Anyone Run Frame-Sliders on their GS?

[Tim Tom]

Just curious if anyone here has ever put frame sliders on their GS. The frame sliders I'm referring to function the same as case savers, but are much smaller, and basically just a thick peg, made of some sort of durable plastic. They are very common with newer sport bikes.

I have case savers on the bike now, but really do hate the way they look. I would not like to ride without some sort of protection for the engine cases, and have been thinking about adapting frame sliders for this purpose.

Anyone ever do this? Any glaring issues that I am not aware of that may occur?

Thanks in advance.
Tim

 

[Agemax]

they would have to stick out a long way to protect the engine cases on a GS. as you know most modern bikes have very slim engines and do not stick out from the frame like the GS motors do.
you would have to make substantial bracketry to mount them and if you did happen to slide down the road there is a good chance the brackets could bend or snap causing damage to the cases or even the frame.
just my thoughts any way.

 

[1980GS1000E]

If you could mount them in close proximity to the widest part of the engine, and below/ahead of it, it could work. Custom all the way, but certainly possible. Nobody markets anything like that, you would need to design it from scratch.

 

[Tim Tom]

Right on all counts. I was thinking of making an offset bracket that could be mounted on the end of the long engine mount bolt. Essentially this bracket would give enough of an offset that the frame slider could clear, and extend out to the side of the engine cases. The bracket itself would have to be pretty heavy duty, something along the lines of 1/4" alloy should be strong enough without being too much overkill.

Of course the slider would still need to be very long in order to stop the bottom edge of the cases from contacting the ground. I need to spend some time measuring and sketching to see if it's even feasible.

Perhaps something could be made that mounts directly to the engine cases themselves, and serves as a barrier. Allowing for a contact point that would not damage the engine. I have seen such 'engine sliders' on BMW's and Guzzi's but this would need to be TOTALLY custom...


Hmmm.

 

[Guest]

to make them strong enough to withstand a slide, they are going to be as bulky as a case saver.

might as well save some time and use case savers. paint them black and they dont stick out like a sore thumb.... as much.

Brian

 

[1980GS1000E]

I'm running black case savers. Took 'em off for a while, then got nervous so I threw them back on.

 

[Guest]

"I was thinking of making an offset bracket that could be mounted on the end of the long engine mount bolt. Essentially this bracket would give enough of an offset that the frame slider could clear, and extend out to the side of the engine cases."


Be carefull doing this as it will intale having to get longer engine mount bolts and going through delran or some other plastic may hamper the ability to keep the motor mount bolts at the right torque. Also if you do lay the bike down it has a tendency to either bend the bolts and crack the cases where the bolt passes through the cases or get bent bad enough that the parts you are trying to save get destroyed anyway . I am only passing on info from things we, [ My self and a friend of mine who races vintage bikes] have tried while road racing and the results.
We have found racing these old vintage bikes metal 3 point case guards work the best. We generally add a piece of titanium to the out side of the case guard.

 

[argonsagas]

"I was thinking of making an offset bracket that could be mounted on the end of the long engine mount bolt. Essentially this bracket would give enough of an offset that the frame slider could clear, and extend out to the side of the engine cases."


Be carefull doing this as it will intale having to get longer engine mount bolts and going through delran or some other plastic may hamper the ability to keep the motor mount bolts at the right torque. Also if you do lay the bike down it has a tendency to either bend the bolts and crack the cases where the bolt passes through the cases or get bent bad enough that the parts you are trying to save get destroyed anyway . I am only passing on info from things we, [ My self and a friend of mine who races vintage bikes] have tried while road racing and the results.
We have found racing these old vintage bikes metal 3 point case guards work the best. We generally add a piece of titanium to the out side of the case guard.

+1

You just put all my thoughts into words. (excepting the racing part, as I have not done that)

 

[bwringer]

hjfisk touched on the biggest problem with frame sliders on a vintage bike -- the frame and engine mounting points aren't nearly as strong as those on modern bikes. Plus, on average you've got a good bit more weight falling over.

Most modern bikes also have frames that wrap around the outside of the engine, whereas a GS frame goes under the engine -- sliders would need to be mounted on much longer, and hence weaker, bolts.

Decent protection for our bikes needs to have its own very strong structure with multiple mounting points to spread the load. The three point case guards may be a bit bulky, but they are the only way to do the job.

