Header Wraps

[drhach]

.... don't have any purpose apart from covering up old and rusty headers

And to that end they have worked fantastically for me. You can barely see the giant dent that the PO put in my headers.

 

[posplayr]

You forgot another biggie....pipes.

4. (Loud) 4X1 vs. p*ssy-quiet stock system.

Tony.

Wait a minute:

• Best Oil
• Best Tires
• NGK Platinum Plugs

The list goes on. Instead maybe we just need a posting ETIQUETTE class :-\\\

 

[mighty13d]

Wait a minute:

• Best Oil
• Best Tires
• NGK Platinum Plugs

The list goes on. Instead maybe we just need a posting ETIQUETTE class :-\\\

Awe you beat me to it with posting the best oils and best tires arguments. damn.



For anyone still on topic: It has been shown by several people on here that wraps DO increase performance. Now wraps are not used because they are using ceramic coatings instead that look and work great. Best of both worlds. It has also been shown that there is people who like and dislike the way wraps look.

Also, if someone tells you that they have personal experience of something working one way and they tested it several different times, don't try to refute that. You will be wrong. You CAN say that 'maybe it's not the norm' or something along those lines, but you can not refute what they said because you were not there. And if you have no experience with real results either way, then don't claim that you positively know that something sucks and then turn around and tell everyone that you really have no idea because you never tested them out!

My $.02 and not directed at anyone in general. Just saying.

 

[Hammered]

No offense from my side. I just think you are very naive. There are all kinds of snake oil salesman out there trying to find suckers to buy up their overprices wares. It's a simple fact that the GS engines flow pretty well with their stock intake and exhaust systems, enough to match their compression ratio at least. Slapping on a header and pods is proven to only lead to single digit power increases so some header wrap is not going to have a profound impact in of itself.

And I dont understand how any of my personal experiences make me naive. Ive use the products, I have friends who race who use the products and Ive seen the testing that have proved that those products worked as Ive stated they did. Your only real arguement with me is about something I never said. And Ill say again. If you dont believe these products will give you any or enough gains for the effort involved, then dont. My bank account wont waver in either direction.

 

[Nessism]

Ok, so lets keep the facts straight. We are talking about motorcycles here, not cars with a closed hood; the heat radiating off the pipes on a motorcycle will not have a significant contribution to heating the intake air, and the power loss associated with that such as on a big V8 engine american car.

Rapidray has already documented a realistic possible HP increase with a high power motorcycle - roughly 1.5%.

A google search on exhaust wrap shows a number of people complaining about burning/cracking of their header pipes after wrapping them - the heat that is held in overheats the metal. Rusting of the pipes is also mentioned quite often by people using the stuff. Some aftermarket exhaust system manufacturers won't warranty their product if the end user installs the wrap which should be a clue to the possible downsides.

Stock GS pipes are double wall so wrap on these pipes is not likely to have as much effect - both upside and downside.

It seems to me that exhaust wrap on a motorcycle is primarily cosmetics driven since the lions share of the bikes running the stuff are either bobbers or cafe projects. Use at your own risk.

 

[Agemax]

Agemax, nothing Id post could change your mind because it seems to me, you dont intend to have it changed. I mean this with no disrespect, but no I dont think you or anyone else on this board has the knowledge or experience that professional race team engineers do. If you did, you wouldnt be here, youd be testing your team's engine. Thermal barrier materials have been in use for decades. And used by near every race team today.Racing Headers come from the factory now, already coated with ceramic/metallic materials. Im sorry I didnt save images of past dealings or save a copy of Dyno printouts from days gone by. Believe what you will, I didnt ask you to buy it or into it. I simply offered my personal experience in the matter. Im sure youll be fine without any such voodoo on your bike.

fair enough mate. you have your unproved theories but at the end of the day my personal opinion is that they look terrible and i would never contemplate putting them on any motorcycle, i would rather do without the extra 1.5% power increase that your average street rider would not even notice.
lets agree to disagree lol

 

[hampshirehog]

But do you know the worst thing about wraps.......



They're a trendy pancake looking thing meant to replace a sandwich only you end up getting the filling all down the front of your shirt.

And Ed is bang on about hot air (no pun intended) offering less potential than cold air - under the bonnet ('hood' for you foreigners ) of a car.

As I said in an earlier post, in a proddy racer team I was involved in years ago we decided that the very small, but noticeable, gain in power wasn't worth the effort of keeping as mixture was disproportionately affected by ambients (by the way, Mikuni produced a nice document on ambient changes which I have seen on the interweb - sorry, can't remember the link but I bet someone here will know where it is). Don't forget this was on a bike fitted with bellmouthed carbs and no electronic wizardry which could be adjusted with a spreadsheet and self analysing at 1000 times a second - which is where we are now and probably why the technology in header coatings has moved on.

 

[mac1170]

gday guys,over the years lots of race teams have used heat wraps on the exhaust, the reason is due to boyle,s law of gas, go read your physics books, as for the comment from agemax, who worked for h.r.c. about not chasing 1% performance, then i guess thats why rossi, now races for yamaha.

