1981 GS450E Rebuild

[Flyboy]

I like it Pete, you have the idea spot on..........BUT..............I think the front mud gaurd is still too "road bike", I would try and lift it a bit to get the same sort of gap between tyre and mudgaurd that the trimmed rear and duck tail is going to give you at the back, to keep the style flowing from front to back and also to create the illusion of increased suspension travel like that of a scrambler.
You may pick up problems then with the mudgaurd fouling on the downtubes or exhaust, so may have to reshape and trim there as well.
Otherwise, looks good, coming on nicely.
Not crazy about the black either, not for the style you are after, sorry, just my honest opinion, I'll go away and drink beer now ----------------->

 

[Guest]

I like it Pete, you have the idea spot on..........BUT..............I think the front mud gaurd is still too "road bike", I would try and lift it a bit to get the same sort of gap between tyre and mudgaurd that the trimmed rear and duck tail is going to give you at the back, to keep the style flowing from front to back and also to create the illusion of increased suspension travel like that of a scrambler.
You may pick up problems then with the mudgaurd fouling on the downtubes or exhaust, so may have to reshape and trim there as well.
Otherwise, looks good, coming on nicely.
Not crazy about the black either, not for the style you are after, sorry, just my honest opinion, I'll go away and drink beer now ----------------->

Cheers Flyboy! I tend to agree on the front guard, however that's actually a bit of a dilemma to change as I'm of the understanding that the underside forms somewhat of a fork brace, so moving that around could have detrimental affects on the handling which I'm not real keen on.

I guess it's possible to separate the bracing part from the rest of the guard, but I suspect all that will result in is me destroying an otherwise reasonably ok stock front guard.

Unless I can come up with some other bright idea then I think I'm gonna have to stick with it, even if it does take away from the scrambler style a little.

Having said that, if you do some Googling for the Honda CL350/450 Scramblers and Triumph Scrambler, you'll see there are very few that have high set front guards, and all tend to have tyre hugging ones like mine, so I think it'll be "acceptable"...

As to the black/grey combo, it's not set in stone yet, just a theme I tend to like, but you're also right that it doesn't really personify the whole scrambler thing, and I will stick some others into the GIMP to see how they look.

Most seem to end up with chrome front/rear guards, but that's not doable for me unless I get the front re-chromed after straightening the creases out and get the rear electroplated, and I'm not keen on either of those, so maybe even silver might be ok... I'll try some more colours out soon, plenty of time to decide before painting.

And don't be concerned about giving feedback like that, it makes me think which is good, and will probably help me avoid some stupid obvious mistake at some point

Hope you enjoyed the beers!

 

[Guest]

House mate brought back his welder today:



130 amps which should be enough for what I need to do I believe, and hopefully the electrodes he has will be ok, the smaller ones are 2.5mm which apparently are the right size.

And of course yesterday I picked up the JB Weld:



And I picked up some more supplies today:



The P clamps should allow me to mount the electrics tray a little more elegantly than the hose clamps that are on there now and I needed some more course sand paper as I've been through all the stuff I had. Need that to prepare for using the JB Weld and also for preparing the carb diaphragm and float bowl covers, front caliper and bracket, and the other odds and ends I'll be hitting with the caliper paint soon.

I also picked up a metre of red and black 50 amp wire to extend the starter motor lead and also to be able to run the battery positive and negative leads to where it will sit under the duck tail.

I'm hoping the 50 amp will be ok for the momentary load of the starter as it was either that or the huge cable suitable for cars, and that's just way too thick to even think about trying to route around a bike frame.

One thing I did neglect to get though were some round crimp terminals so I can actually attach it to the starter motor and starter solenoid as the ones I have are for much smaller diameter wire.

Then tonight I started on getting the frame work JB Welded to the existing duck tail frame.

Prepared by sanding the spots where the JB Weld will go, then cleaning up with some metho:



Got the top rod on which is the key to lining the rest up:



And the side rods on, which are the next piece in the puzzle as the side rods will need to attach to the bottom of these:



The electrical tape is there to hold them in place while the JB Weld sets as it's quite cold here at the moment and it's taking a while.

Hopefully I can get a few pieces on each night this week so come Friday it can be towed to Tranzac and I'll have the frame work ready to weld up and lay mesh and fibreglass over on my holiday.

 

[john82q]

Pete,

- J B weld takes an age to set, like 12 hrs or so, and fully cured in 24...also I'm thinking JB weld on the joints will make whats a tricky job with a stick welder even harder.

