Shaft drive converted to chain..?

[Ross]

My 1993 GSX1100G uses the earlier GSX-R (87- 90) 1100 slingshot motor. It is shaft drive. I have to go inside soon to do some repair to 2nd gear. So my thoughts are anything I may want to change.. do it now while it's opened up. The final drive ratio on this thing is terrible. (about 5200 @ 70mph) Anyone have any hands on exp. on converting to chain drive, or know of any of the earlier GS (G's) that will make a ratio change to reduce the final drive ?
Thanx.......RT

 

[Ross]

Well I can respect your view point. But apparently your not too brite. You see, I repeatedly max the top speed out at 137MPH. (5th gear@10,500 RPM) On just my daily rides to and fro...I race motorcycles, and am very comfortable at those speeds. In fact that is a tad slow for my "fun" area. I would like it to run about 155MPH. Being as how it's close to 22HP over stock, it has ALL the power it needs to pull it up to that mark without working hard at all. With 1100cc's on tap and a ton of torque, it will like a lower gear to drop cruising rpm down to say 4600 @ 75mph. That way when I am not running the dog snot out of it, I can let the motor "relax" if you will. And can still maintain a get on down the road speed, without turning so many RPM.
The Harley reference just proves my point. I have a 88inch sporty that I would love to embarrass you with.

 

[mighty13d]

Don't get too wound up about what people say on here. This is actually one of the most relaxed forums that you'll find with the most helpful people anywhere. This is honestly the best one I have seen. Now that that has been said:

Converting to chain has been asked and asked and once someone starts to actually look into how much is involved in doing it, it's easier and cheaper to get an entirely different bike instead. As far as different gearing, it's obviously not as simple as going down a couple on the rear sprocket anymore. There should be a couple people who can rattle off the gearing on the shafties weighing in shortly. I know if you search for it, you can find the gearing, but there is people who will know what can work right off the top of their heads.

 

[Ross]

that would be great. I thought about running a taller tire but then that requires changing the front to keep geometry correct. I am on a few forums. so not wound up at all. i just put "talkers" in their place if needed. Like I said I do and can respect his point of view, but if it isnt what applies to my post and then talks with no wisdom about things well then you school if needed.

 

[tom203]

Well I can respect your view point. But apparently your not too brite. You see, I repeatedly max the top speed out at 137MPH. (5th gear@10,500 RPM) On just my daily rides to and fro...I race motorcycles, and am very comfortable at those speeds. In fact that is a tad slow for my "fun" area. I would like it to run about 155MPH.

Well, you asked for an opinion and he gave it to you ( though it seems to have disappeared into cyber space). With this engine arrangement, a shaft is an inefficient way to transfer power to the wheel- you obviously know this. A shaft has advantages to slowpokes like me and that's why they're popular. Why criticize someone just because they have a different point of view? If you already have concluded the answer to your question, why ask it here? This is a forum for all different levels of technical ability- be nice!

 

[blowerbike]

i must be blind..i don't see any negative comments
anyways ..
ross,
take what you have and live with it.
that bike won't pull 155 un-faired with a pipe and jet kit..
not say it isn't possible just saying i wouldn't waste money or effort.
nice bikes but they are what they are.
torque monster...yes...killer mid range...yes. at least with the added performance parts you have.
add a set of GSXR cams set in the low low 100's and that will wake it up.
add a set of 36/38 RS miks tuned right and that will wake it up.


did some one delete a comment because i don't see the person your responding to.

 

[Steve]

I'm not sure what qualifies as a "slingshot" motor, but for the most part, a shaft-drive engine is not practical to convert to a chain-drive.

Your engine speed also seems a bit excessive. It is actually close to what my 850s are spinning, the 1000 and 1100 engine are usually quite a bit slower. :-k

.

 

[JEEPRUSTY]

your not to brite???


what the heck is this for a response to a post?

asking for an opinion then insulting some poor sod for giving one?

Oh my oh my just awful behaviour and you are not to bright to imagine a shaftie could or should be converted.

Dicking with final drive ratios is just that.
Buy a bimota with a cassette transmission system and be happy.

