Avon AM26 Roadrider vs Shinko's SR741 & 230 Tour Master

[Chuck78]

I'm trying to narrow down my top choices in tires now. I've got a 3.50x18 DID rim in the mail, so that I can effectively and safely run a 130-150 rear tire. Probably going with a 2.50x18 or maybe 2.50x19 front rim as well in the near future.

Now obviously if money were no object, I would just get the Avon's in an "R" compound for the extra grip, but even the normal street compound is in the mid to upper price range.

People talk really good things on here about the Shinko 230 Tour Master tires. Shinko actually bought all of the former Yokohama motorcycle tread patterns and compounds. The Shinko's and Avon AM26's are both V-Rated (149+ mph) tires. I was wondering how they compare to the Avon's, and also if anyone here has any experience with the Shinko SR741 rear tire?

The 230 Tour Masters are not available in any wider/lower profile sizes for the rear, and I'm leery of the 130/90 Shinko, as an 80 with the shorter sidewall would be good by me, but a 130/90 is going to be a pretty tall tire. I find lots of praise on the 230 Tour Masters, but the SR741 is a newer tire with only a fraction of the reviews, all pretty good though. It comes in the 140/70/18 size that I am looking for however. I am hoping it is as grippy as the 230 Tour Masters.

[Chuck78]

$144 for the Shinko 230 front/SR741 rear
$224 for the AM26's with 150 rear ($need to offset sprockets$)
$261 for the AM26's with a 140 in the rear.
(lowest approximate shipped prices from google shopping results)

Avon AM26 Road Rider rears:
$151 140/70/18 5.6" wide 26.2" diam (3.5-4.5" rim, 3.75 is best)(closest to the stock 26.4" diameter)
$104 130/70/18 5.2" wide 25.6" diam (3.00"-4.00"rim)
$136 130/80/18 5.4" wide 26.5" diam (2.50"-3.50" rim)
$122 120/90/18 5.1" wide 26.6" diam (2.50"-3.00" rim)
$112 120/80/18 4.7" wide 25.7" diam (2.50"-3.00" rim)
$115 150/70/18 6.1" wide 25.9" diam (3.5-4.5" rim, 4.25 is best)
Avon AM26 Road Rider front:
$109 110/90/18 (4.6" wide 26.1" diam (closest to stock 26.1" for speedo accuracy))
$109 110/80/18 (4.4" wide 25.2" diam)
$104 100/90/19 (4.3" wide 26.4 diam (could use same spokes and even re-lace rear 2.15x18 to front hub, budget build))




Shinko SR741 rear
$77 140/70/18 (5.47" wide and 25.71" diam recommended 3.75" rim)


Shinko 230 Tour Master rears
$81 120/90/18 (4.69" wide 26.5" diam recommended 2.75" rim)
$83 130/90/18 (5.08" wide 26.8" diam recommended 3.00" rim)

Shinko 230 Tour Master fronts
$68 100/90/18 (3.98" wide 25.08" diam recommended 2.5" rim)
$81 120/90/18 (4.69" wide 26.5" diam recommended 2.75" rim but same size in Avon says 2.5" or 3" rim)
$67 110/90/18 (4.29" wide 25.79" diam recommended 2.5" rim)(much smaller than the same size in Avon's)
$65 110/90/19 (4.29" wide 26.81" diam recommended 2.5" rim)
$65 100/90/19 (3.98" wide 26.10" diam recommended 2.5" rim)

[Chuck78]

Shinko SR741 rear tire reviews:

"Used this on an 85 V65 Sabre for 5000 miles. I'm a daily commuter with 40 miles a day. Tread is almost gone at 5k. Was good in the rain. Can be a little slippery if pushed hard on a corner in very hot weather. Handled a load (2 passengers & luggage) well. Balanced with no weights after installation. Overall this has been a great tire, especially for the price"

"This tire is on my 2007 Harley Superglide 96 Cubic inch. It's a little soft on under power cornering, But tread life is awesome avg 6,000+ miles, I am placing my order today for my 3rd one of these. For the price, I love it."

"Just got this tire and i can tell you its amazing for the price. Much greater than I expect, overall great buy.."

"Riding, I feel stable on the bike however a few times when cornering I have felt this tire slide a bit."

