C
catbed
Guest
ok, ill take the pumpkin off. i dont need to drain the oil right? just inbolt the three bolts on the swing arm? also, is it easy to take the actual splines off the wheel and pumpkin. i wont do it if it isnt worth it.
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GSJohn
Guest
It looks good...splines look OK in the wheel and on the pumpkin. There is some unknown quality grease that is fairly fresh and there are shiny parts in the wheel so maybe the splines are newer ones. I'm going to go ahead and put my new Avon rear tire on also. I bought some Honda Moly 60 grease today so I will clean off all the old and get a better look at the splines.
Drive splines:
Wheel driven splines:
Drive splines:
Wheel driven splines:
Steve
GS Whisperer
GSJohn,
Look carefully at the driven splines in the wheel hub. Those are the ones that usually wear out. The one that I have seen worn (on CafeKid's 1100) had the ends that you can see, but it was worn beyond them. If you can't clean the hub very well, take off the retainers and slide the hub out of the rubber dampers. then you can easily check the condition of the splines to see if they are worn down. It won't hurt to put a thin film of grease on the pins that slide into the dampers, as well.
.
Look carefully at the driven splines in the wheel hub. Those are the ones that usually wear out. The one that I have seen worn (on CafeKid's 1100) had the ends that you can see, but it was worn beyond them. If you can't clean the hub very well, take off the retainers and slide the hub out of the rubber dampers. then you can easily check the condition of the splines to see if they are worn down. It won't hurt to put a thin film of grease on the pins that slide into the dampers, as well.
.
Just a quick note that may or may not do any good:
I changed the rear tire on my 1990 VX800 last night and carefully cleaned and examined these parts and re-lubed with the Honda Moly Paste. (It's the exact same coupler system -- Suzuki never re-engineers anything if they can help it.)
Everything looks virtually brand-new (the first thing I did when I got the VX home many miles ago was to remove the rear wheel and switch to the moly paste), but I noticed that the driven coupler in the rear wheel is a shiny silver color.
I've pulled out a couple of the bad "soft" 82-83 spline units, and they are a shiny gold color.
And, of course, the earlier "harder" 79-80 spline units are a matte black color. ('81 spline units are a mixed bag).
So the conclusion I draw from this is that sometime between 1983 and 1990, Suzuki updated the driven coupler once again, and it's back to being a durable, reliable part. If you replace your soft "gold" coupler with a new part (about $90-$100, less than one o-ring chain) you should get a durable "silver" coupler.
As I noted before, this exact part number is still in use to this very day. It is and was used on a lot of Suzuki shafties. So you do have an option other than haunting eBay for parts of unknown quality.
I have to say I wish Suzuki had designed this part a little better -- I worked on a Honda Sabre a while back, and the coupler in the wheel had HUGE teeth -- it honestly looked a lot like the axle on a 350HP tractor, or something from a Russian Army tank. There was no way this thing would wear out or strip. The bike didn't seem to have any driveline play, either. I still much prefer my GS, of course.
I changed the rear tire on my 1990 VX800 last night and carefully cleaned and examined these parts and re-lubed with the Honda Moly Paste. (It's the exact same coupler system -- Suzuki never re-engineers anything if they can help it.)
Everything looks virtually brand-new (the first thing I did when I got the VX home many miles ago was to remove the rear wheel and switch to the moly paste), but I noticed that the driven coupler in the rear wheel is a shiny silver color.
I've pulled out a couple of the bad "soft" 82-83 spline units, and they are a shiny gold color.
And, of course, the earlier "harder" 79-80 spline units are a matte black color. ('81 spline units are a mixed bag).
So the conclusion I draw from this is that sometime between 1983 and 1990, Suzuki updated the driven coupler once again, and it's back to being a durable, reliable part. If you replace your soft "gold" coupler with a new part (about $90-$100, less than one o-ring chain) you should get a durable "silver" coupler.
As I noted before, this exact part number is still in use to this very day. It is and was used on a lot of Suzuki shafties. So you do have an option other than haunting eBay for parts of unknown quality.