 

[Agemax]

gday guys,over the years lots of race teams have used heat wraps on the exhaust, the reason is due to boyle,s law of gas, go read your physics books, as for the comment from agemax, who worked for h.r.c. about not chasing 1% performance, then i guess thats why rossi, now races for yamaha.

does Rossi's yamaha use header wraps????????? or the HRC honda's????????

 

[sparki]

the point was chasing the % gains as i read it

 

[Agemax]

the point was chasing the % gains as i read it

you would not notice a 1% gain in power on a street bike.especially as a regular gs1000 has less than 100 BHP, so a 1% gain would be less than 1 BHP. as mentioned before the ambient temperature will affect the bhp from one day to another. can you tell if your bike has 1% more or less power from day to day?

of course on a race bike you would strive to squeeze out any horse power you can, but also, as stated before header coatings are far more advanced now, and besides, just think of the extra weight and the drag factor of wraps

 

[Agemax]

But do you know the worst thing about wraps.......



They're a trendy pancake looking thing meant to replace a sandwich only you end up getting the filling all down the front of your shirt.

but at least you can heat them up on your headers :lol:

 

[tejasmud]

In opinion the ?header wraps performance increase or decrease? argument is a no win argument. While one specific header on multiple engines is too broad of a subject, let alone one size fits all in regards to just wrapping headers across the board on all engines. Most likely explains the lack of conclusive information on the subject while searching the net.

Engines perform best when they are running efficient. Engines can be modified to run more efficiently with head designs, valve sizes, valve angles, cam timing, ignition timing, aperture sizing, header design, ect. Good example would be an 8 valve engine v. a 16 valve engine, and why engine designers moved in this direction.

In my mind, any engine that is lacking in efficiency, if wrapping the header increases the efficiency one might observe a gain. The more efficient an engine runs, like today?s engine designs, less gain if any would be observed from wrapping or coating the headers.

I may be off, but just my thoughts from reading up on the subject.

Wrapping the header must have been someone?s ?band aid? in a past life. Sort of looks like one to me.

 

[hp1000s]

In opinion the ?header wraps performance increase or decrease? argument is a no win argument. While one specific header on multiple engines is too broad of a subject, let alone one size fits all in regards to just wrapping headers across the board on all engines. Most likely explains the lack of conclusive information on the subject while searching the net.

Engines perform best when they are running efficient. Engines can be modified to run more efficiently with head designs, valve sizes, valve angles, cam timing, ignition timing, aperture sizing, header design, ect. Good example would be an 8 valve engine v. a 16 valve engine, and why engine designers moved in this direction.

In my mind, any engine that is lacking in efficiency, if wrapping the header increases the efficiency one might observe a gain. The more efficient an engine runs, like today?s engine designs, less gain if any would be observed from wrapping or coating the headers.

I may be off, but just my thoughts from reading up on the subject.

Wrapping the header must have been someone?s ?band aid? in a past life. Sort of looks like one to me.

Quite possibly the most rational post in this thread, since the original question(no offense to your real-world observations, Ray!).
*My name is Hugh, and I wrapped my header* I did this because of the rusty, crusty appearance that no paint or coating would be able to diguise . I'm sure that this is gonna' start another round of raging, but here goes; if you ARE going to wrap it, PLEASE use narrower, rather than wider tape, do it wet, and over-lap it properly. It'll ultimately double-layer the pipe in wrapping, and look HUGELY smoother(I also seized it at the ends with SS safety wire, so no visually intrusive clamps). Very few bike guys that see my bike even notice it's presence...which would SUGGEST that I accomplished my objective. I also have an open megaphone, and open velocity-stacks, running dino-oil, and on a 600+ mile trip into upstate PA. this past week, including elevations up to almost 3000ft, my bike ran great and got between 40 & 45 mpg...so there!

 

[tejasmud]

Quite possibly the most rational post in this thread, since the original question(no offense to your real-world observations, Ray!).
*My name is Hugh, and I wrapped my header* I did this because of the rusty, crusty appearance that no paint or coating would be able to diguise . I'm sure that this is gonna' start another round of raging, but here goes; if you ARE going to wrap it, PLEASE use narrower, rather than wider tape, do it wet, and over-lap it properly. It'll ultimately double-layer the pipe in wrapping, and look HUGELY smoother(I also seized it at the ends with SS safety wire, so no visually intrusive clamps). Very few bike guys that see my bike even notice it's presence...which would SUGGEST that I accomplished my objective. I also have an open megaphone, and open velocity-stacks, running dino-oil, and on a 600+ mile trip into upstate PA. this past week, including elevations up to almost 3000ft, my bike ran great and got between 40 & 45 mpg...so there!

:-s

I think wrapping a header is fine, and looks okay if done correctly. If I were to build a Cafe bike, it would possibly have a wrapped header. Something about the looks on a Cafe can be desireable.

The band aid comment was in reference to where wrapping the exhaust originated. Not sure where.

Was it the need to increase the EGT on the fly before a race on a given engine in the moment?

Possibly an engineer who understands the scavenging and velocity principals of the exhaust on their engine used it to increase the EGT to shift the power to a desired RPM range.

Anyways,

It has been interesting reading up about the topic. I like to measure things, but really didn't see much out there on the net in regards to data which would point in the direction it be much a benifit.

A few claims here and there.