Will Extensive Idling Kill Battery?

[Anonymous]

I've been struggling to tune my '83 GS550L over the last two weeks. It got a new battery with a full charge when I started. I've spent about 5 evenings messing with the idle screws, finally borrowed a carb sync and got things pretty nicely tuned up. Put the side covers back on and the seat and figured I'd go for a spin. As soon as I started out of the garage, the bike stalled and hitting the starter killed the battery in a couple trys. Put my charger on the bike, started it up, removed the charger and same thing. Bike dies.

Figured I'd better check the charging system, but needed a well charged battery so I left it on the charger over night. Today I'll check it again, but my question is, with all the idling while adjusting things in this hot weather, would the battery be drained?

I hate to think it's the charging system. This bike only has 6K on the clock.

Thanks!

 

[zstanisi]

I am afraid you'll have to check your charging system. It should be charging the battery even when idling, and that doesn't seem to be happening.

 

[Anonymous]

I am afraid you'll have to check your charging system. It should be charging the battery even when idling, and that doesn't seem to be happening.

Damn it. I was looking for a different answer. :roll: Thanks, I'm sure you're right. I'm getting a little frustrated with this bike. Bought it in April and figured I'd have it on the road by May. Hm. Here comes July.

 

[chrissinc]

Try a new battery first if you like I had a couple of wonky batteries in my time that couldn't charge for sh!t even with 14 volts at 4000 RPM going through them. YOu could also check your fluid levels, without water the battery isn't going to charge. At least it rules out one possiblility and checking the battery is free.

 

[duaneage]

Make sure the idling is correct. If the bike idles too low it won't charge.

BTW when the bike is hot the stator loses efficiency and does not put out as much at idle. When wire heats up to 200 degrees it has higher resistance and does not conduct as well.
Excessive idling will cause the voltage to drop down to 11.6 or so with the head light on and the brake light lit. If I can do it I sit at long lights with the brake off or the headlight off.

 

[dpep]

The charging system would not be the reason your motorcycle dies. A motorcycle will run without a charging system as long as there is juice in the battery. Something is draining your battery. Now your charging system could be responsible for that, and charging problems are a fact of life for GSs, but this does not sound to me like you have run the bike enough to have lost that much charge. I hope you aren't letting the bike run at low idle for hours at a time. These air cooled engines don't like that kind of thing. You might also have a short or have something miswired causing your battery to drain when the bike is off.

Let us know if the overnight charge took care of things. Check to see if it is charging correctly (see the Stator Papers on the home page of this site) when you get it started back up. Take it for a ride and see if the voltage is decreased when you get back. Check the battery when you shut the bike down at night and see if it loses significant voltage by the next day. If it does, do the same thing the next night, but pull out the main fuse to see if that keeps it from draining.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks, Don. I'll post my results when I get the chance. Last night "honey-doo's" consumed my time and tonight's not looking good either.

I try not to let it idle for longer than 15 minutes or so. Just enough to keep it warmed up to do things like change the oil and tweak the carbs. One thing struck me as odd when doing my carbs, when the bike would sputter and die, the starter would engage it self for just a second. This is my first electric start bike and that kind of surprised me. Especially since my finger was no where's near the button. :?

 

[GS_hoolagan]

charging system

charging system

Excessive idiling will drain the battery the bike wil not run if the battery drops below 10dcv, there will not be enough voltage to saturate the ignition coils. dont use the bikes charging system to charge a discharged battery the "GS" charging systems are flighty at best: DO NOT USE AN AUTOMOTIVE BATTERY CHARGER<(MY MISTAKE) use a battery MOTORCYCLE charger .5-2 amp float charger or a battery tender. forcing too many amps through the battery WILL fry your battery. and make sure all the connections are clean especially GROUND connections. check your charging system. the stator windings could be shorting when the bikes gets hot. try these tests when the bikes is warm.

:TEST:
stator output
stator winding resistance
diode test
voltage regulator output

STATOR resistance should be continous in all 3 legs and isolated from ground

DIODE test .4-.6 ohms go direction and infinity or OL in the NO-GO direction depending on the volt meter(DVOM) i use a fluke 78 ( isolate the system when doing ohmatic testing) 4 diode=8 test 6 diode=12 test 8 diode=16 test ect.. pos/neg side

STATOR OUTPUT should be between 75-80+ VAC
voltage regulator should put out 13-15dcv @4k-5K rpm

I HOPE THIS HELPS

check manual for details:

 

[duaneage]

Re: charging system

Re: charging system

Excessive idiling will drain the battery the bike wil not run if the battery drops below 10dcv, there will not be enough voltage to saturate the ignition coils. dont use the bikes charging system to charge a discharged battery the "GS" charging systems are flighty at best: DO NOT USE AN AUTOMOTIVE BATTERY CHARGER<(MY MISTAKE) use a battery MOTORCYCLE charger .5-2 amp float charger or a battery tender. forcing too many amps through the battery WILL fry your battery. and make sure all the connections are clean especially GROUND connections. check your charging system. the stator windings could be shorting when the bikes gets hot. try these tests when the bikes is warm.

