no start

[Guest]

I have a GS1100e that will not even try to start. I have fuel, good compression and spark. I've checked all the usual suspects, ie the fuel tank is full, the kill switch is not on, no problems with the wiring, battery is new. The bike cranks fine but will not even attempt to start. I've used starter fluid and I don't even get a pop. The bike hasn't been sitting for an extended period of time. It was running fine, in fact I just got back from Virginia, and it stopped. I am at a loss. What could I be overlooking? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks

 

[rphillips]

Welcome, I'm no mechanic, but if it doesn't even hit using starting fluid, I'd be looking at spark...

 

[Redman]

. . . .. I have good compression and spark. ..........

Tell us more about how you determined those.

Oh, and we need pic of the bike.
Yah, need to know if Red or the silver.
(joking)
Picture might show if stock or aftermarket stuff.

 

[sacruickshank]

A few more things to consider ...
- What is the airbox situation? Stock with filter, converted to pods, nothing, etc.? Maybe it's getting way too much air or maybe not enough. Probably not the cause if it was running recently
- Among the usual suspects, was choke on? Was choke circuit clean? It's probably not that if starter fluid didn't work, but worth confirming.

 

[Guest]

Well,
The bike's engine is stock except for pods and a K&N stage 3 jet kit and a Yosh 4-1 exhaust. Vacuum line from the gas tank is connected. I've tried with the choke both on and off. Compression test was done with a compression tester, all cylinders in the 140s. For the spark I pulled a plug and laid it against the head while cranking all cylinders firing. Also a spark tester, one of those that plugs in between the coil wire and spark plug. I was thinking the spark was a little weak but with all cylinders sparking I should get some pops from the engine even if it didn't run. This is the thing that is so frustrating. Even if one of these things was a little off I think I should get some indication that the bike was trying to start. Could a bad ignitor prevent the bike from starting even with spark? It's going to be a little warmer today so I plan on checking the timing and by the way I am the original owner....and It's red.

 

[Cipher]

Not responding to starter fluid at all points to ignition.
Is the bike properly wired? Iirc zero spark will occur if ignition box not grounded

 

[Guest]

Yea, ignition was my first thought too, It seemed the spark might be a little weak but I would think that with even a weak spark on all cylinders I would get some sign of combustion. I'm going to check the petcock tomorrow. I cranked the bike for about 15 seconds and pulled a plug. It was dry' I've got another petcock around here someplace so I'll install it tomorrow and see if that makes a difference. I'll check those grounds also. I appreciate everyone's suggestions. I was at a loss.

 

[rphillips]

Kind'f feel silly to mention, cause it makes no sense, but last spring my GSX1100G would not hit a lick. I checked all the regular stuff, & not going thru the whole story, I replaced the resistor spark plugs with non resister plugs & the thing fired right up & has been starting & running ever since. I did try new resistor plugs first but they didn't help. I've never seen or heard of such, but it happened & still running fine.

 

[Cipher]

Kind'f feel silly to mention, cause it makes no sense, but last spring my GSX1100G would not hit a lick. I checked all the regular stuff, & not going thru the whole story, I replaced the resistor spark plugs with non resister plugs & the thing fired right up & has been starting & running ever since.

Yes well pretty sure this indicates your plugs were bad as Iv not ever had a problem running resistor plugs.

 

[Cipher]

Yea, ignition was my first thought too, It seemed the spark might be a little weak but I would think that with even a weak spark on all cylinders I would get some sign of combustion. I'm going to check the petcock tomorrow. I cranked the bike for about 15 seconds and pulled a plug. It was dry' I've got another petcock around here someplace so I'll install it tomorrow and see if that makes a difference. I'll check those grounds also. I appreciate everyone's suggestions. I was at a loss.

It best not to generlize things. Plugs do not have to go bad as a set anymore than coils do. Indeed carbs themselves are separate units and can fail differently.
The individual cylinders and their valve lash too is not necessarily uniform in wear.

One thing to check the petcock if fuel flows from it on prime then fuel should get to the bowls.
You can check the bowls by removing the drain plugs and fuel should come out.