- maybe with the front gaurd you could fit a real fork brace, http://www.motorcycle-parts.com.au/Fork_Braces.htm
And use the stock gaurd as a mould for a fibre glass replica which is modfied to fit over the fork brace, rather than under. (if that makes sense) the brace could used as the mount too...you only need raise it a inch or so to create the look.

- the black/grey looks cool to me, thought about two tone blue?


John

 

[Guest]

Pete,

- J B weld takes an age to set, like 12 hrs or so, and fully cured in 24...also I'm thinking JB weld on the joints will make whats a tricky job with a stick welder even harder.

- maybe with the front gaurd you could fit a real fork brace, http://www.motorcycle-parts.com.au/Fork_Braces.htm
And use the stock gaurd as a mould for a fibre glass replica which is modfied to fit over the fork brace, rather than under. (if that makes sense) the brace could used as the mount too...you only need raise it a inch or so to create the look.

- the black/grey looks cool to me, thought about two tone blue?


John

Yeah I guess we'll see on the curing time with the JB Weld. I'm only sticking a little bit on, just enough to hold it until I can get to weld it properly, so hopefully it won't interfere. If I don't get it done before Friday morning, then I won't be getting to any fibreglassing on my week off, so I gotta take a bit of a gamble that this will work ok.

Good point on the brace, although $150 could be a bit rich... Maybe if I can locate a used one somewhere... but definitely worth a look into!

I just did three other quick ones up, none of these are two tone blue though:

 

[Flyboy]

Pete, why not just fabricate two rectangular plates out of 3-4mm steel plate, about 60mm in length, drill two holes at the bottom to fasten onto the shocks at the existing mud gaurd mounts and two holes at the top to bolt the mud guard to, maybe 40mm between hole centers, from top to bottom, should lift the mudguard nicely without compromising the handling or having to butcher the mud guard.
Just a thought.
I like the red by the way.

 

[Guest]

Pete, why not just fabricate two rectangular plates out of 3-4mm steel plate, about 60mm in length, drill two holes at the bottom to fasten onto the shocks at the existing mud gaurd mounts and two holes at the top to bolt the mud guard to, maybe 40mm between hole centers, from top to bottom, should lift the mudguard nicely without compromising the handling or having to butcher the mud guard.
Just a thought.
I like the red by the way.

Just had a closer look at some of my pic's, and I think I have more vertical clearance than I thought, so this may indeed be doable.

I thought the fork lowers flared out for the seals just above where the guard mounts, but I think I have an inch or so of clearance there, so I might be in business with that

I imagine given the existing metal there is around 1 to 2mm, that going 3 - 4mm will give it enough strength as well.

If I get back down there tonight to keep going with the duck tail frame work, I'll try putting it back in and lifting it a tad to see how it goes.

Alternatively, there's a guy on here selling a 450 fork brace, but says he will only ship to the USA. I've asked if he'll consider international, guess I'll just see what he says... none on eBay currently, but depending on postage it may be more economical to do the $150 locally here if I go down that path...

For me I'm still leaning towards the black/grey, but I'm starting to like the blue...

 

[Flyboy]

There is nothing wrong with he black, it just would not be my choice, not many black scramblers around, I was just thinking that if you are going to go ahead and fit the rubber knee guards on the tank, they would accent or "pop" as the yanks say against a contrasting colour, I just think that a unique and unusual feature like that would be lost in black on black, I know there is a silver border, but I think it will just look like silver striping.
I am sure whatever you decide, it will work well and be an awesome package once it is complete.
Can't wait to see the duck tail, hope you get to lay down the glass on your holiday as planned.

 

[Guest]

That's cool, I know what you mean. From a painting perspective, I would imagine black would cover imperfections a little better and this will be my first effort... still, I like blue generally speaking...

Just quickly did this before logging off, raised the front gaurd about an inch:



Will look closer...

 

[SVSooke]

That's cool, I know what you mean. From a painting perspective, I would imagine black would cover imperfections a little better and this will be my first effort... still, I like blue generally speaking...

Just quickly did this before logging off, raised the front gaurd about an inch:



Will look closer...

Black will not hide imperfections,it will hilight them.Unless you are going matt or satin.

 

[Flaming Chainsaws]

Aha! You found the P clamps. Since the P clamps have a rubber molding on them, I would think that they would not be able to ground to the frame which means the electronics won't work. So you will need to make a ground point for each of the electronics on the plate. Or am I completely wrong?

