A 650 vs a 850

[timebombprod]

Why did the 850 outlast the 650? Maybe size but looking into the paper specs it seems that the 650 might be able to outdo the 850 in plenty.

Ofcourse these are paper specs but I want to hear input.

Gs650gl hp-73
Tq-42
Redline-9500
Wet weight-500ibs

Gs850gl hp-78
Tq-48
Redline-9000
Wet weight-557ibs

I know this is shafty models but even the top speed on the 650 is higher! I know the 850 has a lower redline but this makes me ask the question, why the 850?

 

[Redman]

Why did the 850 outlast the 650? . . . . .
... . . . . .

You mean durability..... Which has longer serviceable life?
I had a 650G for 20+ years and a 850G for 20+ years with overlap of several years that had both at same time. And I can tell you that I sure revved out the 650 a lot more than I did the 850....... but I doubt that had much effect on it.

Or you mean why the 650 only made/sold for 3 years (81,82,83) and the 850 for more like 6 years (78?-85?)...? Well, that is a question of sales and a question of marketing. And I think 850s sold better than 650s. I bought my 650G new from show room at end of the year after it sat there nearly a year. (only new bike ever for me)

THe 650 had two shaft models and a chain model.
THe 850 had 2 shaft models (80 and after).

I recall some knolowdeable comments about the 650s being designed by some outside group (not Suzuki corp), and maybe that had some influence on the situation (and why the 650 have some parts unique to only 650s).

 

[timebombprod]

Still great info but I mean, why wasnt the 650 as popular. I bet it has to do with size lol. And with the paper numbers it would seem the 650 is possibly a bit more capable cornering and maybe the straight.

You saying the bike was designed by another group actually makes good sense to me, plenty of odd parts and hard to find aftermarket support! gives a good insight in my opinion, I knew it was a bit of a odd one but that makes it even more.

I know the 650s engine was used after the gs650 was discontinued, glad they did I think it's a good engine.

And yes that 650 loves reading the whole tach, mine seen 9k+ plenty and doesnt show any weakness, it just wants to keep going.

 

[650Skull]

Going by these guys, 4 GS650's were made from 81-84. 3 shaft models and one chain model.
https://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/bikes/suzuki6.html

81/82 GS650E, (X/Z), is chain driven. 12.83 sec Standing quarter mile. Basically the same engine as the GS550 with a bigger barrels and a different styled head and pistons to raise the compression. Roller bearings on the crank .....same for 82

81 GS650GT shat drive. 13.3 SQM. con-rod bottom has shells instead of bearings. Different head design and gearbox......Built looks similar as the GS650E built is a touring bike.

81-84 GS650G Katana. 13.3 SQM, Same engine and shaft drive as above, radical design for the day

81/82 GS650GL. Cruiser style, same engine and drive as the Katana, and GT.

So the GS650E, (X/Z), 81/82 is the rarity of the bunch, but the case's, (not 100% sure on the cases), and bottom end is basically a GS550

Sitting around a camp fire......."i have a 650"...."I have an 850".......

Found some other pilot jets that are supposed to be for the GS650 BS32SS carbs

 

[hank2]

Yes, 4 models, including the Katana version of the 650G ( G-M?) That one wasn't sold in the US, but they occasionally show in breakers here. Maybe from Canadian models. It seems that was a popular model in the UK and Germany. I think the Katana body work was designed by former BMW designer Hans Muth. All else was Suzuki, including all the GS650 shaft model oddities. Plain bearings, engine oil as primary lube, one off combustion chamber design, etc. I can't think of any use of the GS650G engines after the last Euro models in '84.

I have an issue of Cycle World from '81 with their road test of theGS650GT model. Ah, the good old days, with about a 6 page test and always a partial tear down. They loved it. They got a 12.9 quarter mile time with that model and 60 mpg, somehow. They also had it on a road race track and had good things to say. From a couple of UK and other sources, it seems that the 3 shaft models actually had 65 hp and 39 lb. ft. of torque. The chain model GS650E had 72 hp and 42 lb. ft. Different intake cam and larger exhaust.

As far as the GS850 model lasting longer, I would guess better sales, at least in the US. I know it was a highly regarded, dependable touring model when set up for that. I think there were some 850's that did round the world rides after being beefed up a bit. I've read of a Japan market only GS750G model

 

[timebombprod]

I've read of a Japan market only GS750G model

A 750g would be a great bike to have, my 650 is a tiny bit small and I feel the 750 would fit me well. I hardly can tell the bike is small on me once I'm riding but the initial getting the foot on the pegs I feel a bit cramped. I might change the seat style so I fit a bit better.

Is the chain worth the extra bit of power? The thing is if I wanted a bike with more power I'd want to find an OLD supersport, as in late 80s early 90s plastic bike golden age. Hard to find but sure look beautiful. I've actually seen a 86 or 88 gsxr sell for $1500.......it was spraypainted orange but the potential.....

 

[Steve]

Going by these guys, 4 GS650's were made from 81-84.

I don't know if there was actually an '84 GS650, but there was sort of a FIFTH GS650. :-k

Although it did not carry the "GS" label, it was based on the GS650. The XN85 was fuel injected, turbocharged, mono-shocked and had the first production 16" front wheel on a bike in the US. It was made from '83 through '85 but only 300 of the 1153 units made made it to the US, and they were all in '83.

It did not sell very well here, and was replaced by the cheaper and more-powerful 750ES.

.

 

[hank2]

I don't know if there was actually an '84 GS650, but there was sort of a FIFTH GS650. :-k

Although it did not carry the "GS" label, it was based on the GS650. The XN85 was fuel injected, turbocharged, mono-shocked and had the first production 16" front wheel on a bike in the US. It was made from '83 through '85 but only 300 of the 1153 units made made it to the US, and they were all in '83.

It did not sell very well here, and was replaced by the cheaper and more-powerful 750ES.


.

Wow, thanks for that info Steve. A rare duck indeed. From what I just read on a search it was very unreliable. Fuel injection on that engine!

 

[GS1150Pilot]

I think one reason the 850 survived the 650 is the non-L version. L's are pretty awful as far as aesthetics and pragmatics go. The GS850G is a standard bike that can do anything, haul two people in comfort, and look good doing it.

 

[GSJim]

I don't know if there was actually an '84 GS650, but there was sort of a FIFTH GS650. :-k

Although it did not carry the "GS" label, it was based on the GS650. The XN85 was fuel injected, turbocharged, mono-shocked and had the first production 16" front wheel on a bike in the US. It was made from '83 through '85 but only 300 of the 1153 units made made it to the US, and they were all in '83.

It did not sell very well here, and was replaced by the cheaper and more-powerful 750ES.

.

My neighbor has a couple of XN85s. Interesting beasts.

Jim

 

[93Bandit]

My neighbor has a couple of XN85s. Interesting beasts.

Jim

Your neighbor has a couple?

 

[rphillips]

This place is always full of surprises. I would have never had a clue the 650 eng. came with roller bearing crankshafts (for the "E" models) & plain bearing crankshafts (for the "G" models). Rekon what their idea could have been for the two totally different configurations? for roughly the same eng.....That's amazing.

 

[Steve]

Don't worry, there are even more differences, not counting the obvious difference in output (shaft vs. chain).

.

 

[GSJim]

Your neighbor has a couple?

And a bunch of classic Katanas.

Jim