"i only had a rear of this model and it lasted about 4-5k miles b4 the cord was showing. very sticky but doesn't last long enough...i wasn't even aggressively riding it."

"I bought this tire for my sport bike. Took it out for a spin today and it handles really nice. Smooth through the curves"

"For it's price I cannot complain yet that's not to say it's a bad tyre. I run a set, SR740/741 on my GS500 at 34/38 PSI. The last lasted for about 8.5K miles, in the wet they are confident and slippery when pushed hard in corners - on hot days; overall, I can't fault the tyres' short comings as I do run it at higher pressures for commuting. Additionally the warm up time may be incredibly slow - miles - on cold days. I'll buy a Shinko again and I'll buy the same for the rest of ownership. I don't race, I commute and I ride about 10K miles a year."

"I purchased this at the end of the summer 2011. May 2012, less than 1000 miles on the tire, and the tread is gone. I ride my bike to work when it's clear...no racing, no hard riding, burnouts... I am disappointed. I've learned my lesson and won't make that same mistake again."

"put 160 miles on the SR740/SR741 since yesterday,feels like a new bike! all racey, smoother ride as its not as harsh over bumps and pot holes, more stable feeling and no tingles from being out of balance. I'll be buying these shinko's again.... "

"ive done 1300+ miles on these, i feel confident with grip during leans. even have scraped my foot pegs a few times. Love the tread pattern on the back one. Good cheap tires."

" my shinko's are doing better than I expected, great wear and decent grip, they are cheap and handle pretty good."



Avon reviews:
"I had these on my GS500 for about 9000 miles before needing replacement. I've felt a bit of slippage in roundabouts, but for the most part, these Avon's are good tires. I just purchased my second pair."

"This tire really grips on the corners. Only thing I didn't like was the tire on the left and right sides’ wear down before the center, but that is from my riding habits. Tire heats up quickly for great traction and braking."

"Kinda noisy like a dual sport tread."


I have heard of a few people having this problem:

"Really impressed with the handling, but at 4K I pulled the tire due to severe cracking on the sidewall. The tires were manufactured just a few months before I purchased them but after six months they looked like they had be stored in a barn for ten years. I would say the tread was about half used up"

There are far more reviews for the Avon's, almost all EXCELLENT with great cornering and good rain traction, but a few like this which I am shocked by after all the great reviews:

"I have had these tires on for 2000 miles and they are cupping very badly on the sides. ZERO rain traction. Nearly slammed into a car in the rain when I gently braked and both tires locked up. One good thing is they have no warm up time because you couldn’t lean over if you wanted to. They will dump you off!"
"Tire was on a 77' honda cb400f ss. It was greasy feeling from the start. Could not carve around turns like I could with previous tires. I think it is because this tire is designed to go on either the front or rear. Have not driven in the rain or other wet conditions yet with it and I won't. It is not safe to drive on in dry conditions. When cornering it buckles, also it just slides out at not a very steep angle. I guess you get what you pay for. Spend the money and get a real tire instead!!!!!"




Reading reviews of all three tires, it seems as if the much cheaper Shinko's are a good bit softer, and get about 5000 miles, where the Avon's which are acclaimed to grip pretty well, will give you about double or more miles, but at almost double the price.

[tkent02]

The Roadriders are great, just bought a pair of Tourmasters, haven't tried them yet.

[bwringer]

My review of the Shinkos.

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=200977

In a nutshell:
Great tires, great price, didn't last long. Good choice if you don't ride a ton of miles and need to save a few bucks.

Avon RoadRiders are more expensive to buy, but work out cheaper per mile. I've never seen one crack, and I've installed and worn out dozens. The batch with the cracking problems should be long gone by now anyway. Many more sizes available than the Shinkos, so might be a good choice if you're doing strange things with wheel sizes. I think they look really cool, too.

[Chuck78]

Aside from tread life, would you say that grip & cornering is the same quality between the Avons & the Shinko's?????

[salty_monk]

I have good experience with the 705 shinko's I've used. As much grip as the Avons in anything real world I've done.

Just to add another thought.. You have enough width for Avons Azuro ST Radials if they do one to fit... I'm going that route in 19f 17r shortly.

[Chuck78]

The Azaro only comes in 16 or 17 rear tire diameter, and the rear tread pattern is ugly as sin.