:TEST:
stator output
stator winding resistance
diode test
voltage regulator output

STATOR resistance should be continous in all 3 legs and isolated from ground

DIODE test .4-.6 ohms go direction and infinity or OL in the NO-GO direction depending on the volt meter(DVOM) i use a fluke 78 ( isolate the system when doing ohmatic testing) 4 diode=8 test 6 diode=12 test 8 diode=16 test ect.. pos/neg side

STATOR OUTPUT should be between 75-80+ VAC
voltage regulator should put out 13-15dcv @4k-5K rpm

I HOPE THIS HELPS

check manual for details:

The diode resistance is 400-600 ohms, not .4 - .6 ohms

 

[Anonymous]

Many thanks!!! I'll post my results after I do my homework in the Haynes manual... However, last night the Toyota truck decided to spew brake fluid all over my driveway. :x Looks like I picked a bad week to work on the bike...

 

[GS_hoolagan]

resistance

resistance

the manual preforms the test using a analog meter
i used a digital meter the resistances will be different-

diode test 6.0-7.5 ohms in the (X1 ohms) range analog meter
( lower impedance )

 

[duaneage]

Any analog meter will be at least 20kohms/volt and this will yield accurate results with the diodes. IF your reading values that low then the diodes are toast

 

[Anonymous]

Whew - a couple of things...

Analog and digital meters read the same....or they wouldn't be meters...they are made for measurement. I think I know why they read differently.....

- it is because the analog and digital meters supply a different voltage to the diode...I would suspect the digital meter may not "turn-on" the diode completely. If so - your readings may in fact very quite a bit and be higher with the digital meter.

Idling drains bike batteries-period. Agree with post that says charge with a .5 to 2 amp charger overnight. Make sure your distilled water level is high enough in the battery. Charging systems do not work well below 1750 rpm - you can see that by revving a bike from idle and watching the headlight against the garage wall. You will see the headlight "brighten" around 1700 rpm or so. Simple test - if it brightens - your system is "probably" OK.

Next put a voltmeter across the battery and watch the voltage, you should be able to see the voltage rise to about 13.2 to 14.5 volts. It shouldn't be too low or too high.

Electricity is fun-NOT. Can't see them darn electrons to know if they are doing their job properly. Have fun. Dieter

 

[duaneage]

Whew - a couple of things...

Analog and digital meters read the same....or they wouldn't be meters...they are made for measurement. I think I know why they read differently.....

- it is because the analog and digital meters supply a different voltage to the diode...I would suspect the digital meter may not "turn-on" the diode completely. If so - your readings may in fact very quite a bit and be higher with the digital meter.

Idling drains bike batteries-period. Agree with post that says charge with a .5 to 2 amp charger overnight. Make sure your distilled water level is high enough in the battery. Charging systems do not work well below 1750 rpm - you can see that by revving a bike from idle and watching the headlight against the garage wall. You will see the headlight "brighten" around 1700 rpm or so. Simple test - if it brightens - your system is "probably" OK.

Next put a voltmeter across the battery and watch the voltage, you should be able to see the voltage rise to about 13.2 to 14.5 volts. It shouldn't be too low or too high.

Electricity is fun-NOT. Can't see them darn electrons to know if they are doing their job properly. Have fun. Dieter

On the face of an analog meter is the stated and rated ohms per volt. THis is what the internal whetstone bridge divides the resistance by. Most digital meters use FET technology for over 20Mohms per volt so the source impedance is not a problem anymore. But older meters may give readings that are not accurate in a high impedance circuit.

Checkl the battery and go forth, this does not apply to the germanium diodes used in the rectifiers.

 

[displaced]

Just a side note--whenever anyone does some tuning that requires the bike to idle, try using an electric fan and also remove the headlihght bulb if you dont have an on and off switch for the headlamp.

 

[b717doc]

Just a thought

Just a thought

Hey buddy, cheer up!!! These are not that complicated!!! I do own a 1982 GS 1100 which appears to be o.k., electrically, however, I also own a 1981 Honda CB650 that is the master of charging problems, believe me....The bike put out 11.7 volts at idle, and seemed to charge fine (>14.0 vdc) above 4000 rpm, but I could'nt ride for over 40 miles without the battery dying on a new "Autozone" battery, somewhat limiting the distance I could ride. The mechanic I talked to kept saying "YUASA, YUASA, YUASA", refering to the battery I "Need". Well I say BS! A battery is a battery. Trust me, nothing could be further from the truth. I broke down and paid $52 for a new YUASA, and MAN what a difference!!! I now comfortably ride for well over 150 to 200 miles in all traffic conditions, and she fires right up, no problem. I do remove the seat and place a 2 amp "trickle" charge for about 20 minutes. Try the YUASA......this made a 100% difference for me......

 

[Anonymous]

jump start ?

jump start ?

My bike (80 GS450) is been sitting for about a week, so the battery is dead. I want to start it again and go, so can I just jump start it with my car ?. And why is the battery dead so soon, is this a sign of future problems to come ?.
Thanks in advance.