My rebuild thread

[Mr Rogers]

So the bike is running decently...

What i've done so far:

replaced:
boots (on both ends of the carb)
o rings
hardware
ring clamps
and fuel lines

resealed the air box with weather stripping
cleaned and re oiled the air filter



The problems that the bike still has that i would like to fix:

Tires front and back need to be replaced.

The throttle cable seems to be routed wrong since the bike revs when i turn to the left or right...

My brake fluid is dark and i would like to replace it and the brakes and lines through out the bike.

The bike idles at spastic levels. I think i need to re clean/ sync the carbs.

When i'm riding the bike it seems like there is rotational drag on the rear tire.
And when i put the bike on its center stand and rotate the back tire there is definitely a moment of more resistance when the bike chain gets to a specific position.

I think this is an engine issue... I haven't done any engine work on this bike (or any bike for that matter). I know i need to but i'm not sure where to start in the process. any help in this area would be greatly appreciated!

So... My question is: where do i start in this whole process? should i go to the engine first and move out from there? should i do more peripheral repairs and wait to do the engine?

And if anyone has some suggestions/links to Similar completed threads I would greatly appreciate it! ( for some reason I can never seem to find specific info on engine work for this bike...)

Thanks Ladies and Gents!
JR

 

[spyug]

Its all fixable but you want to deal with the safey issues first. You need to get the bike running and idling right (carb rebuild) and fix the throttle cable routing. A very close next or even more important is sorting out the brakes. The tires would also be an important issue to sort sooner than later.

As anyone of those issues can hurt, mame or kill you they should be attended to as soon as possible. You can't afford to fart with that stuff.

Good luck.
spyug

 

[Mr Rogers]

Its all fixable but you want to deal with the safey issues first. You need to get the bike running and idling right (carb rebuild) and fix the throttle cable routing. A very close next or even more important is sorting out the brakes. The tires would also be an important issue to sort sooner than later.

As anyone of those issues can hurt, mame or kill you they should be attended to as soon as possible. You can't afford to fart with that stuff.

Good luck.
spyug

I think i'll get my local bike shop to replace my tires and while i have them off the bike i'll replace the drum brakes and the bad brake fluid on the front.

Do you think that all of these are more important than engine components?

As a side question are all shims the same diameter? and does it sound like i'm correctly diagnosing the difficult rotation point with the chain? just wondering if i'm way off in my diagnoses...

Thanks!

 

[Guest]

I reckon you've got the order right and yep, shims are all the same

As for the tight spot on the chain, is it the same in neutral and free wheeling? If so, most likely someone has joined the chain too tight at the joining link or something.

 

[Mr Rogers]

I reckon you've got the order right and yep, shims are all the same

As for the tight spot on the chain, is it the same in neutral and free wheeling? If so, most likely someone has joined the chain too tight at the joining link or something.

When i was testing i had the bike in neutral. Do you think that a tight joining link would be enough to slow down the tire spinning?
The only reason i ask is that i can actually feel the bike hitting some sort of a slow pocket when i'm coming to a stop at a light. I kept checking to see if maybe the 120 wheel was rubbing on my swing arm or the chain guard and while it seems close i think there is enough clearance and it would probably be consistently dragging...

Well either way i want to make sure that that link isn't stiff. should i roll through the whole chain and spray it with pb blaster?

 

[Mr Rogers]

I just wanted to forward along this cool find!

So for all of you GSR's who have an early 450 you should check out ebay for the OEM rear brake shoes. I did it easily enough by typing this replacement model number 64400-11860
and while boulevard suzuki has the part, I got it for 25 dollars less at the base price!

 

[Guest]

I just wanted to forward along this cool find!

So for all of you GSR's who have an early 450 you should check out ebay for the OEM rear brake shoes. I did it easily enough by typing this replacement model number 64400-11860
and while boulevard suzuki has the part, I got it for 25 dollars less at the base price!

Excellent, that was definitely a score! I noticed they also fit the 550's and some other models as well...

As to the chain, stick her up on the centre stand and slowly rotate the rear wheel a few times and look closely at every link as it leaves the top of the rear sprocket.

Any links that tend to continue following the sprocket rather than straightening out towards the front sprocket will potentially be too tight.

