Oil cooler Install

[Anonymous]

When you install an oil cooler on an 1100e, where is the proper place to run your lines from? I've seen some lines that run off the oil journals of both sides of the oil filter plate. Then I've seen some oil coolers with the oil filter plate drilled fittings installed directly to the cover. Then I've seen some folks that run the oil cooler through the fitting where your pressure sending unit is. So what is the best route to go here :?: Cause I'm kinda confused here. :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

I'm going to run mine through the oil journals on either side of the oil filter.
Need to get a oil filter cover for an 1150 first though. Apparently there is minor difference between the 1100 and 1150 cover that routes the oil through the cooler (cooler I'm installing is from an 1150).
If you notice there are two saddles directly above the oil journals that nicely take the oil filter lines. Think that was their intent originally.

 

[Anonymous]

Oil cooler Install

Does anybody know what the differences in these two covers? Does anyone have a couple of these covers?

 

[Anonymous]

I have both an 1100 E & a 1150 E out in my garage. I've looked at them a couple of times, to see if I could see any difference. They look exactly the same, while mounted on the bikes. I would also like to know the difference. This spring, I will be sure to change the oil in both bikes at the same time, have both covers off at the same time so I can take a closer look.

 

[Anonymous]

I have both an 1100 E & a 1150 E out in my garage. I've looked at them a couple of times, to see if I could see any difference. They look exactly the same, while mounted on the bikes. I would also like to know the difference. This spring, I will be sure to change the oil in both bikes at the same time, have both covers off at the same time so I can take a closer look.

On the right side (and the inside), with it (the cover) mounted on the bike and as you sit on the bike, there is kind of a "cup" that sits over the incoming oil passage. I assume it's purpose is to cause enough back pressure to force some of the oil to pass through the cooler before returning to the filter cavity.
But yes, from the outside they are identical.

 

[Anonymous]

I posted earlier on the oil passages on my GS1100E after I tore down the motor and split the cases. This was a visual inspection.

Ok, I just finished looking at some more of those oil passages. In particular, the oil passages connected to the two threaded connections on either side of the oil filter, presumably meant to be used for an external oil cooler. It looks as if they do allow oil from the pump to pass through the cooler if an external one is used. They do not force all of the oil through the cooler however. The configuration suggests that only a percentage of the oil will actually pass through the cooler.

With an external cooler present the oil flows from the oil pump to a split in the passage that allows oil to flow either to the filter cavity (larger passage) or alternatively to the external cooler (smaller passage). The oil passes through the cooler and enters the block through the second coupling where it is directly routed into the filer cavity. So, one path is from the pump to the filter through a large oil passage (less resistance). While the other path is from the pump to external coupling (smaller passage = more resistance), then through the cooler to the other fitting (more resistance), and finally to the filter cavity (smaller passage = still more resistance).

How much oil is going to pass through the cooler? I won't commit to that right now, I'm just trying to understand the system so that any modifications work as expect and I'm not throwing money away on gadgets that don't work.

If one was ambitious enough this portion of the oiling system could be calculated if all of the passages were measured for both diameter and length and the fluid resistances understood for the right angle changes in direction for said passages. I think it would be safe to say that < 50% of the oil from the pump actually passes throught the filter.

Some info for you to chew on.

 

[Anonymous]

I just notice that I made a mistake in the previous post. I said:

I think it would be safe to say that < 50% of the oil from the pump actually passes throught the filter.

What I meant to say was:

I think it would be safe to say that < 50% of the oil from the pump actually passes throught the COOLER. (All of the oil passes through the FILTER).

Sorry for any misunderstanding. Damn, I should read these more carefully before I post. 8O :?

 

[Anonymous]

On that last sentence
"I think it would be safe to say that < 50% of the oil from the pump actually passes throught the filter."
Did you mean say pass through the "cooler"?
From the way it looks to me, my 1100 engine is currently tore down, looks like only a portion of the oil will passs through the cooler than return to the filter cavity and through the filter.
Thats where the "cup" (really bad description I know) on the 1150 cover causes more to flow through the cooler than if the 1100 cover was used. The "cup" is basically a raised cylinderical ridge same diameter as the incoming oil gallery that appears would actually block the incoming oil except it has a notch approx. 3/8" wide in it that allows the oil to go ahead and flow into the oil filter cavity. The other portion of the oil goes through the "cutoff" passage, about 3" back in the gallery, that leads to the cooler than back in through the other side.
Baring my mutilation of the English language, does that pretty sound like what you see?

 

[Anonymous]

You got me before I could repost! :lol:

I don't know what the old cover looks like on the 1150 - but your assesment is correct for the 1100. The filter cover has a 'bubble' or 'cup' - an area on it that lets the oil pass into the filter cavity. Without this - if the filter cover were machined flat - then the only way to get oil to the filter cavity would be to use the external passages setup for a cooler.

I imagine that Suzuki put some thought into this and determined that all of the oil does not need to pass through a cooler. In a cooler climate, this would not allow the oil to reach its proper operating temperature.

To properly deal with temperature extreemes the ideal solution would be some kind of thermal bypass switch. Then again, there are quite a few here that don't use a cooler at all and their motors have lived long and happy lives.

