New member with GS450E - No filter in the airbox?

[hardline_42]

Hi everyone, this is my first post (my apologies if I've posted in the wrong place). I recently picked up a 1981 GS450E in a trade. She's got just over 3k miles, looks and sounds great. Runs strong, too.

When I went to check it out, I noticed it had a pretty significant fuel leak from the carbs, so the PO had his mechanic rebuild them prior to delivering the bike. The fuel leak was gone and I didn't notice any issues with the way it idled, so I loaded it up and took it home. Once there, I rode it around the block a few times (first time on a bike in ten years!) and it felt good, pulled nice and hard, no dead spots etc.

Today I took off the seat and noticed that the airbox cover/snorkel was just sitting on there with nothing to hold it down. It looks like there are some clips missing. Further investigation into the airbox showed that someone had removed the airfilter and the holder(s). Instead, there was a square of window screen jammed in there in front of the carb inlets (and it had peeled off on one side, so basically, no filtering).

I don't want to ride it that way, obviously, and I don't want to spend too much money repairing it (part of the deal with the wife was that it be a 100% running bike). So, after all that, my questions are:

- How can I tell if the bike is running lean as a result of this redneck mod?

- If it's not, and someone actually bothered to rejet (doubtful) would it make more sense to add a higher flow air filtering system (K&N pods or K&N air filter in stock box) than replacing it with stock parts?

I'd really like to not fiddle with recently rebuilt carbs, but I will if I have to. I look forward to the forum's help. Thanks in advance.

 

[Bookmon]

A great looking 81 450. Parts n More (prices are great/ a tad difficult to navigate) on the web are a good place for carb parts. From what you describe, in my novice opinion, you don't need a full cleaning/rebuild- just maybe new floats and gaskets. fairly easy to do.
Can not remeember if they had the air filter screens or if it was GSSuzuki.com who's prices are reasonable (see worse for same items)
enjoy the ride

 

[tom203]

I'd really like to not fiddle with recently rebuilt carbs, .

Hmm.... remember this discovery?

" Further investigation into the airbox showed that someone had removed the airfilter and the holder(s). Instead, there was a square of window screen jammed in there in front of the carb inlets (and it had peeled off on one side, so basically, no filtering). "

Are you going to put much faith in this carb work? Did they leave a note regarding redneck filter setup?

 

[koolaid_kid]

The first thing you should do is purchase and install a filter. Where the cover used to be, use duct tape to seal it (I eventually went to ABS plastic with double-sided foam tape, but duct tape will do to start).
Only then should you start your testing. It is highly unlikely any changes were made - it costs money.

 

[Nessism]

The stock air filter is just a piece of flat filter foam. You can make/cut one for cheap out of generic air filter foam available at motorcycle shops. Get the fine mesh foam and oil it before you install. This of course assumes the filter support screen is still available. If not, you will have to scrounge around for one, and a top cap piece too to hold the filter in place. Maybe put an ad in the Parts Wanted forum?

Owning a 30 year old motorcycle is a lot more involved than just buying a running bike. You need to do maintenance. For example, you need to adjust the valves otherwise they will burn and damage the engine. You have a little time since the bike only has 3k miles, but you better condition your wife, and yourself too, since old bikes are like wooden boats, and always in need of some work (and money).

Good luck

 

[BassCliff]

Greetings and Salutations!!!

Greetings and Salutations!!!

Hi Mr. hardline_42,

With a 30 year old bike you will definitely need to learn how to do at least two things. The first would be how to properly maintain your 30 year old bike and the second would be how to use an online parts fiche. For example, here is your air filter assembly.

The "how to" guide linked just below will give you and idea how to navigate an online parts fiche. Most OEM vendors have them available on their websites.

CLICK HERE to download a PDF guide for the Alpha-Sports site cross-reference.
(Note: If the newer part numbers return no results, use the older, superseded numbers.)

To help you with the maintenance on your motorcycle, I have created and collected several resources on my little website. Read all the information in the links below and you will be well-armed for the task. It's your "mega-welcome". :dancing:


If you are here you probably have a 30 year old motorcycle that needs about 20 years worth of maintenance. In the links below you'll find maintenance lists, documentation, wiring diagrams, "how to" guides, vendor links, tips, tricks, and a whole lot of GS goodness. This is your "mega-welcome". Let's get started.

Let me dump a TON of information on you and share some GS lovin'.

I just stopped by to welcome you to the forum in my own, special way.

If there's anything you'd like to know about the Suzuki GS model bikes, and most others actually, you've come to the right place. There's a lot of knowledge and experience here in the community. Come on in and let me say "HOoooowwwDY!"....

Here is your very own magical, mystical, mythical, mind-expanding "mega-welcome". Please take notice of the "Top 10 Common Issues", "Top 15 Tips For GS Happiness", the Carb Cleanup Series, and the Stator Papers. All of these tasks must be addressed in order to have a safe, reliable machine. This is what NOT to do: Top 10 Newbie Mistakes. Now let me roll out the welcome mat for you...

