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GSX1100G making squealing noise after clutch repair

  • Thread starter Thread starter GS1000G Shopper
  • Start date Start date
G

GS1000G Shopper

Guest
My problem child had a clutch problem, long story short the slave cylinder was hanging up causing the clutch to slip. I replaced the bearing on the push rod end and it has a new Barnett Kevlar clutch and new steel plates. It engages just fine, but I noticed when it started to slip the last time the bike was making this chirping/squealing noise, and then shut off. I trailered it home, and replaced the slave cylinder with a new $90 OEM one.

When I restarted it today, the chirping/squealing is back, but seems to go away at higher RPM. It's full of oil, and the gauge reads over 70 PSI at idle. It's hard to pinpoint where the noise is coming from.

I shot a 30 second video so the problem could be heard. Any thoughts are welcome.

http://youtu.be/PsoWJs1EbXA
 
Wow that sounds horrible. Something sounds like it is rubbing in your top end.

Is your cam chain tensioner working? Doesn't sound like its running on all cylinders either.

Why does the idle sound so lumpy? Idle should be nice and smooth. I would not ride it until you figure out what is making that noise.
 
On January 20, you posted a video on youtube of your bikes first start. It did not sound like it sounds now. What have you done do the engine or driveline in the last 2 months? I know you have done work on the clutch and final drive. The idle characteristics of the bike have changed. What did you use to tighten your inner and outer clutch hubs? It sounds like a rotating scraping sound. Did you verify you have spark on all cylinders?
 
I've done nothing to the engine since the prior video other than to R&R the clutch a few times. I didn't have to mess with the inner hub to do the clutch job, and used an impact gun for the outer one (50mm nut for the diaphragm spring).

I'll have to check the spark. I knew it all went together too smoothly. :(

This bike sat from at least 1998 to 2012 when I got it. I had lubed the cylinders with Marvel oil and let them sit a few days. Valves were adjusted to spec (it's very clean inside the valve cover) and new plugs installed. I cleaned the carbs and used new seals on them as well as the intakes. Oil & filter were changed after about one hour of use.

The last time I rode it I did 20 miles just fine. Apparently the clutch safety switch connector came loose and it wouldn't start after parking it. I jumped (wire from battery to starter) it to get it going and after about 3 miles or so the clutch started slipping again. I pulled off on a side road (my wife had the trailer and my truck in case the jump start plan did not go). While it was sitting there idling I first noticed this sound, and then it stopped running, so we pushed it onto the trailer. The cause of the clutch problem was the slave cylinder binding after actuation- the piston would not return.

The clutch works perfectly now- I did a lap on my driveway before I shot the video today. I'm beginning to think this bike is cursed.
 
I pulled the tank & the plug wires one at a time. I have spark at all 4, so the next step will be to pull the valve cover and look around at the top end.
 
GS1000G Shopper said:
I've done nothing to the engine since the prior video other than to R&R the clutch a few times. I didn't have to mess with the inner hub to do the clutch job, and used an impact gun for the outer one (50mm nut for the diaphragm spring).

I'll have to check the spark. I knew it all went together too smoothly. :(

This bike sat from at least 1998 to 2012 when I got it. I had lubed the cylinders with Marvel oil and let them sit a few days. Valves were adjusted to spec (it's very clean inside the valve cover) and new plugs installed. I cleaned the carbs and used new seals on them as well as the intakes. Oil & filter were changed after about one hour of use.

The last time I rode it I did 20 miles just fine. Apparently the clutch safety switch connector came loose and it wouldn't start after parking it. I jumped (wire from battery to starter) it to get it going and after about 3 miles or so the clutch started slipping again. I pulled off on a side road (my wife had the trailer and my truck in case the jump start plan did not go). While it was sitting there idling I first noticed this sound, and then it stopped running, so we pushed it onto the trailer. The cause of the clutch problem was the slave cylinder binding after actuation- the piston would not return.

The clutch works perfectly now- I did a lap on my driveway before I shot the video today. I'm beginning to think this bike is cursed.
Click to expand...
It's not cursed, it only a piece of machinery.

What area is the noise coming from?

If it appears to be the top end and you just had adjusted the valves, I'd pull the valve cover to see if the rocker shaft is galled and look for a loosened or damaged tappet adjuster.
 
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I didn't have to mess with the inner hub to do the clutch job, and used an impact gun for the outer one (50mm nut for the diaphragm spring).
Click to expand...

The outer hub nut has a torque spec so how did you hold the hub when you tightened it? Did you apply the rear brake or put it in gear and tighten the nut with an impact gun? Suzuki makes a tool to hold the outer hub. Something is rotating and scraping in the engine, you can hear it. Did you mess with the starter clutch? I wonder if that is not releasing. Since the noise was not apparent in the January video I would suspect there is something going on with the clutch assembly or possibly your cam chain tensioner has let go and what you are hearing is the chain slapping around. Did you verify that your timing is still correct. I hear top end noise as well as a scraping sound.
 
It's hard to tell exactly where it was coming from. The valves were adjusted when I first was working on it months ago.