I was told by two different GSR posters that "you can't run radials on wire wheels." I don't have a clue why they say this. Research tells me that radials are much stiffer tires, and that it's best to stick with a bias ply if your bike was designed around bias ply, otherwise your cornering and steering characteristics will be adversely affected, and your ride quality will be more harsh. Radials are of similar construction to bias ply other than the direction that the core material (the "threads/cords" that show through when your tire goes bald) is woven or layered. radials are perpendicular, bias ply are staggered diagonally. That is my understanding.

[Chuck78]

I am thinking that I will probably go with the Shinko SR741/230 Tour Master combo. The Avon's will give me double the mileage, and a little extra width for the same sizes, but the Avon's have more groove/road paint line following characteristics and the 140 rear is priced astronomically higher than the 150 or 130. They also sometimes get complaints of the tread wearing unevenly or cupping. I think they are more sensitive to tire pressure vs load.
The Shinkos are much softer, which I bet grips a little better, but seem to get a slight bit slippery on hot summer pavement. They are much cheaper as well! I'm still debating AM26 vs Shinko, but with the investment I'll have in all the mods to my bike, saving a little money for the time being and getting as good of handling characteristics will be a plus.

If I was doing a 130 Avon, that would be better, as the 150 is too close to the tire without buying offset sprockets. The 130 Avon is 5.2" wide and the Shinko 140 is 5.47" wide, so it's still worth it to go with the Shinko there for more width and a slight bit more diameter to keep the gearing similar.

[salty_monk]

Radial tyres actually have a softer sidewall not a harder one...

[tkent02]

Much thiner too, if you run them down until the tread is gone they are paper thin. Scary.

Unlike car tires the radials don't seem to last any longer or grip any better than good bias ply tires, I don't know why people pay the extra cost for them.

[salty_monk]

In my case... an experiment - because I can

I think they might track better & provide a different level of comfort / confidence but I've been wrong plenty of times before.

They were not much more than the Roadriders I would have bought otherwise... lets see how they perform & last.

[Chuck78]

As far as sizes go, I had considered a 120/90 front Shinko which is just a hair wider than a 110/90 Avon AM26 at 4.6" wide (Avon) and 4.69" wide (Shinko 230). The 110/90 Shinko is 4.29" wide. Shinko says 2.75" rim width for the 120/90, Avon says 2.5-3" rim for their similar width 110/90. I will be going with a 2.5" rim most likely, as the only 2.75"'s I see available are $$$ Sun rims.

Running a 140/70/18 rear on a 3.50" rim and a 2.50" front rim, am I best to stick with the 4.29" wide Shinko 110/90/18? Or would the wider 110/90 4.6" wide Avon AM26 or 120/90 4.69" wide Shinko 230 have a positive effect on how well the bike grips during hard cornering?

I'm shooting for the most cornering traction I can get, although I know there comes a point (especially with front tire sizes?) that a wide tire will have more travel to lean due to the larger radius of the tire profile, and therefore takes a little longer to "turn in." Also, if Shinko says go 2.75" rim on this width tire (although Avon says 2.5 or 3" rim), maybe I should pay attention and just go for the 110 Shinko on a 2.50" rim? If I went for a 3.00" rim, I'd be afraid that the tire profile would end up being too flat and not cornering well, so a slight bit smaller than recommended may be a better thing for cornering.

[bbjumper]

I look for the balance between handling and longevity. I had a set of Michelin Pilot Activ's on my GS and they really impressed. I had no problems with handling, they lasted 16k mi., would like to try them again now that I have the suspension sorted. At around $ 220.00 for the pair that is a great deal even compared to the Shinkos if you consider the R/R.. Switched to Bridgstone S11"s this time around, we'll see how they do.

Cheers

[Chuck78]

Anyone have any input on size? Is a 4.6" or 4.7" wide bias ply tire on the proper width front rim going to be an improvement in handling, or is it going to take too long to turn in?

My theory is that maybe 140 was considered a really fat rear tire in the late 80's or early 90's, yet modern bikes run monster tires, because the stiffness and handling characteristics of radials allow them to run the larger widths and still have crisp handling.

My previous theory was that "if modern sport bikes run monstrously wide tires on really wide rims, running a 140-150 rear and a 110-120 front on a vintage bike on the correct width rims will make them handle closer to a somewhat modern sport bike."