To sum it up - I don't have any answers. Right now I'll probably add a cooler when I assemble the bike and use the two taps on either side of the cover. I'll trust the Suzuki engineers.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't know what the old cover looks like on the 1150 - but your assesment is correct for the 1100. The filter cover has a 'bubble' or 'cup' - an area on it that lets the oil pass into the filter cavity.

Just to make sure, the "cup" I was referencing is in addition to the depression that is made by the inside surface of the 1100 oil filter cover. It sits directly above (and so partially blocks) the incoming oil gallery on the lower left hand side of the oil filter cavity. It's about 3/4" in diameter and raised about 3/8" (comes up flush with the inside mounting suface of the cover).
Don't think it could cause a problem not using the 1150 cover when installing a cooler on the 1100 but I don't think it would get much flow without using it.

Wish I had a picture. (thousand words and all that).
Any of you 1150 owners out there changing your oil soon?

 

[Anonymous]

Oil cooler Install

So does anyone out there have a picture of an 1150 cover? I just wonder if you could maybe build this "cup" up on a 1100 cover. I've got a buddy that welds aluminum. Does the cup come up flush with the edge around the outside of the cover? :?:

 

[kz]

Re: Oil cooler Install

So does anyone out there have a picture of an 1150 cover? I just wonder if you could maybe build this "cup" up on a 1100 cover. I've got a buddy that welds aluminum. Does the cup come up flush with the edge around the outside of the cover? :?:

From the Service Manual GS 1150 1984 if any help....

Scanned this pics. when the tpoic was discussed earlier.

http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil1GS1150.jpg
http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil2GS1150.jpg
http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil3GS1150.jpg
http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil4GS1150.jpg
http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil5GS1150.jpg

 

[Anonymous]

The diagram shows the dual route to the filter - either through the colloer or what they call the bypass. It doesn't show the oil cover 'cup' that Sexton7z is refering too.

I'm trying to visualize this. Could it be that the Suzuki engineers where trying to reduce the flow of oil through the bypass if a cooler was used by adding a small restriction?

 

[kz]

The diagram shows the dual route to the filter - either through the colloer or what they call the bypass. It doesn't show the oil cover 'cup' that Sexton7z is refering too.

I'm trying to visualize this. Could it be that the Suzuki engineers where trying to reduce the flow of oil through the bypass if a cooler was used by adding a small restriction?

Swanny I don't understand your question,

I have the complete manual (and the bike), do you want me too scan anything more?

If yes, I can do that.

 

[Anonymous]

oil cooler

oil cooler

use the 1150 cover plate, there is a difference between the 1100&1150. ive ran external oil cooler for years on my 82 1100ez.it works fine and yes it gets hot, it flows plenty of oil..

 

[Anonymous]

The diagram shows the dual route to the filter - either through the colloer or what they call the bypass. It doesn't show the oil cover 'cup' that Sexton7z is refering too.

Look at the last picture i kz's post. http://medlem.spray.se/ocorsagsi/Oil5GS1150.jpg
Letter B is the cup I referred to. Doesn't show up terribly well but it's there. It is not there on the 1100 cover.

Give me about an hour. I'm going to pull mine and take a picture side by side with the 1100 cover.

 

[Anonymous]

OK, here we go.
The 1150 is on the right and the "cup" is in the bottom right corner. Cup really is bad description. It basically blocks the the incoming passage. I originally thought the notch was about 3/8" wide but it's only about 1/8 wide and an 1/8 deep. I figure almost all the oil will pass through the cooler now that I've look at it again.

Here's a picture of the cup from another angle.

 

[Anonymous]

Nice pic - shows it clearly.

I just looked at some 1150's on this website and it looks as if all of them have coolers. Ok, the question that I have now is "Does the 1150 come stock with an oil cooler?"

From looking at the cover for the 1150, I think it would need one to get the quantity of oil to the filter necessary for the engine to live. Without a cooler, all of the oil must pass through the tiny orifice that is machined into the cover -> not good.

If the above it true, then:

1) This would mean that severe engine damage could result by removing the oil cooler -> plugging the external filter passages.

2) Could it be that Suxuki discovered that too much oil was bypassing the cooler (when an external cooler was installed) in the 1100 and fixed it in the 1150.

3) Which implies that I should get the 1150 cover if I am considering an external cooler.

All in all - thank you very mcuh for shedding some light on this for me. Very well done.

 

[Anonymous]

I think all the 1150s had coolers.

1. Oh yes, I do think so. But I guess you could put the 1100 cover on 1150 with the cooler removed to allow unrestricted flow to the filter?

2. Perhaps? The 1100 block certainly was cast with a cooler in mind. Don't why it didn't ship with one.

3. I would (and am going to) get the 1150 cover if installing a cooler on the 1100.
I've got an 1150 cooler for my 1100 already. The bike is currently scattered all over my garage but I hope to have it back on two wheels by riding season.

 

[Anonymous]

1) The covers seem pretty interchangable as long as you use an oil cooler on the 1150.

2) My guess is that the engineers knew they wanted to fit (or would have to fit) on oil cooler eventually. Due to various release time limitations they designed in the fittings and left the rest until later. By the time the 1150 came out they had the oil cooler and bypass flow porting tested and ready to go.

Maybe - maybe not - good story though.

In any event - unless someone throws a monkey wrench into this thought process - the oil cooler configuration issue is resolved for me.

If you use an oil cooler -> use the 1150 cover.