Gear shift & clutch pushrod oil seals

[Kara25]

Hello everyone. Due to big delays on shipping from my OEM suzuki parts supplier from bad weather condtions i have every seal for the bottom end of my 550/673 swap at hand besides the clutch pushrod oil seal and the gearshift oil seal. I am starting to get pushed by time limitations and space at the garage and wanted to ask is it possible for me to mate the cases with the parts that i have at hand and then while the engine is at least buttoned up at the table install those 2 seals?? I figure i can do it i just need to not install the clutch pushrod wirhout putting the seal first on the other side and also do the same for the gearshift rod that also travels from one side of the engine to the other.. i know that the danger by mating the cases together beforehand is that maybe i will bugger up the seals during installation because i can tell those cases at some points ARE SHARP.

 

[Kara25]

Any input????????

 

[Cipher]

Yes you can..........

 

[Kara25]

Cipher Thanks a lot! Any idea about the little crank dowel pins that are sitting on the bottom case?? All of them are snug in their holes but i have one thats spinning a little bit. Is any movement acceptable or is the cranks weight keeping them in place?

 

[Suzukian]

You could Red Loctite the pin in, but it's for location. Another method to tight the hole is to use a bigger Ball Bearing than the hole, not way bigger, and place it over the hole, then whack it, that will peen the edge in and make it tighter just at the edge. You should be able to install the clutch pushrod seal after the bike cases are together. I've never seen a big that doesn't allow for that, as that is a seal that lasts only so long. I've never split cases to take one out of put one it, on many different brands of motorcycles.

 

[Kara25]

Thanks Suzukian! I have seen some threads here of people succesfully replacing those 2 seals the tip being using the old seals to tap the new ones in to avoid uneven smashing of the new seals so i think i will manage. As for the pin today i will check if there is still any movement on this dowel if there is i will put red loctite in the hole that sits in thankfully its not big enough of a play to need drastic measures. Splittimg cases in my opinion if you dont have any internal damage should only be done if 1. You really like the bike and already have spent tons of money on it so you want a brand new engine beetwen your legs and 2. You get tons of swarf like i did and you need to clean everything otherwise you are just opening a can of worms one thing leads to another this project started with a bugdet of 600€ and now with everything finally at hand tools,parts,degreasers etc i am at 1600€!

 

[Suzukian]

I only split cases on an engine that I have resolved is a pile of parts.
Only once I did it on purpose, and that was when Kazio Yoshima helped me turn my CB400F into a CB458 cc Stage III 1000 cc motorcycle eater.
That was my first bike, 1975, and I still have it.
It only has 8000 miles one the engine. It red lines at 14,500 rpm's and is extremely fast.

 

[Kara25]

Suzukian excuse my lack of knowledge but who was kazio yoshima?? Was he a hotshot mechanic of back in the day like pop yoshimura?

 

[Suzukian]

Yes, he was the guy who helped design the Honda in line fours. He left Honda and started Ontario Motor Works, turning CB400F's into CB458cc to 4999cc bikes the regularly ate 1000 cc bikes of that period for lunch. My bike red lines at 14500 rpm's. He turned my stock carbs into smooth bores and flow benched the carbs into the heads into the hand bent exhaust he made for me. I also did many other things, like a much more powerful oil pump, forged pistons, shot peened the rods. Gold Anodized aluminum D.I.D. rims with stainless steel spokes. It is truly a great bike of it's era.

This link speaks of him a bit. Some research will yield more.

https://www.bikeexif.com/honda-cb400f

 

[Kara25]

A product of its era! Awesome! You must had some deep pockets even back then to fund something like that :glee: Suzukian

 

[Suzukian]

In all honest, I went down the Rabbit whole, but flew out of it. I had so many people stopping me to look at that bike. I had an apartment, and caught a guy trying to steal it. He got away before I could take a bat to him, so I rolled it into my apartment every night. With the Gold Anodized aluminum rims, Stainless Steel forks, the wheels really stuck out. I had Koni aluminum body shocks on it, with new springs. I rode with clip ons for a long time, but to be honest, I found a straight bar to be far more functional.

