1980 GS550E Electronic ignition .... issue

[ukjules]

1980 GS550E I have a piranha elecronic ignition that has worked fine
for years ever since i bought the bike 6 years ago.

Issue:
-Smoke and heat seen in the piranha elec ignition box. Was very hot
-Only runs on 2 cyl - 2/3 cyl (of course 1/4 cyl runs off a separate coil)
-I noticed the horn - was not connected and rattling about still connected over the engine !
(wander if this could have shorted something ?)

So on this run after 30 miles of perfect running i stopped for petrol as i thought it had just gone on reserve.
It had not and gone onto 2 cylinders! Bike ran fine but only on two cylinders.
Stopped and checked and was only running on Cyl 2/3 thus i thought the coil for 1/4 must be faulty.
No fuses gone / bike all ok bar that.

Hobbled back home on two cylinders and no heat smoke ...

today
-The coil for Cyl 1/4 had melted plastic around one of the connecting posts.
(madly the primary still tests ok still (3.5ohms)
-No fuses gone
-All other electrics fine
-I have checked all connections, any bad looking ones I made new double crimp
connectors so the wiring is now perfect.
-the plugs, ht leads and plug caps are ok.

Put on a spare coils and exactly the same issue - only runs on 2 /3 cyl.

Q) Do you think i have fired the electric ignition ?
(It looks ok)
Q) do you think the horn rattling about near the ht leads could have caused something ?
Remember on the way back with this horn on correctly i had no issue at all - bar being on 2 cylinders)

Q) Is there anything lese i can test before buying a expensive elec ignition ? (?140)
Q) If i have fried the elec ignition and if so where can i get a piranha type ?
or do i change and use a dynatec , dyna s one.

Background:
I had an issue a few weeks back wth the type of regulator used on this bike. (one with a sense wire, cant be standard)
This I am sure I have sorted with the sense wire attached to the rear brake live switched wire.
Due to this not connected for a time .... it fried a coil a few weeks back ! the same side , 1/4 Cyl, i am having an issue with now.
This however blew fuses !!!!
Be aware this time there are no blown fuses.
I almost think this previous issue damaged the elec ignition ?


Your thoughts would be so appreciated !

 

[tom203]

"I had an issue a few weeks back wth the type of regulator used on this bike. (one with a sense wire, cant be standard)
This I am sure I have sorted with the sense wire attached to the rear brake live switched wire.
Due to this not connected for a time .... it fried a coil a few weeks back ! the same side , 1/4 Cyl, i am having an issue with now.
This however blew fuses !!!!
Be aware this time there are no blown fuses.
I almost think this previous issue damaged the elec ignition ?"

you likely damaged your ignition module at same time with an overvoltage condition - even a brief one, before fuse blew.

 

[ukjules]

Thanks - that seems logical for sure.
Any advice on what type of elec ignition to get ? Think piranha hav gone out of business ?
Dyna S seem ok and damned simple to install - less bulk to them than the piranha.

Anyone have any views on these ?
[h=1]Suzuki GS550 77 to 83 Dyna S electronic ignition system[/h]

 

[tom203]

The dyna is very popular- make sure you get right version - depends on whether you had a ND ignition orignially or the KD version.. Your bike probably came with theND setup, but I'm not sure!

 

[ukjules]

How do i find out which ignition i had on it ?
It was upgraded to a piranha when i got it ! No points to distinguish the type ?
Not a stamp to be seen anywhere with type either.

I have looked on cmsl and i think i have the type of my bike right 1980 gs550et:
http://www.cmsnl.com/suzuki-gs550e-...e22-e24-e25-e26-e30-e34_model13479/partslist/

This shows that bike had (mine) the Kokusan type !

there is no other way right ?

 

[tom203]

Over this side of pond, our 1980 gs550 came with electronic ignition- most likely a ND unit. Your link implied that your 1980 still had contact points- I'm sorta skeptical. Can you take a pic of the plate that the mechanical advancer gizmo spins around? My 1981 gs650 ND unit looks like this pic. Someone with a 550 will likely know more.

 

[ukjules]

Yes my bike had points for sure !!! not that i have ever seen them as i bought it with a Piranha electronic ignition installed.
I send the cmsl parts diagram as if that is standard it means my bike would have come with kokusan ignition as per the picture,

I will take a pic aap but my one looks identical to yours !
There are no markings on any surface.

 

[Guest]

Jules - we still had points over here in 1980. The American market were a year ahead of us. We didn't get the fancy electronics til '81. I'll take a look at mine tomorrow and try to determine whether I have Kokusan or ND.

 

[Grimly]

Thanks - that seems logical for sure.
Any advice on what type of elec ignition to get ? Think piranha hav gone out of business ?
Dyna S seem ok and damned simple to install - less bulk to them than the piranha.

Anyone have any views on these ?
Suzuki GS550 77 to 83 Dyna S electronic ignition system

You can still buy a new Pirhana from Newtronic, sold direct from Autocar, who seem to have absorbed them
https://autocar-electrical.co.uk/products/newtronic-ignitions/suzuki-mc/newapp

Absolutely excellent systems. Mine is well over 30 years old and still sparking like a champ. Frankly, I'd rather buy another than a Dyna.