I have to say I wish Suzuki had designed this part a little better -- I worked on a Honda Sabre a while back, and the coupler in the wheel had HUGE teeth -- it honestly looked a lot like the axle on a 350HP tractor, or something from a Russian Army tank. There was no way this thing would wear out or strip. The bike didn't seem to have any driveline play, either. I still much prefer my GS, of course.
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GSJohn
Guest
There must be very few miles on this hub spline because there is no wear at all. Hard to get a good pic but all the splines look like the ones at 9 o'clock in this pic. I think it may be the newer silver colored part, not the gold or black ones.
Steve
GS Whisperer
Once again, John, you need to look at the other end of those teeth. Remember the first two pictures in the first post of this thread? Here is a reminder:
This is what would be on the other side. Those little tips on the far side are what you are looking at in your picture, so you have to look beyond them. 8-[
.
This is what would be on the other side. Those little tips on the far side are what you are looking at in your picture, so you have to look beyond them. 8-[
.
Actually, you can see several of the teeth back there in the picture, and they do look OK.
You can also see most of a part number, which appears to be the updated part number available today, 64680-45113.
This started out as 64681-45100 in the '79 models, and became 64680-45112 for the '80 - '83 models. Both part numbers have been superceded by the new one, 64680-45113.
The original coupler part number for my VX800, 64680-07A01, has also been superceded by the new part number, suggesting this part was redesigned sometime in the mid-'90s.
Innnnnnnteresting. Or maybe it isn't really all that interesting. I dunno. I'm just grateful we can still get any parts at all! \\
/
G
GSJohn
Guest
Yep, you can see the entire spline pretty easily while you are cleaning out the old grease with Q-tips. It would be quite difficult to miss damaged splines while cleaning...at least on my 650. I used up my wife's Q-tips and resorted to using a small drill bit and tipping it with pieces from her cotton balls. It actually works quite well...turn the bit clockwise to wrap the cotton on the end then clean a spline then twist it counterclockwise into a rag to remove the tip...then repeat. Tedious but it works. I tried washing it out with gas and a toothbrush but it worked best to scrape out as much as I could with a piece of popsicle stick then use the cotton tipped bit.
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GSJohn
Guest
Don't tell me that thing just pops out easily....
.
T
TheCafeKid
Guest
Yup. Just use a flat head screw driver to pop it out carefully. Its simply setting in bosses sheathed in rubber cushions. No bolts holding it in except the retaining clips there on the outside. I think its 6? Simple to get off.Don't tell me that thing just pops out easily....
Bumping an old thread because it seems appropriate.
I did a search for "Moly 60" to read up on it and I liked this thread. And I called a Honda shop about 5 miles away from me and they've got the Honda Moly60 for ten bucks. I went to two auto parts places and they had never heard of moly60. One guy looked it up in a book and is having some delivered, but I'ma go with the Honda place 5 miles away.
My splines were toast at 24,000 miles, too, and I experienced that funny clunking GSJohn described. Riding along and it suddenly felt like I picked up a rubber marble and let it clunk around inside the wheel for 5-10 seconds and then disappeared. I went to a bike mechanic but he was unable to duplicate the problem.
I did a search for "Moly 60" to read up on it and I liked this thread. And I called a Honda shop about 5 miles away from me and they've got the Honda Moly60 for ten bucks. I went to two auto parts places and they had never heard of moly60. One guy looked it up in a book and is having some delivered, but I'ma go with the Honda place 5 miles away.
My splines were toast at 24,000 miles, too, and I experienced that funny clunking GSJohn described. Riding along and it suddenly felt like I picked up a rubber marble and let it clunk around inside the wheel for 5-10 seconds and then disappeared. I went to a bike mechanic but he was unable to duplicate the problem.
S
Skateguy50
Guest
I pulled mine at 18k miles and only used bearing grease on the outside and later learned my mistake. When I was going to change the tire at 30k miles i found a black spline to have on hand just in case, luckily the stock one was in perfect condition but I swapped it anyways and used the honda moly60 stuff.
So if anyone finds out the hard way about this and needs a spline let me know, but preventing it is really the way to go.
So if anyone finds out the hard way about this and needs a spline let me know, but preventing it is really the way to go.