Please Click Here For Your Mega-Welcome, chock full of tips, suggestions, links to vendors, and other information. Then feel free to visit my little BikeCliff website where I've been collecting the wisdom of this generous community. Don't forget, we like pictures! Not you, your bike!

More links to helpful threads in the forum:
Help! Your Bike Won't Start
DON'T DO THESE THINGS
Help! Your Bike Won't Run Well
Oh God! Pods!


Thanks for joining us. Keep us informed.

Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

 

[hardline_42]

Thanks for the welcome, everyone. I appreciate all the comments so far.

...GSSuzuki.com who's prices are reasonable...
enjoy the ride

Thanks for this tip. They seem to have the parts I need, I think.

Are you going to put much faith in this carb work? Did they leave a note regarding redneck filter setup?

A fair point, no doubt. I traded a few odds and ends for this bike from a guy who owns a used car dealer. The bike was given to him by a friend but he can't physically ride anymore. He asked his mechanic to change the fluids and rebuild the carb with a generic kit. I can verify the oil was changed but I don't know whether or not the airbox needed to be opened to get to the carbs, in which case he could not have known. In all likelihood, I'm going to have to tear into them just to be sure.

The stock air filter is just a piece of flat filter foam. You can make/cut one for cheap out of generic air filter foam available at motorcycle shops. Get the fine mesh foam and oil it before you install. This of course assumes the filter support screen is still available. If not, you will have to scrounge around for one, and a top cap piece too to hold the filter in place. Maybe put an ad in the Parts Wanted forum?

Owning a 30 year old motorcycle is a lot more involved than just buying a running bike. You need to do maintenance. For example, you need to adjust the valves otherwise they will burn and damage the engine. You have a little time since the bike only has 3k miles, but you better condition your wife, and yourself too, since old bikes are like wooden boats, and always in need of some work (and money).

Good luck

Thank you for the advice. GSSuzuki.com seems to have the filter support screen available (part no. 3 in the parts diagram) but I don't see any separate support screen underneath the filter. Is that built into the OEM filter? Also, thanks for the reminders on maintenance. Believe it or not, this is the sixth bike I've owned, but only the third in running condition :lol:. After my last three failed cafe racer projects, I've decided it's more fun to ride and maintain a running stock bike than to sit on a stripped down frame with clip-ons and rearsets and make "vroom" noises in the garage. I plan on going right down the maintenance list once I get a copy of the service manual.

Hi Mr. hardline_42,
...
Thanks for joining us. Keep us informed.

Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

Wow, thanks BassCliff! It looks like I've got a lot of reading to do!

 

[Guest]

Welcome! Nice bike... and I see you even scored the factory optional rear rack which is made of unobtanium!

The lower support for the filter should essentially be part of the airbox, I'm not sure how easily removed it is so hopefully it's still there.

I do have my stock complete airbox here you could have cheap, but given the size I'm not sure how well it would ship to the US...

For manuals, get the Clymer and Haynes from BassCliff's site for free, then get onto eBay and buy a factory reproduction from "eClassic Bike", well worth it.

 

[hardline_42]

Welcome! Nice bike... and I see you even scored the factory optional rear rack which is made of unobtanium!

The lower support for the filter should essentially be part of the airbox, I'm not sure how easily removed it is so hopefully it's still there.

I do have my stock complete airbox here you could have cheap, but given the size I'm not sure how well it would ship to the US...

For manuals, get the Clymer and Haynes from BassCliff's site for free, then get onto eBay and buy a factory reproduction from "eClassic Bike", well worth it.

Thanks for the tips and the generous offer. After some reading, it seems that the lower support is not something that's available separately. I might have to fabricate something out of expanded metal mesh to fit. Also, it seems that what I thought was a piece of window screen is actually a factory flame arrestor to prevent backfires from igniting the filter element. Sounds like pulling the box and doing some repair work is in my future. Yay.

 

[Guest]

Shouldn't be too hard to sort, but to be honest I'd be very surprised if the internal mesh isn't still in place...

 

[koolaid_kid]

It appears that part #11 is the clip that holds the snorkel on. You would need 2 of them, one for each side.

 

[hardline_42]

Shouldn't be too hard to sort, but to be honest I'd be very surprised if the internal mesh isn't still in place...

Pete, to which mesh are you referring? There is a fine metal mesh inside which I originally thought to be a poorly-executed mod, but reading has led me to believe it's actually a factory installed flame arrestor screen (visible on the left side of the eBay pic below). That's still in there but it's come undone from the top so I need to reattach that.
The plastic cage that goes below the filter element (black plastic grid in pic below) is definitely not there. Do I even need it? I wonder if I could just rest the foam along the lip where the lower support should go and maybe secure it to the top holder (part #3) with some needle and thread.

 

[Steve]

They seem to have the parts I need, I think.

Be careful with that thought. :-k

Virtually all of the online vendors will show that part in the fiche, but they all have to order it from the same supply chain.
That's right, NONE of them will carry parts for a 30-year-old bike in stock, they have to be ordered.

Plan on 10-14 days for a box to show up at your house.