The Overhead cam chain was guaranteed to take 25K rpms. The bike, Kaz said, could sustain 14,500 rpm's. That cam chain cost me in 1977 dollars $275 bucks! It was a blast hanging with the big boys well over 110 mph, and quite effortlessly, and when turns came up, they slowed down, I just whizzed past them. It was worth every penny, which is why I still have it. It's in my Barn, well covered up, I don't even like people to see it. I am hoping to get it roadworthy again.

I had Kal Guarded the cases, which was the thing to do back then, that's a bluing process. It allows aluminum to release heat up to 15% quicker. That has to bee redone, but I don't know if the new stuff is compatible with the old, so that means glass bead blasting the engine, and will be a real PIA process. I have a small machine shop in my Barn so I can make covers, the motor doesn't have to come apart. I would like to leave it for my son, ready to go. He'll have that, my '83 GS750ES, which I also purchased new, and my ZZR1200, which right now has only 3485 miles on it. That has Genmar Risers, NISSIN Brake calipers, a "Soupy's" lowering kit (I lowered it 1" inch), and Galfer Stainless Steel Braided brake lines. Modifying the ZZR1200 exhaust took 42 lbs. off of the bike. Those are "Radiant" tips on the exhaust tubes.

The Tokico calipers are coming on with the brake lines within a couple of weeks to put on the NIISSIN calipers and new brake lines. I'm probably going to replace the rotors too, but they have virtually no miles on them, just some very light surface rust, which would clean up with a couple of handfuls of brake. Suzuki uses a much higher quality steel on their rotors, my GS750 never got any surface rust of them. I built a new shed for the bikes and my '73 M.G. Midget. I am almost finished. Just starting to get warm in Connecticut.

 

[Kara25]

<<I had an apartment, and caught a guy trying to steal it. He got away before I could take a bat to him, so I rolled it into my apartment every night>> AND << It's in my Barn, well covered up, I don't even like people to see it>> :highly_amused::highly_amused::highly_amused::highly_amused::highly_amused: You made my day
epic quotes! Suzukian

 

[Kara25]

Progress today sealed the cases after replacing all the seals on crankshaft and on the gearshaft and a new o-ring for the oil gallery plus all new ones on the pump. Small misshap was that i knew beforehand that as a first timer to sealing cases i will not find a perfect ratio as to how much sealant to use and have lots of excess so i went ahead and got Loctite 574 anaerobic case sealant which if what it says is true never hardens in open air and all the non cured product dissolves in oil inside the engine and doesnt clog anything. Still managed to get lots of oozing but i hope this thing wont create globs like RTV does. Also put a NOS rear chain guide and a NOS camchain.! Also made sure that both transmission shafts were spinning freely individualy before buttoning everything up the same on the crankshaft after properly orientating the bearings on their dowels all tiny marks lined up. So fingers crossed!

 

[Kara25]

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[Kara25]

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[Kara25]

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[Suzukian]

I use Yamabond # 4 to seal cases, you need just a wiping of the stuff. Hopefully it didn't squeeze as much inside, on the other hand, being that thick, I don't think anything but the oil strainer will catch it. It's a learning process. The feeling when you riding the bike you rebuilt down the road cannot be purchased, simulated, or experienced, except by having done it. Justified pride!

 

[Kara25]

Everything in this project is moving slow as hell on purpose to avoid any mistakes and never have to touch the engine for the next 40 years as it was before me going in. Unfortunatelly threebond 1194 was not available to me only threebond 1207B which is an RTV type sealant and was avoided just for the reason of limited assembly time for a first timer and potential dangers of overuse of product. Still managed to get lots of oozing even with the anaerobic think i will use a long acid brush and carefully pick up excess product from the insides. I can see it from the cam chain tunnel in the upper crankcase. That was my worst expectation the stress of serious mess up during each stage of assembly the time and money invested kick stress up the roof :beguiled:

 

[Suzukian]

We do the best we can do. When you ride the bike you put back together, that feeling will be magical.