1983 GS850GL - Blowing Headlights, idles at 18 volts

[Guest]

Hi GsResources,

I am new to electrical systems and am trying to wrap my head around the common electrical issues I've read on this site. I have mostly seen charging issues where the battery dies, which points to the stator phases going out, but not quite sure about over charging.

I've blown 2 headlights now and finally measured the voltage on the battery as it is running. 18 volts idling at ~1000 rpm, 19.5-19.9 volts slightly revving, maybe ~2500-3000 rpm.

Is this an easy fix or do you knowledgeable folks need more information?

 

[Brendan W]

The regulating part of your regulator/rectifier system is not working to keep the voltage controlled to about 14.4 Volts.
Symptoms include blowing bulbs and if not fixed for a while, boiling of battery. Check what the electrolyte level is.
Many of us have replaced the R/R with an SH775 series unit.

 

[Guest]

The regulating part of your regulator/rectifier system is not working to keep the voltage controlled to about 14.4 Volts.
Symptoms include blowing bulbs and if not fixed for a while, boiling of battery. Check what the electrolyte level is.
Many of us have replaced the R/R with an SH775 series unit.

Great! Sounds like a simple replacement. Is the SH775 preferable to a Suzuki OEM unit?

And I have an AGM battery in it. Is there anything I could check on that?

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

Yes. Do some searching on the site. Use advanced search, put in your keywords. Choose titles only to get any meaningful search results.

welcome to the site. Some useful links for you in my signature. The charging system sorted thread had my complete charging system saga, but there are many just like it on the forum. Basically, a new (used) genuine Shindengen SH 775, probably a new stator, clean up your wiring, eliminate the headlamp loop, should get you going. If I were you I?d start with a new good battery. I wouldn?t trust the one you have.

 

[Brendan W]

Great! Sounds like a simple replacement. Is the SH775 preferable to a Suzuki OEM unit?

And I have an AGM battery in it. Is there anything I could check on that?

Don't know if the oem is even available and even if it was I would not get one. It was designed to allow the generator to run at full whack and dump the excess into the generator windings. When regulators failed this had the added bonus of frying the stator windings. The SH775 unit switches off the current if not needed and I've only seen one report of a failure.
Some of the guys here have listed sources for one but beware of pretend copies or same as deals on ebay. Again, lots of threads here about that issue, how to recognise a genuine part and how to wire them up including the elimination of a loop to the headlight that won't be needed.
Know nothing about AGM except how to spell it. For the time being avoid riding it.

 

[Guest]

Don't know if the oem is even available and even if it was I would not get one. It was designed to allow the generator to run at full whack and dump the excess into the generator windings. When regulators failed this had the added bonus of frying the stator windings. The SH775 unit switches off the current if not needed and I've only seen one report of a failure.
Some of the guys here have listed sources for one but beware of pretend copies or same as deals on ebay. Again, lots of threads here about that issue, how to recognise a genuine part and how to wire them up including the elimination of a loop to the headlight that won't be needed.
Know nothing about AGM except how to spell it. For the time being avoid riding it.

Thanks! I'm reading up on regulators. Is what you're describing with the current dump into the stator windings a shunt type regulator?

And looks like genuine SH775's on Polaris parts sites (p/n 4012941) run ~$200 :disturbed:

But just bought a used one on Ebay for ~$60 :encouragement:

Thanks guys! Learning lots!

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

You don’t need to buy a new SH775. Look up member Nessism and see if he has a used one that’s tested. Or find one on eBay. If you find one on eBay and you’re not sure if it’s genuine, post it here and we’ll try to help you out.

Oh, I see you found one. Might we have a look?

 

[Guest]

You don’t need to buy a new SH775. Look up member Nessism and see if he has a used one that’s tested. Or find one on eBay. If you find one on eBay and you’re not sure if it’s genuine, post it here and we’ll try to help you out.

Oh, I see you found one. Might we have a look?

Sure!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polaris-Ra...4bde9304d7b351d55a6d|ampid:PL_CLK|clp:2334524

 

[Nessism]

Sure!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polaris-Ra...CE-150-Voltage-Regulator-4012941/303341885592

Looks fine. Triumph has a pigtail harness that plugs right in that sells for about $10.

Wire it up like this...

SH775 Install by nessism, on Flickr

 

[Grimly]

Sure!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polaris-Ra...4bde9304d7b351d55a6d|ampid:PL_CLK|clp:2334524

Yep, powersportsnation is a trusted seller of genuine good used ones, in my experience.
Caution - don't start the bike until you fix this, else you'll kill your ignitor.
18V hasn't done it any favours already, so just hope it's not damaged.

 

[Redman]

If you are on your way of replacing with a sh755, do proceed with that.

whats the chance the 850 has had a Honda r/r installed? Can tell because it will have the 3 stator wires, the positive and the ground like stock and most, but the Honda will also have a “sense” wire that others don’t, and needs to be tied to a positive that is switched off with the key (often power to brake lever switch). Reason I ask, is if you do have one of those Honda r/r (a common improvement for some time) and If that Sense wire is disconnected or other such problem with it that r/r putts out max it can all the time. I had this happen, 17v at low speed and over 19 at speed. Just thought I would mention it.

 

[Guest]

If you are on your way of replacing with a sh755, do proceed with that.

whats the chance the 850 has had a Honda r/r installed? Can tell because it will have the 3 stator wires, the positive and the ground like stock and most, but the Honda will also have a ?sense? wire that others don?t, and needs to be tied to a positive that is switched off with the key (often power to brake lever switch). Reason I ask, is if you do have one of those Honda r/r (a common improvement for some time) and If that Sense wire is disconnected or other such problem with it that r/r putts out max it can all the time. I had this happen, 17v at low speed and over 19 at speed. Just thought I would mention it.