It seems like there should be a correlation between the clutch slipping and the noise, but I don't know enough about these engines to know what it could be.
 
almarconi said:
The outer hub nut has a torque spec so how did you hold the hub when you tightened it? Did you apply the rear brake or put it in gear and tighten the nut with an impact gun? Suzuki makes a tool to hold the outer hub. Something is rotating and scraping in the engine, you can hear it. Did you mess with the starter clutch? I wonder if that is not releasing. Since the noise was not apparent in the January video I would suspect there is something going on with the clutch assembly or possibly your cam chain tensioner has let go and what you are hearing is the chain slapping around. Did you verify that your timing is still correct. I hear top end noise as well as a scraping sound.
Click to expand...

As I recall, the bike was in neutral when I removed/replaced the 50mm nut to change the plates.

I did not do anything with the starter clutch.

I'll have to read up on how to check the timing.

If the tensioner is shot, there should be noticeable slack in the chain, right?
 
As I recall, the bike was in neutral when I removed/replaced the 50mm nut to change the plates.
Click to expand...

Removing the nut with an impact gun is fine. That nut has to be tightened to somewhere around 70 + foot/lbs. No way you gonna get it that tight with the bike in neutral. There is a special tool that is used to hold the outer hub while you torque it down. If the outer hub was loose do you know what it would sound like? How do you know it is not loose and rubbing up against the cover? Would the clutch assembly slip if the outer hub was loose?

If your timing chain tensioner was loose the chain would have slack in it. Remove the cover on the lower right side of the engine and line up the timing marks. See if your cams are aligned properly. The service manual should have a diagram of the cams for the timing procedure.
 
Thanks for the timing info. Since it is less painful, I'll check the clutch assembly first.

As well as the bike runs, I don't think the timing is off. On the ST1100 I used to own, the service manual was unclear as to timing marks and I bent the valves on one head.

I saw a homemade "special tool" to hold the hub that was an old plate with a rod welded to it. I still have some of my old plates, so I can make one of these.

One thing that strikes me as odd is the clutch setup- the system is a combo of steel plates and fiber (Kevlar now) disks that alternate. The engine side is a steel flat surface, as is the pressure plate (#12 in the below diagram) side. It seems like there should be fiber plates against both of these, but the order shown places a steel plate on the engine side and a fiber plate on the pressure plate side, with a a total of 10 of each plate. This results in steel to steel (metal to metal) on the engine side, although there would not be any rotation there. See the diagram, #11 is a steel plate and #9 & 10 are fiber plates:
0020.png
 
I saw a homemade "special tool" to hold the hub that was an old plate with a rod welded to it. I still have some of my old plates, so I can make one of these.
Click to expand...

The tool you refer to is to hold the inner basket not the outer basket. The tool for the outer basket has little nubs that engage the slots on the hub. The tool looks like this:
501701.gif


There is no shame in admitting that you don't have the tools or the knowledge to perform a job. Just don't act surprised when the end result is not what you expected.
 
That was my error. The page I saw it on had two homemade tools and the other one was the outer basket holder:
UKLeeCoilSpringClutch7.jpg

How to make Tool #1 with US measurements added said:
Special tool one: You’ll need two pieces of steel bar that are 200mm (7.875") long, 25mm (1") wide and 5mm (.196", or 3/16~1/4") thick (ish …), drill two 6mm holes in each bar with the centres 165mm (6.5") apart then, at one end of each bar, fit a M6x30 bolt and secure it tightly with a nut on the underside. At the other end, open out the 6mm hole to 8mm and join the two bars together with a M8x70 bolt and loosely secure it with a nut on the underside. To use it, the M6 bolts will neatly fit into the slots on the diaphragm pressure disc and the M8 bolt will fit straight into the swingarm spindle - once the slack is taken up, you’ve got both hands free to undo/tighten the big 50mm holder nut!
Click to expand...

Looks like I can pick the needed parts up at the hardware store. I'll construct one of those and check the torque of the 50mm nut. EDIT- had to look up the spec, it is 65-79.5 foot-pounds.

If I had the knowledge to perform all jobs I wouldn't need to post questions like these here. I'm pleased members do have the knowledge, as it helps all of us, including those running into the same problem a month or 5 years down the road.
 
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I have heard that sound on an 1100G engine after working on the stator...it was the cable keeper clip located inside the stator cover. There is almost no clearance, so if the clip shifts for any reason ..or the bolt is loose or positioned too high, it allows the retainer clip or bolt to contact the flywheel, and that could cause the noise.

The noise changes frequency at higher RPMs and becomes less audible.


Another possible cause is the clutch basket rubbing due to incorrect tensioning during installation.

If the bolts are tightened fully into position at the outset, instead of being torqued in steps so that they all end up equal, that can cause a slight warp in the rear.
 
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It turns out I had a Chrysler fan clutch tool that properly held the pressure plate. The 50mm nut was properly torqued. The GSX-G does not use the same 6 bolt setup as the GS-G, it has two wave washers under the 50mm nut.

I have yet to delve under the valve cover since it is such a hassle to take apart.
 
Sounds like you got it sorted out. Sorry couldn't be more helpful.
 
I had a Toyota that did that and it was the PCV. I'm not aware that the GSX-G uses a vacuum hose system- I'm not sure where it could leak. As I recall there are caps on each carb, I'll have to look at them.

After pulling the cover and thinking about this (the noise came about after the clutch job and after it started slipping), I think I likely over-torqued the 50mm nut. I'm going to pull the inner & outer baskets, inspect them, and replace the washers/shaft bearing etc. as well as the small and large nuts.

If that does not fix the problem, I'll have to delve deeper.
 
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