But its shocking that the thing wont kick for ether. Maybe its the pods or your shooting too much or too little in. To little it might not kick too much it could backfire through the carb and ruin your day.

 

[rphillips]

Cipher, I've never heard of it either, the GSX1100G OEM plugs are resistor plugs. NGK JR9B (R stands for resistor) & my bike has been running fine with them for yrs. When it wouldn't even try to start I tried a new set of them first but nothing. Had a set of D9EA's in the garage, same size, reach, thread, only difference was shape of electrode & being a non resistor so tried one of them in 1 plug cap & grounded against the eng. & saw a very noticeable brighter spark, tried it on another cyl. plug cap & same brighter spark. Installed all 4 D9EA plugs & all has been good since. Possibly the 4 plugs that had been running fine all went bad at the same time & the new set were bad also, I can't say for sure, but the thing is still doing just fine with the D9EA's. I know it don't sound right, but it is out in the garage right now & started just fine a week or so ago.

 

[2BRacing]

I have seen reports in other threads that a combination of resistor spark plugs with resistor plug caps can result in poor/no spark.

Either one or the other being resistor type, but not both together, seems to help.

 

[roeme]

Yes, while on a healthy and/or new ignition it shouldn't be problem to combine resistor plugs & caps, in many situations with our vintage bikes it's better not do it.

If it's not responding to starter fluid with good compression and an apparently good ignition; one could also try the ole teaspoon trick - if it's not responding by then, then definitively something is off with the ignition.

 

[rphillips]

Not sure but thinking my "91" GSX1100G oem had resistor wires, resistor plug caps & resistor plugs. The older GS's had resistor wires & resistor plug caps but non resistor plugs.

 

[Cipher]

Yes, while on a healthy and/or new ignition it shouldn't be problem to combine resistor plugs & caps, in many situations with our vintage bikes it's better not do it.

If it's not responding to starter fluid with good compression and an apparently good ignition; one could also try the ole teaspoon trick - if it's not responding by then, then definitively something is off with the ignition.

What is this teaspoon trick? stainless or sliver? if silver will silver plate do in a pinch?

 

[Cipher]

Not sure but thinking my "91" GSX1100G oem had resistor wires, resistor plug caps & resistor plugs. The older GS's had resistor wires & resistor plug caps but non resistor plugs.

I think your mistaken about resistor wire on GS bikes. If people would dismantle the plug cap internals they would see the corrosion that occurs over time. This increases resistance so perhaps its a marginal slightly higher resistance cap causing all these magical woes.

 

[rphillips]

I don't remember if I did anything to the plug caps on the GSX1100G or not. Back in my more aggressive (hot rodding) days, I've disassembled bunches of resistor caps, removed the resistors & packed with copper wire strands, just so there wouldn't be any resistance. Wanted all the spark I could get seemed reasonable. Never seemed to help nor harm anything. I never knew why resistance was needed, all I ever heard was to reduce the static on a.m. radios.

 

[Cipher]

I don't remember if I did anything to the plug caps on the GSX1100G or not. Back in my more aggressive (hot rodding) days, I've disassembled bunches of resistor caps, removed the resistors & packed with copper wire strands, just so there wouldn't be any resistance. Wanted all the spark I could get seemed reasonable. Never seemed to help nor harm anything. I never knew why resistance was needed, all I ever heard was to reduce the static on a.m. radios.

I have removed the resistor on caps as well and inserted brass rod in their place then used resistor plugs. The resistors can indeed go bad.

 

[rphillips]

Would there be a disadvantage if no resistors in anything, wires, caps, nor plugs? Also do these resistors weaken the spark or slow it down? resistor could mean either. Why want a weaker spark & if slowed, seems that would be addressed with ign. timing?...I don'no.

 

[Cipher]

Would there be a disadvantage if no resistors in anything, wires, caps, nor plugs? Also do these resistors weaken the spark or slow it down? resistor could mean either. Why want a weaker spark & if slowed, seems that would be addressed with ign. timing?...I don'no.

It may be legend but some folks say that resistance in the plugs or caps allows the charge to the plug build and dissipate in a controlled manner for a cleaner burn bnut i think suzuki went this way to protect the fledgling electronic ignitions.