 

[ukjules]

Many thanks to all on the info. I have emailed Newtronic as they do offer systems and i agree they are brill and reliable.
The issue is i need them to answer if they have one for the gs550. They show the part number but dont stock the part
according to site. When they reply ill inform. I so hope they have as it will drop right in.

If not then its .. Dyna. (But there is still no chance of me finding out which ignition system i had kd or nd
as i never saw this bike with points - the only method of finding out which one you had !!! - condensers were located
differently for each)

 

[Grimly]

Many thanks to all on the info. I have emailed Newtronic as they do offer systems and i agree they are brill and reliable.
The issue is i need them to answer if they have one for the gs550. They show the part number but dont stock the part
according to site. When they reply ill inform. I so hope they have as it will drop right in.

If not then its .. Dyna. (But there is still no chance of me finding out which ignition system i had kd or nd
as i never saw this bike with points - the only method of finding out which one you had !!! - condensers were located
differently for each)

If you're lucky, you could pick up another Piranha control box and simply plug it in - I'm assuming the triggers are still ok. I've got a spare Piranha system I picked up from a Z750 or something - same parts, just on a different backing plate, and the exact control box as mine. Thousands of them were sold, so some are kicking around used. Keep your eyes open at bike / autojumbles, Craiglist, preloved, etc.

 

[ukjules]

I think you are right i only need the control box.
The pickups on atu, look ok but i don't know. I might get away with it .

Only one place that has responded and they are in aus !
piranhaoffroad.com.au

they quoted me a barking mad price and it wasnt even including freight.
Ill forget them totally and probably use dyna now, at least you can get them. No point in putting stuff on that you cant get hold of parts.
I will have to assume my bike is as the parts diagram and a kd igniiton. No other way in the world of knowing other
than trying it !

ll inform if my attempt worked ! but it will cost me ?140 to find out

 

[tom203]

"No other way in the world of knowing other
than trying it !"

that's the spirit! Over here, the last 550's with contact points had the KD setup. 50/50 odds ain't bad!

 

[ukjules]

Update:
I found another company in Aus selling my original
Piranha but now 're branded to newtronic.
Apparently piranha sold it to a Italian company.

Anyway this chap stocks for many bikes and has
One for mine , an updated version.

So purely as they were so helpful I ordered from him .
?130 Inc postage via air mail !!!!

I will update ! But faith restored !
And I'm missing the good weather too for cruising so need this now !

 

[Grimly]

I mentioned Newtronic up there ^^^^^ - in the UK.
I think they'll be around for a while yet, and on the doorstep.

 

[ukjules]

You did indeed ! and thanks.
Thing is the site when i asked them via email for info they actually took down
the newtronic section so you cant even browse it ! They never responded.

Anyway the guy in Aus is and was so helpful instantly and the price was better than the uk ! i
and via airmail !!
ordered from him ! An absolutely top chap.
The chap told me:

"Piranha sold
the name to an Italian company so they could finance new development. The
Newtronic kit will directly replace your Piranha without any modification.
The Newtronic kits now have updated modern electronics and LED lights on the
Switching Unit to assist with timing. I have been the Australian distributor
for Newtronic since 1999."

 

[Grimly]

It's still there for other models...
https://autocar-electrical.co.uk/products/newtronic-ignitions/suzuki-mc
But the 550 one isn't listed, right enough.

Oddly, the one listed for the 79 GS850 says it won't do for the 80 GT model, which is wrong, because that's exactly what I'm running on mine now.
Maybe Newtronics changed something, but the whole thing swapped over no trouble from one to another for me.
<edit>
Now I recall, I had to swap the 79 points cam over, that was all. The Piranha optical shutter assembly fits over the earlier cam, not the later one.

 

[ukjules]

I will post some pics when arrives !
I also so hope I have got this right !
That it is the election ignition at fault and the only reason it blew was due to running
the bike for a short period without the regulator sense
wire attached. (I never put that regulator on and has worked until I
removed and replaced it minus the sense wire.
(This had blown fuses and a coil before )

If this is not the reason I'm in big trouble.

 

[ukjules]

Update:
I got the Newtronic system today madly from my man in Tasmania ! It took a week or so ....
Anyway it is in and the bike appears to go a lot better.

I am in agreement i seriously like the Newtronic system.
Anyway the bike is now going again i just hope beyond hope nothing else blows up !

 

[Grimly]

Update:
I got the Newtronic system today madly from my man in Tasmania ! It took a week or so ....
Anyway it is in and the bike appears to go a lot better.

I am in agreement i seriously like the Newtronic system.
Anyway the bike is now going again i just hope beyond hope nothing else blows up !

Excellent.
I'd totally forgotten it would run coils up to 8A draw, which opens up the option of wanging on some high-output coils, from some source or other, probably auto-related.
http://www.motorcycle-ignition.com/motorcycle_ei_kit.htm