Hi,

I don't think it had a Honda installed, here are some pictures (sorry, wasn't able to upload them but hopefully the link works):

https://i.imgur.com/DfBnoMw.jpg

Can't quite make out the writing:
https://i.imgur.com/Jrp6vS5.jpg


However, I do have this reg/rec from my old 1982 Kawasaki KZ that is out of commission I could steal for the time being:
https://i.imgur.com/y7IMPDe.jpg

Shindengen SH230:
https://i.imgur.com/OE1sH0z.jpg

6 wires:
https://i.imgur.com/eN474nb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/4pahnDF.jpg

Any idea how this SH230 would wire up to my bike?

 

[Guest]

Yep, powersportsnation is a trusted seller of genuine good used ones, in my experience.
Caution - don't start the bike until you fix this, else you'll kill your ignitor.
18V hasn't done it any favours already, so just hope it's not damaged.

Hi,

I've probably put a good amount of miles on the bike the way it is. Any suggestions on how to check the health of the igniter?

 

[Guest]

Looks fine. Triumph has a pigtail harness that plugs right in that sells for about $10.

Wire it up like this...

SH775 Install by nessism, on Flickr

Hi Ed,

Thanks, looks simple enough! I ordered this kit earlier today:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UI4L0IE/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

I initially bought that same Amazon connection kit to connect my SH775. It worked fine, but, a few months ago I replaced it with the legit item from Triumph for the same money. The Triumph kit is WAY better. Connections are potted into the terminal blocks, and the wires are a much thicker gauge.

regarding posting pics: you already have an Imgur account, that’s half the battle. The rest is a little tricky, but once you know how will be no big deal. Follow the link in my signature.

 

[Guest]

Hello everyone, an update! The Kawasaki reg/rec I mentioned before works!
Wired up:
https://i.imgur.com/Uqzt9iH.jpg
Running at 1000 rpm:
https://i.imgur.com/jIa1lrY.jpg

14.24 volts! Far cry from the 18 volts at idle before.

Thanks everyone, learned a lot more about old bikes in a short time span!

Thanks for the tip, Rich, but the files are massive, and the smaller sizes Imgur allows are too small.

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

Size doesn’t matter. I downloaded your pic, uploaded it to my Imgur account. Copied the BBCode (Huge thumbnail). That took about 10 seconds. It took me longer to type this reply. All I’m saying is, people appreciate and are more likely to reply to questions when you post pictures in this way rather than posting a link or small pic that has to be clicked on to view properly.

 

[Redman]

Good to hear of the success.

In your post #12, I got lost between which is what was present and what you had as a spare. And I thought I already explained about 5wire verse 6 wire R/Rs. ANd then I had to go.

If I understand correct, now you have this installed ("wired") and all is working (over 14vdc).

Which appears to be the 6 wire, what I called the Honda r/r, (also used on Kawa).
The three that are same color, typically yellow, are the ac input from the stator. The red/wht is the DC out. THe black is the negitive-ground. And then the 6th wire, kinda brown or tan is what I called the "sense" line that needs to be tied to a hot wire of the bike that is switched on/off with the key. (will work if tie to batt+ but will also cause a little bit of a drain when parked.)
Perhpas you have already figured all that out.

Do I understand properly that as shown in the pic is how it is installed on the bike? The harness there is from your bikes existing r/r, and connected to the spare Kawa r/r you had? The harness there appears to have the stock color codes, so maybe was a stock r/r.


The bike has and had the mating connector?
And then the the kaw r/r grey sense wire is connected to the bikes red wire.
And then probably red wire in the bikes connector is connected as the stock wiring to the main red wire in the bike that is unswitched (still connected to battery+ when key off), in which case, the sense line (brown?gray?) of the r/r will be causing a small drain on battery when key is off. SHould be okay if bike is on maintainer charger, otherwise will drain the battery over several days.

And the kaw r/r red/wht wire (the r/r output) has a ring terminal, I assume is then connected to battery+ (or the solenoid post which essentially is batt+ but ring terminal doesnt look big enough).....? Most folks would recommend a fuse there if connected directly to the battery (or solenoid).
ANd then there is a long detailed discussion about how having the r/r directly to battery+ (or solenoid) varies from stock, and then more current going thru the main fuse most of the time .... but we will leave that till later.... not that important, and different folks have different understanding.



Good that you have it back in operation.
So you have it charging well now. Good.
THe benifit of installing the sh775 is that it is easier on the stator and stator last longer. If/when you do install the sh775, it doesnt have a sense line.

 

[Redman]

https://i.imgur.com/Uqzt9iH.jpg

To post as a picture:
Use the gsr forum icon for "insert image" (square thing with a tree in it) (not the thing that looks like film strip), use the "from URL" tab,
paste in the https : / /i.imgur.com/Uqzt9iH. j p g there (not in the posting), click off the check mark, click OK.

Or.... in imgur, I dont know if you are using the app or the web site, but maybe the share function has a way to get the IMG code or the BB code, and then just paste that directly into the posting (without using the icon). Will look something like this, but then display as the picture when is posted,
[IMG ]//https : //i.imgur.com/ Uqzt9iH.jpg /// [/IMG ]
(I buggered it up so you can see the code without it displaying as the picture)

 

[salty_monk]

That SH230 will be of the same "shunt" operation as the stock but will regulate better than the stock. The SH775 or the 8 series are Series regulators. They regulate by going open circuit rather than shorting (shunting). The difference is the latter creates a lot of heat in the Stator.