Building a vintage track bike

[gs45082]

Sub'd

Subscribed.......... If you need a regular length 1100 swingarm I'm got a few of them, including one that has all the tabs taken off in prep for the track.

@azr: PM me if you'd like to part with one of those swingers. I've been mulling that upgrade a while.

 

[one_civic]

So I'm in Toronto to marshal for csbk this weekend and I would like to know which rear hubs are interchangeable with the older GSXR 3.5' wide 18' rim? Will the bandit 600 or 1200 rear hubs fit? I need a little more clearance if I remember correctly to centre the rim to the left. I have a friend who can machine the rear hub to help align the sprocket, so not too worried about that part

 

[jeffgs]

Brought rear tire forward several times on a motocross bike and turn in was way more immediate, you can set up for a corner with full brake lock, but I would get head shake and braking chop and acceleration chop caused the swing arm to kick. You can manage the head shake by increasing slack angle by dropping the fork tubes if you can. I personally hated it, it was just to try and help with some mid corner drifting. So right back to my normal settings.

If you have the room to raise the triple tree on the fork leg you may want to try it and if not then go to the longer swing arm and then drop the triple tree back to stock and go in increments of 2mm until you find what you are looking for. Also slowing the compression and raising rebound slightly will help with initial turn in but won't necessarily help with a mid corner push. I am not sure if there are forks that will let you do that. On my motocross bikes they have the SSS forks and I actually do not play with the clickers, I use fork oil height adjustments and adjust the fork tubes in the trees.

On my GS450 I can adjust the rears with a collar for preload but after servicing the front fork I am still raising the fork oil height to keep the fork higher in the stroke. If I keep the bike I might have to just switch them out as they still pogo on expansion joints and hinge mid corner.

 

[one_civic]

Thanks jeffgs, the front forks have already been shortened, I just need to get the rear wheel centred and take her for a track day shakedown.

So has anyone used the older 3.5" wide, 18" GSXR rims and which rear hub have you used? I understand 17"s will give me more tire choices but I would like to use the 18"s for now

 

[one_civic]

 

[one_civic]

 

[Guest]

Thanks jeffgs, the front forks have already been shortened, I just need to get the rear wheel centred and take her for a track day shakedown.

So has anyone used the older 3.5" wide, 18" GSXR rims and which rear hub have you used? I understand 17"s will give me more tire choices but I would like to use the 18"s for now

I'm not understanding what you are referring to by the "rear hub" on a cast wheel? If you mean the cush drive then the OEM one should be fine. You should be able to center the wheel by machining new spacers as required.

Your pics are linking back to this thread, not wherever it is the pics are hosted.


Mark

 

[one_civic]

I'm on my I phone ne in Toronto and guess I'm having problems uploading pics from photobucket, the rear sprocket carrier and inner spacer are right up against the left side of the 1100 swing arm, I need a narrower rear sprocket carrier that will fit inside the 18" rear rim and give me more clearance to move the rim to the left, their are no spacers on the left side of the rim, I guess I'll have to wait to get home to take some pics so you can see what I'm talking about

 

[Guest]

I'm on my I phone ne in Toronto and guess I'm having problems uploading pics from photobucket, the rear sprocket carrier and inner spacer are right up against the left side of the 1100 swing arm, I need a narrower rear sprocket carrier that will fit inside the 18" rear rim and give me more clearance to move the rim to the left, their are no spacers on the left side of the rim, I guess I'll have to wait to get home to take some pics so you can see what I'm talking about

I understand what you are talking about now. Is this with the wheel centered on the front wheel? Not all swing arms are symmetrical so be sure you have it right. How does the rear sprocket line up with the front?


Mark

 

[GregT]

I'm on my I phone ne in Toronto and guess I'm having problems uploading pics from photobucket, the rear sprocket carrier and inner spacer are right up against the left side of the 1100 swing arm, I need a narrower rear sprocket carrier that will fit inside the 18" rear rim and give me more clearance to move the rim to the left, their are no spacers on the left side of the rim, I guess I'll have to wait to get home to take some pics so you can see what I'm talking about

On our 1000 with 17's I machined about 10mm off the sprocket face of the cush drive to get sprocket alignment. That was with a 5mm spacer behind the 520 front sprocket.
Lasted about 3 seasons till the power and rider enthusiasm got a bit much then it pulled the sprocket carrier apart, LOL...Sideways corner exits and long wheelies didn't help.
I then made up a center for the cush drive in, I think 6300 alloy. It carries the bearing and the outer piece with the cush paddles pilots onto the sprocket bolts which hold it all together. Sorry, bike's not here and i don't have a pic.
Suzuki 5 paddle cush drives come in various widths - don't know which is narrowest but the 550 triple 2 stroke is by far the widest in case anyone needs a wide one...

 

[Old Colt]

Just found this thread. Way back when these bikes were new I raced my '79 GS550. It was not stock.

