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Best suspension setup within stock bones

  • Thread starter Thread starter mattfeet
  • Start date Start date
So, per your recommendation(s), the 14.33" Ohlins should be a nice length for my GS1000. That is a 1.08" increase in rear shock height, approx. ~40mm.
 
mattfeet said:
Why do you prefer those over RaceTech? Is one legitimately better than the other? Who is the owner on here? I would like to at least start the conversation with him.

Matt
Click to expand...

Matt,

I'm the Sonic Springs guy. Our springs are virtually identical to Race-Tech's, and to all the other quality straight rate springs out there like Traxxion, Ohlins, Eibach, etc... We all use the same alloy and processing steps, spring technology is pretty basic. :)
So you can buy from whoever you like and you'll get a quality product. Ours are a little cheaper because of our direct to the customer business model, and I like to think that our support and service is a little better. I do own a GS, so I have some relevant experience.
I'd go with 1.0 springs and 15 weight fork oil. The Race-Tech emulators are a good product, and worth it if you're looking to maximize suspension performance. I would definitely go with the Ohlins shocks. A bit longer than stock is ok, but you have to be careful about overdoing it and running into stability issues.
 
mattfeet said:
So, per your recommendation(s), the 14.33" Ohlins should be a nice length for my GS1000. That is a 1.08" increase in rear shock height, approx. ~40mm.
Click to expand...


If you check the stock shock length for all the bikes listed I think you will find they are exactly like all the other GS's and so the 1" over is no accident and it would seems my brain is not all gone. :surprise:
 
RichDesmond said:
Matt,

I'm the Sonic Springs guy. Our springs are virtually identical to Race-Tech's, and to all the other quality straight rate springs out there like Traxxion, Ohlins, Eibach, etc... We all use the same alloy and processing steps, spring technology is pretty basic. :)
So you can buy from whoever you like and you'll get a quality product. Ours are a little cheaper because of our direct to the customer business model, and I like to think that our support and service is a little better. I do own a GS, so I have some relevant experience.
I'd go with 1.0 springs and 15 weight fork oil. The Race-Tech emulators are a good product, and worth it if you're looking to maximize suspension performance. I would definitely go with the Ohlins shocks. A bit longer than stock is ok, but you have to be careful about overdoing it and running into stability issues.
Click to expand...
Thanks for chiming in, Rich. I will likely place an order with you for springs. I may go with some racetech emulators as well, to maximize performance. Do you feel the 14.25" Ohlins I listed are too long? I can likely get stock length Ohlins for the same price but if I will see a benefit (eg. sharper steering) by going with the longer units, then I am all ears. My bike will rarely, if ever, see speeds in triple digits aside from idiotic on-ramp shenanigans.
 
posplayr said:
If you check the stock shock length for all the bikes listed I think you will find they are exactly like all the other GS's and so the 1" over is no accident and it would seems my brain is not all gone. :surprise:
Click to expand...

Yea, you're SU145's that you sold were listed at 330 +/- 10mm adjustability. Im not trying to be catty or argumentative, just trying to figure out what the best setup for ME is, given the parameters outlined in OP and in subsequent posts. If the 14.25" Ohlins are of benefit, then hell yea, Ill scoop them up. Otherwise, Ill put in an order for stock shock length Ohlins of the same model.
 
mattfeet said:
Yea, you're SU145's that you sold were listed at 330 +/- 10mm adjustability. Im not trying to be catty or argumentative, just trying to figure out what the best setup for ME is, given the parameters outlined in OP and in subsequent posts. If the 14.25" Ohlins are of benefit, then hell yea, Ill scoop them up. Otherwise, Ill put in an order for stock shock length Ohlins of the same model.
Click to expand...

I recommend you listen to an expert like Rich.........
 
mattfeet said:
just trying to figure out what the best setup for ME is, .
Click to expand...

Do you want comfort, a hard firm ride, high speed stability or quick and light handling in the corners? Really you should do some reading before you decide anything. Since you are starting with a very long and heavy motorcycle I would assume you want comfort and high speed stability, but I might be way off here.
 
In order of desirability:
1. Great handling <85mph
2. Comfort
3. Light handling in corners

The bike will NOT be tracked frequently but will be pushed hard through windy roads.
 
I'd go with the longer Ohlins, springs from Rich and the emulators. It should ride and handle great compared to the stock stuff.

The Roadriders are great tires. Unlike car tires, I have not seen any advantage to radial tires unless you are talking about the very wide ones on modern sport bikes. The old bikes on skinnier wheels don't get any better traction, radial tires don't last any longer, and when a radial motorcycle tire gets to the wear bars the carcass is paper thin, which to me is very scary. The radial tires are a little bit lighter, on a sport bike with huge tires and modern suspensions it matters a little, but on these big old klunkers with their heavy wheels and brakes there just isn't any advantage. Unless you just want to spend money.
 
tkent02 said:
I'd go with the longer Ohlins, springs from Rich and the emulators. It should ride and handle great compared to the stock stuff.

The Roadriders are great tires. Unlike car tires, I have not seen any advantage to radial tires unless you are talking about the very wide ones on modern sport bikes. The old bikes on skinnier wheels don't get any better traction, radial tires don't last any longer, and when a radial motorcycle tire gets to the wear bars the carcass is paper thin, which to me is very scary. The radial tires are a little bit lighter, on a sport bike with huge tires and modern suspensions it matters a little, but on these big old klunkers with their heavy wheels and brakes there just isn't any advantage. Unless you just want to spend money.
Click to expand...

