal, the invisible and King Midas and how their powers ultimately lead to tragedy. Guess what. I think riders are actually invisible in some situations. When we say we're invisible what we really mean is that a cager person has had no respect or care for me and has chosen to treat me like a lower life form with no rights. Socially 'invisible' if you like. The truth could be a lot weirder than that.
Depending on the demands on the brain at the time I believe a driver can look into a space , make eye contact with a rider on collision course, relegate the threat level to low and then their brain completely erases the rider and his or her machine. They never actually saw you and you don't exist.
I don't think there is much point in getting mad at them for some perceived failing, lack of courtesy or respect. That will only reduce your survival chances.
The way I look at it I have to deal with true invisibility and it's not the cagers fault. Makes us superheroes in a way:)
 
Brendan W said:
Cagers look right through us......... An everyday experience for most riders which has fascinated me for many years. I would like to share my homespun philosophy on the particular subject of cagers not seeing riders.
Warning - I may have dreamed up all this stuff to stay sane.

What if it's actually true that cagers don't see us when they are looking right at us and it's not carelessness or disrespect?
Reading research in the 70's it was reported that to cagers, motorcycles were the least conspicuous vehicles on freeways, however the most conspicuous were police motorcycles.
At one point in the 80s Volvos pulling out in front of cycles in the UK got so bad you could buy aerosol cans of Volvo repellant for your bike. Most reckoned Volvo were too successful in their safety cage marketing and drivers felt invulnerable.
My IT friends tell me that there is no way the brain processes all the data collected by the eye - the brain applies a need to know filter based on perceived threats or opportunities and perhaps cultural conditioning.
It's famously said that if the human eye were an instrument it would be returned to it's maker for repair.
My first flight instructor taught me the difference between looking into a space and seeing into it - sort of the optical equivalent of hearing and listening.
We all know the stories about the sad lives of the immortal, the invisible and King Midas and how their powers ultimately lead to tragedy. Guess what. I think riders are actually invisible in some situations. When we say we're invisible what we really mean is that a cager person has had no respect or care for me and has chosen to treat me like a lower life form with no rights. Socially 'invisible' if you like. The truth could be a lot weirder than that.
Depending on the demands on the brain at the time I believe a driver can look into a space , make eye contact with a rider on collision course, relegate the threat level to low and then their brain completely erases the rider and his or her machine. They never actually saw you and you don't exist.
I don't think there is much point in getting mad at them for some perceived failing, lack of courtesy or respect. That will only reduce your survival chances.
The way I look at it I have to deal with true invisibility and it's not the cagers fault. Makes us superheroes in a way:)
Click to expand...

I bet you are right. I have caught a few shows on cable lately that show the weird tricks our minds play on us. Brain Games was one of them, I cant remember the other shows name. If you watch these shows you will never fully believe an eyewitness account of identifying a criminal again. Our minds are very flawed....some more than others.
 
Ride Safe

Ride Safe

Brendan W said:
Cagers look right through us......... An everyday experience for most riders which has fascinated me for many years. I would like to share my homespun philosophy on the particular subject of cagers not seeing riders.
Warning - I may have dreamed up all this stuff to stay sane.

What if it's actually true that cagers don't see us when they are looking right at us and it's not carelessness or disrespect?
Reading research in the 70's it was reported that to cagers, motorcycles were the least conspicuous vehicles on freeways, however the most conspicuous were police motorcycles.
At one point in the 80s Volvos pulling out in front of cycles in the UK got so bad you could buy aerosol cans of Volvo repellant for your bike. Most reckoned Volvo were too successful in their safety cage marketing and drivers felt invulnerable.
My IT friends tell me that there is no way the brain processes all the data collected by the eye - the brain applies a need to know filter based on perceived threats or opportunities and perhaps cultural conditioning.
It's famously said that if the human eye were an instrument it would be returned to it's maker for repair.
My first flight instructor taught me the difference between looking into a space and seeing into it - sort of the optical equivalent of hearing and listening.
We all know the stories about the sad lives of the immortal, the invisible and King Midas and how their powers ultimately lead to tragedy. Guess what. I think riders are actually invisible in some situations. When we say we're invisible what we really mean is that a cager person has had no respect or care for me and has chosen to treat me like a lower life form with no rights. Socially 'invisible' if you like. The truth could be a lot weirder than that.
Depending on the demands on the brain at the time I believe a driver can look into a space , make eye contact with a rider on collision course, relegate the threat level to low and then their brain completely erases the rider and his or her machine. They never actually saw you and you don't exist.
I don't think there is much point in getting mad at them for some perceived failing, lack of courtesy or respect. That will only reduce your survival chances.
The way I look at it I have to deal with true invisibility and it's not the cagers fault. Makes us superheroes in a way:)
Click to expand...