Give it a good clean and lube concentrating on any links like that and that should eliminate the chain as the culprit if it's not.

Alternatively, if it's one tight spot that's not the chain, the same process should allow you to feel the tight spot as you're rotating the rear wheel on the centre stand.

I hope that makes sense...

 

[Steve]

As a side question are all shims the same diameter?

... and yep, shims are all the same ...

That might need to be clarified just a bit.

All GS shims are the same diameter, 29.5 mm.

Newer Suzukis have shims under the buckets, and are much smaller, so you can't say "all Suzuki shims are the same size".

Be careful if you go to a shop that also handles Yamaha or Kawasaki. Their shims are 29.0 mm in diameter, very hard to tell the difference.

.

 

[Mr Rogers]

As to the chain, stick her up on the centre stand and slowly rotate the rear wheel a few times and look closely at every link as it leaves the top of the rear sprocket.

Any links that tend to continue following the sprocket rather than straightening out towards the front sprocket will potentially be too tight.

Give it a good clean and lube concentrating on any links like that and that should eliminate the chain as the culprit if it's not.

Alternatively, if it's one tight spot that's not the chain, the same process should allow you to feel the tight spot as you're rotating the rear wheel on the centre stand.

I hope that makes sense...

The first time that i checked i had it on the center stand and rotated the wheel and the wheel seemed harder to rotate in some positions or if i free spun the wheel it would slow dramatically when it hit the same spot... does that make sense?

Any way i'm going to be pulling the wheels off the bike today since my local bike shop charges 30 dollars more per tire to take them off! And while they're off i'll pull the chain out and put it in a bucket of pb blaster. The grease that i've been using on o rings and stuff is a high heat (500F*) gear grease. would that be ok for the chain also?

Steve thank you for that! i found that they were supposed to be 29.5 but i wasn't sure if it was a universal thing or if there were proprietary companies who switch it up.

I think i'll probably make my contributions to the shim club instead of buy them new though!

 

[koolaid_kid]

NO NO NO NO
Do not soak an o-ring chain in PB Blaster. It will wash all the grease out from inside the o-rings and the chain will be doomed.
Use kerosene and a nice stiff brush to wash off all the crud. Then some good chain lube or chain wax, not a grease. Whilst it is off the bike, see if it feels kinked anywhere. If it is kinked it is time to be replaced. If it now feels relatively smooth, you are GTG.

 

[Guest]

How are your chain and sprockets?
Besides some frozen links, a loose chain or worn sproket(s) can cause tightness during the rotation. Worn sprockets can allow the chain to ride up higher on the sprocket causing tightness. Rotate the wheel and try to spin it and see if the chain tension is inconsistant, if it's not, could be a dragging brake drum. I wouldn't think it would be to hard to figure out, but frozen links, worn chain and sprockets and a dragging brake drum could all cause that, check for alignment also, a misaligned chain can cause binding. You could always disconnect the chain to eliminate whether it's something in the drive train or brake, wheel.

 

[Mr Rogers]

NO NO NO NO
Do not soak an o-ring chain in PB Blaster. It will wash all the grease out from inside the o-rings and the chain will be doomed.
Use kerosene and a nice stiff brush to wash off all the crud. Then some good chain lube or chain wax, not a grease. Whilst it is off the bike, see if it feels kinked anywhere. If it is kinked it is time to be replaced. If it now feels relatively smooth, you are GTG.

what do you mean by an "o-ring chain"? i'm talking about the main drive chain. are we talking about the same thing? I've read that i shouldn't use kerosene or gas for any cleaning as it is very dangerous... obviously flamible things are dangerous but you say it's the best for the chain?

 

[koolaid_kid]

All of sedelen's points are excellent, and keep in mind, it is almost always a combination of 2 or more of those items. If you don't know how to check chain alignment I am sure one of us can find a way to do it without purchasing an expensive alignment tool.
If you don't know how to read a sprocket for wear, we could probably find some information on that as well.