These pics were taken a decade ago.
At the time I ran with both the stock swingarm and a short period with a GS750 swinger. Had shocks on stock mounts as well as lay down shocks. The longer swinger sucked, made the bike a slug. We tried a few different heights in the rear but the bike was far better on the original short swingarm which at that time I was welding braces onto.
Early on I ran the longer GS750 fork tubes to gain cornering clearance on the alternator case. Near the end it rode on GS 100 forks which it is on now. Later for sprint racing I removed the starter and stator. Interesting changes there was the bike became very lively with the reduced flywheel as well as the bike then weighed in at 380#.
During that period I rode my modified 550, stock 750 and later a stock 16V 750. My 550 was by far the fastest and most nimble of the three.

To me, I would not be afraid of the tiny bit shorter arm on your build.

 

[one_civic]

Thanks Mark, and nice Bike Colt. I'm not at home right now and can't remember how far off the sprocket alignment is, not too worried about that as my friend will just machine off whatever is needed to get the chain centred, I wonder if wider rear 4.5"-5"-5.5" 17" GSXR rims have a narrower rear sprocket carrier that would fit my 18" rim assuming they use the same Cush drive?

 

[Old Colt]

Keep in mind there are offset front sprockets should you want to move the chain outwards, they are 5 or 8mm or so.
I think you will run into width issues going much over 4.5" wide, I could be wrong but that is where I am looking at going with the refresh on my old 550. I have a set of 17s for my bike but do not recall what the sprocket carrier was from, quite a mix & match of parts off ebay to set it up and I have not put hands on the rims in years. My current intention is wire spoke rims, 18 front and 17 rear.

 

[Guest]

I wonder if wider rear 4.5"-5"-5.5" 17" GSXR rims have a narrower rear sprocket carrier that would fit my 18" rim assuming they use the same Cush drive?

I just did some digging on partzilla and it appears that Suzuki used the same cush drive sprocket carrier ('sprocket drum' in Suzuki speak) for a fair number of years from 1986 up into the 90's on a range of bikes. The part is #64611-17C01. In 1991 or so the big GSXR's switched to a new design, but the sprocket carrier is a different style. On the plus side, the cush rubbers have the same part number from 1986 through to some current models, so maybe you can tweak the newer style carrier to fit the older wheel?

The partzilla page on the older style carrier is: http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/suzuki/SP-64611-17C01.html


Mark

 

[one_civic]

Thanks Mark, I'll have to wait till I get home to do some digging around on partszilla from my laptop, and measure up and take pics of the rear wheel

 

[odl777]

Nice Bike Old Colt! On the rear shocks it looks like you are using eye to eye clevis on the stock swing arm....did you have to do anything special to do this or did you just bolt it up like normal.

Thank you!

 

[Old Colt]

Nice Bike Old Colt! On the rear shocks it looks like you are using eye to eye clevis on the stock swing arm....did you have to do anything special to do this or did you just bolt it up like normal.

Thank you!

Those are stock mounts.
When the bike was new I originally went with alloy body Koni, they were far from impressive. Sure looked pretty though. I soon had the red body Fox shocks W/ remote reservoirs and all my riding was on them. The Fox's on it now have not been ridden, yet.

 

[GregT]

I just did some digging on partzilla and it appears that Suzuki used the same cush drive sprocket carrier ('sprocket drum' in Suzuki speak) for a fair number of years from 1986 up into the 90's on a range of bikes. The part is #64611-17C01. In 1991 or so the big GSXR's switched to a new design, but the sprocket carrier is a different style. On the plus side, the cush rubbers have the same part number from 1986 through to some current models, so maybe you can tweak the newer style carrier to fit the older wheel?

The partzilla page on the older style carrier is: http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detail/suzuki/SP-64611-17C01.html


Mark

The major change AFAIK is they went to 6 bolt sprockets from 5 bolt. I've used a GS1000 cush in a late 4.5X17 GSXR wheel no probs.

 

[Guest]

The major change AFAIK is they went to 6 bolt sprockets from 5 bolt. I've used a GS1000 cush in a late 4.5X17 GSXR wheel no probs.

When did they change? All GS1000's, 1100E's and GSXR1100's use the same 6 bolt sprocket pattern according to JT Sprockets. Good news on the GS cush fitting into the 17" wheels.


Mark

 

[one_civic]

I know for sure the older Slabby and Slingshot GSXR 750-1100 rear sprockets are 5 bolt, at least that's what they are here in Canada,

So anyways I guess I was in such a rush to mount the rear wheel onto the bike before leaving for Toronto that I didn't space the rear wheel properly

After loosening the rear axle bolt I noticed that their was still a 10mm gap that I should have taken up with a spacer on the rotor side, I have now taken up the clearance and the rim is almost perfectly centred in the rear swing arm, all I need now is to get a rear caliper and bracket for the 240mm rear GSXR rotor and either a 530 or 520 chain.

Is there a big difference in un sprung weight and price between the two or should I just go with a 530?

thanks guys