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Blue smoke after rebuild

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Hey all. I've rebuilt the top end of my 1000G...again. Some of you might know my rebuild thread http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=186905 It was using a lot of oil so I tore it apart after the initial top end rebuild to find I mad a mistake measuring and two of the cylinders were out of spec. So.. I had a good spare engine that had all cylinders well within spec, including the piston rings. I cleaned it all up, lapped the valves and put it all back together with a Z1 Vesrah gasket kit. Started it up and it ran well but pushed a lot of blue smoke on start up after sitting for a period of time. I figured it was poor valve seals. I pulled it apart again and put it all back together with OEM gaskets and valve seals, I finished it today. I started it up and it pushed a bit of blue but quickly cleared up. I let it sit for a couple of hours and just went out to start it and it's the same thing again, tons of blue smoke. I haven't taken it for a ride yet and it's a bit difficult to start (I think I have the valve timing off by a bit, I'll fix that easily) but it's pushing the same blue smoke all over again. I measured the pistons, cams, valve stems and everything was like new. I'm at a bit of a loss now. Appreciate any help.
 
Do you mean the valve guide seals or just the valve guide itself it worn? I never measured the valve guide as I don't have the proper too for it and thru reading it seems they rarely ever wear out. The valve guide seals are new OEM.
 
Did you use the old rings? Did you do at least a light hone on the cylinders? Usually rings smoke on acceleration, valve seals on decel. Maybe it just needs to run a bit more to seat things in.
 
Maddevill said:
Did you use the old rings? Did you do at least a light hone on the cylinders? Usually rings smoke on acceleration, valve seals on decel. Maybe it just needs to run a bit more to seat things in.
Click to expand...

This, ride it hard, on and off the throttle to seat the rings.
 
I reused the rings as they measured virtually new as did the cylinders. I did hone the cylinders though and lap the valves. I took the bike out for a short, 20km, hard ride to seat the rings and see if it would resolve the issue. There's no smoke on throttle or decel, not that I can see anyways but there is tons of blue smoke when it's started after sitting, which to me indicates valves seals. I had put in seals from a Z1 kit, Vesrah seals, to start with. I figured they must have been crap so I pulled the head and replaced them with OEM seals but when I started the bike up after doing that it again pushed tons of blue smoke, I ran it for a minute or two until it cleared up, let it sit for 2 hrs and started it, tons of blue smoke again. I think I've got the cam timing off a bit as it's hard to start and won't idle well (was running perfect the first time I put things together) so I'll pull valve cover and check the cams and get all that correct and see what happens. If I've still got blue smoke I can ride it hard for a bit and see what happens but if the smoking issue continues I'm at a lose as to what the problem could be.
 
Do you have a way looking into the cylinders after it has sat for a while, to see if there is oil leaking into one of the cylinders? Or remove the exhaust to see if you can see any oil coming down from one of the exhaust valves?
 
If the bike was using alot of oil before the tear down you could have oil build up in the pipe and it will smoke until that all burns off. Take it out for a good 40-50 mile ride . Then report back. It wouldn't be the first one I seen that , that was the case.
 
azr said:
If I've still got blue smoke I can ride it hard for a bit and see what happens but if the smoking issue continues I'm at a lose as to what the problem could be.
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Rob, those seals are very easy to damage. If you tap them on a little to hard you'll tear them.
 
Well, go give it a good run and report back

If it's the valve seals, do the in the bike replacement
 
So I did have the cam timing off by a tooth. Cam timing and vacuum synching are a couple of the things I don't like doing all that much, they just always seem to take me a long time and I usually mess up the cam timing the first time round. Anyways....started her up, HUGE cloud of blue of course but took her out for only 30km's or so, 6-7000, down to 3000 back up again, etc, etc..never once saw smoke from the pipe, on WOT or on decel. The real test will be starting it back up in a couple of hours or tomorrow. ****ty thing, I came home, shut the bike off, went to start it again to move it and the starter just spun and spun.....arrrrrr. This is one thing I've never had an issue with on any of my bikes. At least I have a dozen or so spares. Always something.
 
Still sounds like seals after sitting. But, are sure that no rings are in upside down? And, check the plugs to see if all cylinders are doing it or just one or two. I don't know about the quality of Vesrah seals, but maybe look into stockers as well?
Laters
G:cool:
 
azr said:
So I did have the cam timing off by a tooth. Cam timing and vacuum synching are a couple of the things I don't like doing all that much, they just always seem to take me a long time and I usually mess up the cam timing the first time round. Anyways....started her up, HUGE cloud of blue of course but took her out for only 30km's or so, 6-7000, down to 3000 back up again, etc, etc..never once saw smoke from the pipe, on WOT or on decel. The real test will be starting it back up in a couple of hours or tomorrow. ****ty thing, I came home, shut the bike off, went to start it again to move it and the starter just spun and spun.....arrrrrr. This is one thing I've never had an issue with on any of my bikes. At least I have a dozen or so spares. Always something.
Click to expand...



The lack of smoke issue sounds promising Rob

Did you take the rotor off at all? Spinning starter sounds like the rotor came off
 
How did you install the valve stem seals? Did you use a small socket or similar and tap them into place? When compressing the valve spring to install the locks, did you maybe compress the valve too much and smash the seal? One way or another, it seems likely the problem is a valve stem seal...which should tell us the problem is an oil ring. Last thing you think about is often the problem.:o
 
I'm positive no rings are upside down. The first time I put the engine together I did put the rings on #4 upside down, and also did not have the oil ring placed properly so I checked them all and have all rings and oil rings situated properly on the pistons. I replaced the Vesrah valve seals with OEM Suzuki seals. I pulled the plugs after the ride today and none of them have any signs of oil on them, before 2,3 & 4 had varying sings of oil on them. As for the rotor Todd, I didn't take it off but I did have to put a new bolt in there. I'll be pulling the starter cover and the stator cover I guess and having a look. For the valve seals being installed, yes I did use a socket to tap them into place. I'm not sure I follow you though Ed, what do you mean by "seems likely the problem is a valve stem seal...which should tell us the problem is an oil ring" Thanks for the ongoing help guys. I'm back to work for a couple of days but I might be able to have a look at things tomorrow night, if not it won't be till Tuesdays or so. It'll be good to get to the bottom of this.
 
Rob..if the starter spins the starter is OK. If its not cranking the engine, look at the starter clutch comming unbolted from the back of the rotor. Grab it and see if it rattles from side to side when you have the cover off. Rotate it too so you can see if its "trying" to grab the crank any. Remember it will only engage going the one way.
 
It sounds like you may have solved it.
But if it still smokes after sitting, you need to start checking for cracks. Or other leaks.
 
Success!! pulled of the stator cover and sure enough the crank bolt had loosened. Put it back in to torque with some lock tite, started her up and not a single puff of blue smoke :D Thank you baby Jesus. So the Z1 Vesrah valve seals were not good, big shock. First time I've had the issue of the crank bolt coming loose, thanks for the helping hands guys.
 
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