 

[Mr Rogers]

How are your chain and sprockets?
Besides some frozen links, a loose chain or worn sproket(s) can cause tightness during the rotation. Worn sprockets can allow the chain to ride up higher on the sprocket causing tightness. Rotate the wheel and try to spin it and see if the chain tension is inconsistant, if it's not, could be a dragging brake drum. I wouldn't think it would be to hard to figure out, but frozen links, worn chain and sprockets and a dragging brake drum could all cause that, check for alignment also, a misaligned chain can cause binding. You could always disconnect the chain to eliminate whether it's something in the drive train or brake, wheel.

I've been working on bikes for a long time and the sprockets seem fine on the rear plate. i'm going to check the brakes and the rear axle shaft to see if there is any issues when the chain is off.

 

[koolaid_kid]

what do you mean by an "o-ring chain"? i'm talking about the main drive chain. are we talking about the same thing? I've read that i shouldn't use kerosene or gas for any cleaning as it is very dangerous... obviously flamible things are dangerous but you say it's the best for the chain?

A decent explanation of an o-ring chain, and yes, we are speaking of the main drive chain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O-ring_chain
Kerosene is fine for cleaning. (Just wear gloves of some type, rubber, nitrile, etc.) It will clean the side plates and the rollers but not get down into the o-rings.
Do not use gasoline, its flash point is much lower and it IS dangerous to use as a cleaner.

 

[Mr Rogers]

A decent explanation of an o-ring chain, and yes, we are speaking of the main drive chain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O-ring_chain
Kerosene is fine for cleaning. (Just wear gloves of some type, rubber, nitrile, etc.) It will clean the side plates and the rollers but not get down into the o-rings.
Do not use gasoline, its flash point is much lower and it IS dangerous to use as a cleaner.

I learn something new every day while i'm on here! ok i'll be sure to pick up some chain lube and kerosene! Because it's probably a good idea regardless since it's probably never been re-lubed.

I'll be back to tell you what i find on the bike.

 

[Steve]

Kerosene is fine for cleaning. (Just wear gloves of some type, rubber, nitrile, etc.)

I have a parts washer that I got several years ago. Rather than use some sort of commercial "parts cleaner fluid", I put in three gallons of kerosene. Does a great job of cleaning parts, does not hurt the pump, is relatively odor-free while the lid is closed between cleaning sessions. A few months ago, I finally changed the kerosene for some fresh stuff. First fluid change in about 4 years, so it's relatively cheap to use, too, even at current prices of $4+ per gallon.

.

 

[cowboyup3371]

Something TheCafeKid taught me yesterday was to use WD40 to clean off my chain as it also contains kerosene in it.

 

[Mr Rogers]

I have a really quick and urgent question!

Does carb cleaner ruin carb gaskets or the carb diaphragm? if i sprayed them with carb cleaner what should i clean them with to eliminate any continuing damage?

I'll try the wd40 on the chain.

 

[Guest]

That might need to be clarified just a bit.

All GS shims are the same diameter, 29.5 mm.

Newer Suzukis have shims under the buckets, and are much smaller, so you can't say "all Suzuki shims are the same size".

Be careful if you go to a shop that also handles Yamaha or Kawasaki. Their shims are 29.0 mm in diameter, very hard to tell the difference.

.

Thanks Steve, yes I should've clarified that statement... I know better

NO NO NO NO
Do not soak an o-ring chain in PB Blaster. It will wash all the grease out from inside the o-rings and the chain will be doomed.
Use kerosene and a nice stiff brush to wash off all the crud. Then some good chain lube or chain wax, not a grease. Whilst it is off the bike, see if it feels kinked anywhere. If it is kinked it is time to be replaced. If it now feels relatively smooth, you are GTG.

Good call KK! Definitely kerosene for that.

I used kerosene to clean everything during my engine rebuild and it has never ever caused me any grief. I don't have a parts washer but I use an old paint brush and scrub it in the chunky bits and it always works.

I buy the 3 litre bottles from the supermarket, dirt cheap and last forever.

I have a really quick and urgent question!

Does carb cleaner ruin carb gaskets or the carb diaphragm? if i sprayed them with carb cleaner what should i clean them with to eliminate any continuing damage?

I'll try the wd40 on the chain.

Yes and yes! Anything rubber will be damaged by carb cleaner, although if you're using the spray carb cleaner you might be ok because it's too weak to be really effective.

If you dip the carbs in Berrymans or whatever, you can kiss all rubber bits good bye, so make sure you remove anything you need to save first.