One notable exception to this is Z1 Enterprises. If you see it on their website, it's in stock. And you will have it in about 3 days.

However, note that a lot of OEM parts are not listed there. Call them, they will be happy to order them for you, but just like everyone else, it will take that same 10-14 days to get there.

.

 

[koolaid_kid]

Be careful with that thought. :-k

Virtually all of the online vendors will show that part in the fiche, but they all have to order it from the same supply chain.
That's right, NONE of them will carry parts for a 30-year-old bike in stock, they have to be ordered.

Plan on 10-14 days for a box to show up at your house.

One notable exception to this is Z1 Enterprises. If you see it on their website, it's in stock. And you will have it in about 3 days.

However, note that a lot of OEM parts are not listed there. Call them, they will be happy to order them for you, but just like everyone else, it will take that same 10-14 days to get there.

.

Steve makes a very important point here. This is why I refuse to pay more from a particular vendor; it comes from the same source. When ordering on-line you need to factor in shipping charges as well. Some charge more than others, and the increased shipping may offset a lower initial cost. I also prefer to group my orders, getting as many parts as possible so the shipping per part decreases. For example, when I order a valve cover gasket, I order two and the second hangs on the wall; I will need it eventually.
Z1 also carries more parts than they list on their website; I prefer to call them. They are always willing to talk to you and they are very knowledgeable.

 

[hardline_42]

Be careful with that thought. :-k

Virtually all of the online vendors will show that part in the fiche, but they all have to order it from the same supply chain.
That's right, NONE of them will carry parts for a 30-year-old bike in stock, they have to be ordered.

Plan on 10-14 days for a box to show up at your house.

One notable exception to this is Z1 Enterprises. If you see it on their website, it's in stock. And you will have it in about 3 days.

However, note that a lot of OEM parts are not listed there. Call them, they will be happy to order them for you, but just like everyone else, it will take that same 10-14 days to get there.

.

Steve makes a very important point here. This is why I refuse to pay more from a particular vendor; it comes from the same source. When ordering on-line you need to factor in shipping charges as well. Some charge more than others, and the increased shipping may offset a lower initial cost. I also prefer to group my orders, getting as many parts as possible so the shipping per part decreases. For example, when I order a valve cover gasket, I order two and the second hangs on the wall; I will need it eventually.
Z1 also carries more parts than they list on their website; I prefer to call them. They are always willing to talk to you and they are very knowledgeable.

Thanks. I'll be sure to give Z1 a call. I also put a request in at my local Suzuki dealer just to see what it would cost to avoid the 2-week delay.

 

[Gorminrider]

Nice bike! That appears to be exactly similar to my airbox for my very similar appearing 1981GS(X)400EX (same colour-even the same rack on the back)
There are two foam filter supports. The pictured one is the bottom one. The missing top one actually has a crease in it to allow easier removal. If you want, I can send some pix.The missing foam is as Nessism has it...(is it a urethane type that will not decay with petroleum distillates? something like that, I expect)
The metal screen is stock. I like that you call it a flame-arrester. Good attitude. It also keeps spiders and other silly things that can be dropped in there out of the carbs.

 

[hardline_42]

Nice bike! That appears to be exactly similar to my airbox for my very similar appearing 1981GS(X)400EX (same colour-even the same rack on the back)
There are two foam filter supports. The pictured one is the bottom one. The missing top one actually has a crease in it to allow easier removal. If you want, I can send some pix.The missing foam is as Nessism has it...(is it a urethane type that will not decay with petroleum distillates? something like that, I expect)
The metal screen is stock. I like that you call it a flame-arrester. Good attitude. It also keeps spiders and other silly things that can be dropped in there out of the carbs.

Pics would be nice, though I'm pretty confident I know what's missing. The pic I posted in a previous post is not my box, it's from eBay. My airbox doesn't have the bottom support (or the top support or the filter element).
As for the "flame trap," I would hope it does more than keep bugs out! I'm not sure how I feel about a potential backfire igniting an oil-soaked chunk of foam directly under my junk.

 

[Gorminrider]

Pics would be nice, though I'm pretty confident I know what's missing. The pic I posted in a previous post is not my box, it's from eBay. My airbox doesn't have the bottom support (or the top support or the filter element).

As for the "flame trap," I would hope it does more than keep bugs out! I'm not sure how I feel about a potential backfire igniting an oil-soaked chunk of foam directly under my junk.

...But I expect the airbox is the same and also looks as BassCliff posted...same as mine.... Standby for pix.
It'd be pretty simple to make these filter racks, they are just plastic..

 

[Gorminrider]

You are looking at the upper screen's Bottom ...Note the crease/fold in it to help removal through the airbox's small hole. The lower screen also comes out,if wanted.

 

[hardline_42]

You are looking at the upper screen's Bottom ...Note the crease/fold in it to help removal through the airbox's small hole. The lower screen also comes out,if wanted.

Excellent, thank you so much! I think I'm going to scribe a template using the groove inside the box and maybe cut them out of the sides of a plastic laundry basket or similar. Some binder clips will probably hold the top on just fine until I get the real parts.