Just as a benchmark. Initially I had done everything to get the most out of a stock platform for my GS1100ED(it was a specific objective). That includes everything mentioned fresh bearings all around, SU-143s, emulators, progressive springs, fork brace, 15W oil, Sport Demons. The bike rode great in fact Chef1366 (at the time) said it was the best riding GS he had ever been on.

And as I mentioned I felt very comfortable pushing it at most any speed up to about 60 mph, at 70-80mph plus it started to feel a little wishy in for example down hill sweepers.

I did a 1166 and it did not like the extra power even on the straights.

Went to 18" GSXR wheels with radials (also bandit swinger and GSXR forks, emulators) but now SU-145 and the bike was transformed. Probably not like 17" gear, but now you could push/power the bike comfortably another 30-40 mph above where you were before.

That 1000 doesn't have the grunt of the 1166 so might not matter as much, but to me after all the mods I did first all stock then 1st Gen GSXR it was the radial and wider tries that seemed to make the difference.
 
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Toss me in the longer shock camp too. I had 14.25" Ikon's on my 850G and they were a vast improvement over the stock setup. Handling was sped up, the bike being much easier to transition from side to side, and still very stable. It also had the affect of giving me some more ground clearance, meaning I wasn't gonna drag my pegs or hard parts any time soon, even when leaned over with a mid-corned bump. The wheelbase is long enough on a GS that you can add quite a bit to the rear ride height and not affect stability in a negative way. On that bike I had a set of Sonic springs, 15 wt fork oil, and the Ikon shocks. I liked the way it handled quite a bit. I never tracked it, but it was great for carving up backroads while still being all day comfortable. I had the stock wheels and I found Sport Demon's to be very good choice of tires.
 
My Ohlins are the 13.3", the Progressives on the 750 are the longer ones.

One thing to think about, if you care, is that the longer shocks make it super easy to put the bike on the center stand, and also to take it off the center stand. That may sound like a good thing, but it's so easy that you can't use it to park pointed down a slope, the bike will simply roll forward and fall over. You can't use it to do something like lube the chain, or run the engine in gear for some reason, as the tire touches the ground and you can't spin the wheel. You can if you put the center stand feet up on boards, it takes thicker boards (2x4) to remove the rear wheel.

Not sure this would be a factor on all GSes, but it is on my '77 750.
 
My bike doesnt have the center stand anyways so that's a non issue. Exhaust clearance issues.
 
mattfeet said:
Thanks for chiming in, Rich. I will likely place an order with you for springs. I may go with some racetech emulators as well, to maximize performance. Do you feel the 14.25" Ohlins I listed are too long? I can likely get stock length Ohlins for the same price but if I will see a benefit (eg. sharper steering) by going with the longer units, then I am all ears. My bike will rarely, if ever, see speeds in triple digits aside from idiotic on-ramp shenanigans.
Click to expand...

The 14.25" Ohlins should be fine. Just pay attention to how the bike feels at higher speeds.
The fact that they are good shocks will help. Most people don't realize is that higher speed stability issues are highly dependent on the rear of bike, more so than the front. They'll get some weave or wobble and start with fork oil or springs or steering head bearings, when the problem is more likely to be worn out shocks or sloppy swingarm bearings.
It sounds like you're going through the bike completely and doing things right, so I highly doubt that you'll have a problem with the longer shocks.

On the handling impact: Shock length is arguably the single most important parameter in setting up chassis geometry. It affects wheelbase, CoG, swingarm angle and trail. On the GS, the longer shock improves everything, as long as you don't go too far. It's a shame that there aren't length adjustable shocks available for the older bikes like the modern single shock bikes have. On my race bike (SV650), even a couple of mm is noticeable. Granted, that's working though the linkage leverage ratio, but would be roughly equivalent to 4mm on a dual shock bike.
 
RichDesmond said:
The 14.25" Ohlins should be fine. Just pay attention to how the bike feels at higher speeds.
The fact that they are good shocks will help. Most people don't realize is that higher speed stability issues are highly dependent on the rear of bike, more so than the front. They'll get some weave or wobble and start with fork oil or springs or steering head bearings, when the problem is more likely to be worn out shocks or sloppy swingarm bearings.
It sounds like you're going through the bike completely and doing things right, so I highly doubt that you'll have a problem with the longer shocks.

On the handling impact: Shock length is arguably the single most important parameter in setting up chassis geometry. It affects wheelbase, CoG, swingarm angle and trail. On the GS, the longer shock improves everything, as long as you don't go too far. It's a shame that there aren't length adjustable shocks available for the older bikes like the modern single shock bikes have. On my race bike (SV650), even a couple of mm is noticeable. Granted, that's working though the linkage leverage ratio, but would be roughly equivalent to 4mm on a dual shock bike.
Click to expand...

Even with my first set of SU-143's which had too soft of springs (200 lbs rider) the bike was great until I was doing sweeper turns with an undulating road surface. The bike would not just weave but it would want to lay down and come back up as the rear shock compressed due to the undulations (60-75 mph). I have probably 70 lbs of rear in saddle bag perched right on the rear that was not helping any of this.

The SU-145 are fully adjustable but are close to "unobtainium"
 
Yea, I am getting the HD springs with my Ohlins. That, alongside the Sonic Springs and cartridge emulators, should get me in pretty nice shape. I cannot wait.
 
Just to add another direction to the generally good advice above, I'll mention training.

Learning to be a better, smoother rider is a little harder than bolting on bits, but time and money spent improving your skills pays off handsomely in terms of speed and safety no matter what you're riding.

http://totalcontroltraining.net/ is probably the most widespread and offers excellent results for street riders.

If you can find one nearby, a good track class focused on street riders is also incredibly valuable. It can take a little digging -- you'll want to avoid the ones focused on sportbikes and racing (unless that's what you're into, of course...).
 
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