Based on your assessment, I would sooner make myself invisible by getting as far away as possible from cagers. (It's not always possible but only in the moment)

Look at them as obstacles in the road instead of objects that think. Do their thinking for them...and when you can't, let them have the right of way.

It takes total concentration & commitment to operate a motorcycle safely. It takes even greater ability to manuever from point A to B with the courage/courtesy/wherewithal in making the right decisions. We're not perfect and neither are all operators on the road.

Your clincher leads me to to believe that WE riders need to balance confidence & cockiness--that is the challenge.


Ed
 
Too bad this cager cost the motorcyclist and the passenger (the passenger died later than when this story was posted) their lives,
and the driver only suffered minor injuries. Stuff like this is just too frequent where I live.

1377195206253.jpg


See the story,
http://www.cfnews13.com/content/new...icles/cfn/2013/8/22/_1_dead_after_motorc.html

See the video, (I wonder if that's the cager 28 seconds into this video saying "I want to go home?" I think it is)
http://www.cfnews13.com/content/new...orcycle and car crash, car bursts into flames

Second victim dies.
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/topstories/article/325071/483/Second-motorcycle-crash-victim-dies
 
GSXR7ED said:
Based on your assessment,

I would sooner make myself invisible by getting as far away as possible from cagers. (It's not always possible but only in the moment)

Look at them as obstacles in the road instead of objects that think. Do their thinking for them...and when you can't, let them have the right of way.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with that! They are all bullets looking for a place to impact. Stay as far away from them as possible, and do all the thinking because they don't do any. Ride with zero trust of anyone else on the road.
 
earlfor said:
I completely agree with that! They are all bullets looking for a place to impact. Stay as far away from them as possible, and do all the thinking because they don't do any. Ride with zero trust of anyone else on the road.
Click to expand...
Many moons ago I was rolling up to a stale red light outside three lanes of cages. I knew the sequence well and hit the line at speed (silly I know) as the light changed to green only to see a police bike stopped on the inside lane. Well he chased after me and caught up and flipped the visor with a kinda what was that move about wave of his arm. Well, with another wave of my arm, I told him, all serious like, that cages are dangerous and you have to get away from them as fast as ever you can or they'll kill you . He sort of laughed and we rode on together the next mile or so in the middle lane chatting away as police patrolmen and their buddies do, waving our arms and pointing at stuff. Meanwhile there are three lanes of cagers behind us driving so careful it's like it's test day.They is no chance whatsoever that our bikes are invisible. Even after he turned off I stuck to the limit for the next four miles or so just to see all them cages in a line behind me scared to overtake. Some days the sun really shines.
 
Redman said:
They are not looking for empty road for a certain distance. They just point their face in that direction and without much analysis just somehow decide to go or to wait without a lot of thought involved.

Which is why I have learned to look at driver some, but more watch the front wheel. That will give first indication of movement and acceleration and direction. Sometimes at night, can not see driver anyway, but maybe can see light of the brake light going off.

Another way to say the above: They are not looking for empty clear road, but just if they don't see a car or truck, they may pull out. And this may include if something is blocking their view (like a car turning, or a pole or sign blocking view of your bike for half a second), they don't see a car or truck, so pull out.
So if I lost sight of them for half a second by a pole or sign or bush or car turning, I know they didn't see me for that time either.

Other thing I look for: If a car is stopped and looks like they are infact stopped and waiting, I think "are they stopped and waiting for me, or are they stopped and waiting for something else, such as; that other car coming from other direction, and are they going to pull out right after that other car". SO watch them more critically at that point after that other car goes by.

.
Click to expand...


That's a remarkably good analysis, I will absolutely share this with others.
 
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