 

[Ross]

No Tom203 I'm sorry, but you to have mis read my original post. Just like the other person did. Then gave me your input to something that NEVER TOOK PLACE.
Please,... unless someone deleted something I wrote.
Show me where I have concluded the answer to my question....? Or where I ASKED FOR AN OPINION..?
As a matter of fact, I asked for specific hands on exp. Further more, I stated in my next post, and again in my second one, "THAT I RESPECTED HIS POINT OF VIEW".
The persons posting was criticized for the following:
#1, He offered no input to my question. #2, He gave me his opinion on something I didnt ask for. #3, The input he did offer up was wrong.
Finally #4, He mis-read my post. (like you) Made an assumption based on that, then decided to give me his thoughts on it.
ALL That... = none productive to my quest.
Steve, yes I agree it is excessive for those numbers. To make matters worse, the speedo is about 5mph off. So really it is about 5200rpm @ 66mph. The "slingshot"mortor, is the nick name given to the 1st gen GSXR 4 valve motors. I maybe wrong, but to the 750 and 1100's only.
Blowerbike, I have trimmed 51 lbs off the beast. I also have a nose fairing on it that has helped a bunch. It's much better than the 4 X 8 sheet of plywood is was anyway. I was told or read..? Suzuki used the "R" cams, and put them in at +4. I dont want to change where it runs at, I like the flat torque curve and lower red line. I helps to avoid "Jonny law" on the noise factor, and makes it very drivable. I was hoping to get the gearing down and make it work harder. Even if it isnt able to run in the 150+ range. I dont want to keep it maxed out so often, or where it is at a nice cruise of say 75 or 80 mph.
I have to go in and fix the trans soon. So that is why I posted the question. I dont mind keeping the shaft drive at all. If there is anyone who knows one way or the other which combination of mainshaft gears and or wheel gears that will mate up to reduce the amount of rpm the motor is turning at cruising speed that is ideally what I want to achieve.

 

[Ross]

Like I said Rusty jeep. I never asked for an opinion, read the post Mr. brite one.
I personally didnt think I was the smart ass in my response. And seeing as how you havent saw the post I responded to , you are as much out of line as he was.

 

[raistian77]

Ross, not sure if a shafter can be converted. By the time you swapped in internals and casings you might be better off with a different bike. Or maybe a bike with good powerplant,chain and sprockets and bad body and swapping them in.
Casings will be totally different
Internal gear ratios will be different
you will need a swingarm out of a chain bike

Lots of work and money

You shouldn't get mad at the responses to a question like this. Once a customer asked for the price to swap a 4.3 vortec into his 2.2 S-10. The estimate was almost equal to the price of a real nice used 43 S-10.

 

[Steve]

... Casings will be totally different
Internal gear ratios will be different
you will need a swingarm out of a chain bike ...

and you will also need a different frame.

or at least modify the shaftie frame to handle the "chain" swingarm. Yeah, they are different.


Ross,
I still don't understand why you are turning such high revs with a shaftie.
You seem to be turning higher revs than my 850s, the 1100s should be considerably lower.

Many of us will run one size over on the front tire to minimize (usually eliminate) the speedo error.
The odometer will be off a bit, but they don't give tickets for wrong mileage.

I forget who it is, but someone here has put together a spreadsheet with all the transmission ratios, secondary drive ratios and final drive ratios. Normally it would not be practical to split the cases to change the gears to drop the rpm a couple hundred, but since you are going to be in there anyway, it might be worth looking into. I think it was the '83 and '84 1100GKs that came with a different final drive ratio. Most of the others were about 3.1, those two years were 2.9.

.

 

[rapidray]

Ross, mellow out & don't get bent or insult people with your attitude when you come here asking advice. You don't have enough time here yet to act like you know it all. Put a GSXR swingarm in your chassis, put a chain drive motor in it, & THEN come back & act like you know it all. Just a suggestion to start with. Oh yeah, one more thing, I speak from EXPERIENCE & have been around & doing this for awhile! If you doubt me, I will be HAPPY to race you for some cash with my SLOWEST GS. Don't worry, be HAPPY! Ray.

 

[GregT]

Ross - what you're asking for is not common to say the least...There are people on here who can tell you the final drive and transmission output gear ratios for the earlier GS/GSX series but whether any of these will fit the (basically GSXR) motor you have is unknown.
Physical comparison of the final drive units if there's a GS one which is a taller gear would be the start point.
I see the tests state it pulls a lower gear than the equivalent chain drive but the ratio is not stated. Do you know the final drive ratio fitted now ?

I'd love to know where you ride too, if you regularly max it out in top gear...

If you like the big faired tourer and want a chain try a GSX1100f - the electric screen one - your engine good bits will drop right in.