The "loop" style guards and the two point guards only protect against tipovers -- they bend and fold up if the bike is moving when it goes down.

It could be worthwhile to combine the two concepts -- maybe you could add sliding pucks to three-point case guards. Or, as hjfisk mentioned, add metal plates to the guards, or add a plate on the inside of the guard so it doesn't damage the engine as badly if it bends.

I've also noticed that the usual three-point case guards (not sure who made them) have very poor quality welds, and thus inevitably they break at the welds from vibration after many miles. The time is ripe for a better design.

 

[Jethro]

Case gaurds are very period and vintage. Rock them proud man! Get sliders when/if you get a modern bike.

 

[Reaper0001]

what we need is a cage with a frame slider on the edge of the cage

 

[Tim Tom]

hjfisk touched on the biggest problem with frame sliders on a vintage bike -- the frame and engine mounting points aren't nearly as strong as those on modern bikes. Plus, on average you've got a good bit more weight falling over.

You are absolutely right with the strength of 30 year old aluminum. I guess for now I will continue running the case guards. Perhaps they would look better painted black... Will have to investigate this winter when my bike will hopefully be getting a little make over.

what we need is a cage with a frame slider on the edge of the cage

The problem I can think of with this is it would further reduce the ground clearance. Unless you are running taller shocks to gain clearance I would think that the slider would touch down before the pegs. This would be bad. The slider would essentially be scraping hard parts, and that could get ugly.

Despite their name frame sliders are not supposed to touch down in the corners. They're supposed to protect the expensive plastics in the event of a crash.

Not much plastic on my GS, so protecting the engine is the priority.

 

[ChicagoBob]

Keep in mind that frame sliders are a racing convention, designed to prevent race bikes from shedding parts all over the track when they fall. Sliders aren't as effective on the road, where a fallen bike can be expected to hit obstacles, curbs, potholes, etc. Such impacts impart bending stress on the sliders and their attachments, and often result in frame damage.

Therefore, case savers are probably better-suited to street riding than any type of slide posts. Many mfrs of modern adventure bikes offer "crash guards," which are modern versions of vintage crash bars, designed for modern bikes, which have frames wider than their engines (except BMW, which can be fitted with guards which attach to the engine heads).

In addition, as the previous comments point out, vintage UJMs have such wide engines that it's the crankcase, rather than the frame, that requires protection in a crash.

I'd like to see some sort of resin or carbon fiber bolt-on or snap on case guards for the GS, like those offered for some modern bikes. Don't Dennis Kirk and Woodcraft have something like that?

 

[Tim Tom]

I'd like to see some sort of resin or carbon fiber bolt-on or snap on case guards for the GS, like those offered for some modern bikes. Don't Dennis Kirk and Woodcraft have something like that?

Are you talking about something like this?

http://www.kneedraggers.com/YOSHIMURA-CASE-SAVERS

or like this?

http://www.motosport.com/motorcycle/SATO-RACING-ENGINE-SLIDER-LEFT

Both are essentially a piece that uses the engine case mounting holes to mount up a 'sacrificial plate' that will take the scraping damage that would otherwise be given to the case covers.

Of course those two examples are both made for new bikes that do have slimmer engine cases. But the concept could be applied to create a custom set around a GS motor.

 

[Guest]

Are you talking about something like this?

http://www.kneedraggers.com/YOSHIMURA-CASE-SAVERS

or like this?

http://www.motosport.com/motorcycle/SATO-RACING-ENGINE-SLIDER-LEFT

Both are essentially a piece that uses the engine case mounting holes to mount up a 'sacrificial plate' that will take the scraping damage that would otherwise be given to the case covers.

Of course those two examples are both made for new bikes that do have slimmer engine cases. But the concept could be applied to create a custom set around a GS motor.

Yes that is a concept that works on the narrower newer bikes , but our GS's have more width and weight. Also if you went with a Say NRC case saving cover, [it is an aftermarket cover designed for road racing] the cover is almost bomb proof but the engine cases are so thin on the GS motors that they would just break at the mounts with any sort of hard impact.We have added pieces of titanium to the out side of the case cover just in case but we don't really expect it to do much in the case of a hard crash. We are very dependent upon the 3 point case guards. Also by the way we have always re welded the factory made ones and now we generally make up our own when the need arises, they are much stronger than the aftermarket commercial ones just not as pretty, unless black paint appeals to you.

 

[Dogma]

Frame slider on a Z1.