Progress is looking good, Pete.

 

[cowboyup3371]

You can take the rubber off very easily.

 

[Flaming Chainsaws]

You can take the rubber off very easily.

Yeah, I know but I would rather keep the rubber on to keep the vibrations at a minimum. This is just my thoughts .

 

[davidduarte]

Aha! You found the P clamps. Since the P clamps have a rubber molding on them, I would think that they would not be able to ground to the frame which means the electronics won't work. So you will need to make a ground point for each of the electronics on the plate. Or am I completely wrong?

Progress is looking good, Pete.

it depends. Certain things, the horn comes to mind, have positive and negative leads, rather than just a positive and ground.

 

[Guest]

Black will not hide imperfections,it will hilight them.Unless you are going matt or satin.

Thanks for the tip Greg, good to know

And no, I ain't goin' matte or satin, all shiny gloss for the tank and stuff

Aha! You found the P clamps. Since the P clamps have a rubber molding on them, I would think that they would not be able to ground to the frame which means the electronics won't work. So you will need to make a ground point for each of the electronics on the plate. Or am I completely wrong?

Progress is looking good, Pete.

I did indeed! Found 'em exactly where Hillsy said I would at the auto shop down the road, always manage to get good success down there

I've already sorted a good ground and there's 0.02 ohms between the frame and the electrics tray as measured by my multimeter which is pretty good. Almost everything can share the same ground point this way too and I should be able to run a battery negative lead to here as well as to the frame.



Cheers FC!

You can take the rubber off very easily.

Nah, one of the reasons I want the P clamps is because the rubber will make it look a little tidier than the hose clamps and exposed metal, and given the frame's painted with POR 15 Blackcote, it's not gonna conduct very well anyways.

Yeah, I know but I would rather keep the rubber on to keep the vibrations at a minimum. This is just my thoughts .

Not sure if it will help the vibes or not, but it might, just never know

it depends. Certain things, the horn comes to mind, have positive and negative leads, rather than just a positive and ground.

Yep, very true!

 

[Guest]

So, first off, called Tranzac and the towing guy today to confirm my bike's booked in successfully to get towed down on Friday... all set :dancing:

Then, got onto the local POR 15 retailer here and ordered the tank repair kit which my house mate kindly picked up for me seeing as it's literally about a 5 minute walk from his work.



I was planning on getting some aquarium rocks to rattle around in the tank to get the flaky rust off, but it dawned on me while I was looking the other day that we have river rock and gravel down both sides of our house... sheeesh... so I didn't buy any thankfully, I'll just use some of what I own already instead

Then tonight I ripped the electrical tape off and the first three rods held up well, although I appear to have gotten quite carried away with the JB Weld on one spot which could be interesting when welding later... I can always grind it back I suppose:



Then I got the rest of the key pieces on. If I don't get to do any more than these pieces before the bike goes on Friday, then I've at least got enough key pieces to get the shape right for welding and probably even to get the mesh started.



I haven't actually JB Welded the front of the side ones there, they're just taped to the other one as that really will make it hard to weld, instead I only JB Welded a little on the rear of those rods.

I also noticed I managed to leave the two side rods about half to three quarters of an inch too long, but that will be easy fixed with a cut off wheel on the dremel later on.

 

[Guest]

And then I took a closer look at the clearance I have with the front guard to see if it can be raised and, if so, how much by.

This is where it sits now:



As you can see, very low to the tyre and definitely road oriented as Flyboy pointed out.

I worked out I have enough clearance to lift it up one Pepsi Max can diameter:



So the only real problem now is to work out how I can raise it 65mm (Pepsi Max can diameter) and not compromise the ability of the built in fork brace.

This is the built in fork brace:



And the outside where it mounts at the moment curves in to give clearance for the curvature of the fork leg:



Not an urgent decision right now on how to do it, just need to get it sorted before I paint.

Using 3mm or so thick steel plate is probably the safest way to go I would think. The bracing material in there now is somewhere around 1.5 - 2mm thick by the looks.

Of course there's still the proper fork brace route, but that means I also need to find a different front guard to sit on top of it as well, and come to think of it, I'm not sure if a fork brace will let me retain the fork gaiters... and I gotta keep them!

 

[Redneck]

Hey Pete Look at me!

 

[Redneck]

Guess what I am....

 

[Redneck]

I am your 1000 poster...:clap: wooo hoo Okay its the little things in life that entertain me.