 

[Ross]

Its a 1993 GSX1100G 91- 93 US. Up to 1996 in Europe.
http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/suzu/suzuki_gsx1100g 91.htm
It uses the 87-89 slingshot GSXR 1100 engine. The cases are the same from what Im told. No change was made to use the shaft drive output for this appl.
Greg I live in North Ga. Not much traffic up here (50 miles north of Atl.) in the lower foot hills of the Blue Ridge Mnts. Im about 50 miles south of Deals Gap, (the dragons tail) and Suches Two Wheels Only is my front yard. When I go to that speed limit I dont go towards the traffic areas thats for sure. I dont know the final drive ratio. Im going to check that out now. Im also going to check out the part numbers to see, but I think the main shaft part number is the same for the 1989 GSXR750 and my GSX1100. If so, I think it maybe as easy as pressing the spline gear off, and a sprocket on to make the conversion. If that wont work, then Im back into looking for a lower ratio. I dont know why Suzuki made it such a high ratio. Many who have these bikes ask the same question.
Rapidray again, you like others are making comments to me about something I said to someone who has now deleted his post. Did you see the posting I commented on..?

 

[tom203]

Its a 1993 GSX1100G 91- 93 US. Up to 1996 in Europe.
http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/suzu/suzuki_gsx1100g 91.htm
It uses the 87-89 slingshot GSXR 1100 engine.
Rapidray again, you like others are making comments to me about something I said to someone who has now deleted his post. Did you see the posting I commented on..?

I don't know who else saw the post you "commented on", but I did. To my way of thinking, if you ask for someones's advice, the chances are pretty good that you'll get an opinion. Apparently, this displeased you. All sorts of questions get asked here, so you have to be tolerant - there's little point in being negative.

 

[hampshirehog]

Ross,
Take Ray up on his offer.

I will be HAPPY to race you for some cash with my SLOWEST GS. Ray.

Ray, I'll scupper your chances - I'll give you my little sister's bike (sitting in my garage at the moment for a few fixes). Better off riding your pushbike mate - it's one of these....

A GS125 - pokes out about 12BHP (but it does appear to manufacture its own fuel...)

Seriously. Ross, your bike is a beast of a thing but it'll be a lot of work to convert it to chain drive. They do suffer from the rear suspension going off after a while and when they do that they get real nasty.

 

[Ross]

I agree Tom. The negative stuff does nothing for anyone.
Im waitng on some info on the part number cross reference.
hampshirehog, I think Mr. raceray was making reference to my comment to the deleted post, and he wants to make sure I know his slowest GS is still faster than my sporty. Fact is,.. if it isnt a good drag bike. He may be very ****ed off with the results.
BTW, Rustyjeep. My RG500 has a cassette transmission. They are a PITA.

 

[shiznizbiz]

does your engine look like this one? More specifically, the rear of the crankcase on the left side.
If so, your bike has a secondary drive unit bolted into the back. Youd need a whole rear end from a chain drive(swing arm, wheel and all). I dont know what would bolt in to your frame.
And youd more than likely need a whole crankcase and bottom end for your motor since the majority of suzuki's shaft drive crankcases are designed specifically for the shaft drive needs. (like the secondary drive gear location) The transmission will be totally different as well. I think its a safe to say, it would be very complicated to change a shaft drive engine into a chain drive engine. I have a feeling you were either, lied to when you bought this bike, or your very misinformed of the engine. It may have been that someone swapped all the gsxr's goodies from the crankcase up onto the gsx's crankcase so that it would be a shaftie. But im not sure of how realistic of a swap it may be. I dont know. I dont have that experience with that motor. I may me totally wrong but i think i may be somewhat right.

 

[Hammered]

Actully, a shafty albeit with a great deal of effort and cash, can be converted to chain. Just as the old yamas ran a shaft final to make their bike shafties. Youd have to build or find a suitable yoke to gear final drive. And with that adding length to the drive, youd more than likey have to stretch the swinger, but since youd be converting to a chain, youd also be swapping the swinger out. With all the benefits a shaftie provides to those of us slower types, they present barriers for those of you with "A Need For Speed!" (in big booming voice) Best shot as already stated would be to pick up a different ride already chain driven for the effort and funds required. And this comes from a guys who thinks stock anything sucks.

Oh and dont let any of these guys sweat you. Some people feel it their duty to impress their ideas on anyone who listens.