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another coil relay gone bad prematurely

  • Thread starter Thread starter don_gibb6512
  • Start date Start date
D

don_gibb6512

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This is what I just installed: http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=330-070

Mounted it under the tank, on the frame with a zip tie, nice and tight. No apparent vibration but also no ventilation. It seems a bit warm from the heat off the top of the engine but nothing out of the ordinary. I don't have 200 miles on this relay. What gives? Just bad luck? I'm going insulate it from the frame with a piece of rubber the next time but would it help if I mounted it where it could get air? I have one mounted on the front of the bike for the horns and it's over 3 years old and still going strong.

:-k
 
i dunno, personally, i've mounted mine at the battery box. the only failure i've had was the fuse popped when i accidentally grounded out a connector :P
 
I went to the homie G section at Auto Zone ( neon lights ) and found a no name China 40 amp relay there.

I've put over a 1000 miles on it so far and all seems well. I did my dad's bike the same way and his seems fine, both are mounted by the fuse box.
 
Mine is by the battery box. Cheapy relay. OK so far at 2200 miles but I do carry a spare just in case. :)
 
I mounted my Parts Express relay on the Electrical Panel, I guess I better buy a Spare

EPanel.jpg
 
I've often wondered why we don't use a thyristor here instead of the relay. No moving parts to worry about being shaken loose and quite cheap. It would be quite a simple job to mount it to the frame and use some thermal compound or a pad to improve heat dissipation.

Which makes me think that it seems strange that no one here has tried it!
 
it's my understanding that they opperate on high voltage AC applications. not sure it would work with low voltage dc.

for that matter, you could just get a solid state relay for about as cheap as you can buy the normal relay for.
 
seuadr said:
it's my understanding that they opperate on high voltage AC applications. not sure it would work with low voltage dc.

for that matter, you could just get a solid state relay for about as cheap as you can buy the normal relay for.
Click to expand...

It's been a long time since I meddled with electronics at component level but I was pretty sure a thyristor was effectively a switched diode and would operate on DC. I'm also pretty sure you can get them to work at lower voltages as well

But thinking about it you wouldn't really need a SSR you could quite easily knock up a MOSFET (or whatever modern equivalent you can think of) as a simple trigger device with a couple of resistors and you'd have a quite robust solution that would be vibration proof to a greater extent than a relay
 
fair enough, but i think it's heat, not vibration that is killing these relays, i haven't had any trouble at all with mine, and it was a cheapie. but i have mine near the battery box. most of these i've seen failing are near the motor.
 
seuadr said:
fair enough, but i think it's heat, not vibration that is killing these relays, i haven't had any trouble at all with mine, and it was a cheapie. but i have mine near the battery box. most of these i've seen failing are near the motor.
Click to expand...

I think I agree. I'm going to dissect the one that went bad to see if I can find out what happened. I'm feeling less than confident on creating a single point of failure like this in the ignition circuit at this point.
 
The three of mine that failed were by the battery box. I tore apart all 3 and on all 3 the tiny wire connecting the coil to the terminal had broken. Vibration killed them. So I spent $100 on a new ignition switch and don't worry about it anymore. And BTW for most models (but not mine) there are cheaper aftermarket ignition switches. I think ~ $30. Might be worth a shot.
 
Last edited:
Very good.. except I lose a volt through ignition, another through the kill switch & a third one through the loom itself! Not practical to replace that lot!

I'll try to post a pic of my install at some stage. If you use a relay socket when you fit it then it is really easy to switch them out... carry a spare as I do.

Dan :)
 
don_gibb6512 said:
I think I agree. I'm going to dissect the one that went bad to see if I can find out what happened. I'm feeling less than confident on creating a single point of failure like this in the ignition circuit at this point.
Click to expand...
that's why i didn't cut any wires to install mine. if i have any failure of the relay and i don't have a replacement, i can simply revert the wiring to stock :)
 
Man, all the wiring done here looks so good. Mine looks like crap with a zip tie holding it to the bolt hole where the airbox used to be bolted. New wires for the stator and R/R and now the relay. Looks like some hack got a hold of my bike. It all works great though ;)
 
Another thing to consider with the cheap relays especially from Bosch is that they are sensitive to humidity!, in my experience with Porsches these relays would go bad all the time because the humid air inside the car would condense at night, since the ventilation system on these cars was never good and this moisture created shorts which fried the plastic parts inside them.

Since these relays are not water proof they are definetly not going to last too long a motorcycle unless shielded from the elements somehow.

Hope this helps.
 
seuadr said:
that's why i didn't cut any wires to install mine. if i have any failure of the relay and i don't have a replacement, i can simply revert the wiring to stock :)
Click to expand...

You and me both brother; always leave yourself a way out!

Worst case I have to lift the tank back a bit and plug in the stock wires and away I go. I'm a big believer in a fail-safe engineering.
 
p_s said:
The three of mine that failed were by the battery box. I tore apart all 3 and on all 3 had the tiny wire connecting the coil the terminal had broken. Vibration killed them. So I spent $100 on a new ignition switch and don't worry about it anymore. And BTW for most models (but not mine) there are cheaper aftermarket ignition switches. I think ~ $30. Might be worth a shot.
Click to expand...

I used one of the screws from the fuse box mounts to mount mine.

Mine is a cheapo 40amp Pilot brand from the Zone.
 
Big N daft said:
It's been a long time since I meddled with electronics at component level but I was pretty sure a thyristor was effectively a switched diode and would operate on DC. I'm also pretty sure you can get them to work at lower voltages as well

But thinking about it you wouldn't really need a SSR you could quite easily knock up a MOSFET (or whatever modern equivalent you can think of) as a simple trigger device with a couple of resistors and you'd have a quite robust solution that would be vibration proof to a greater extent than a relay
Click to expand...


The thyristor wouldn't ever turn off.

What you would want is a mosfet (or bjt if you are willing to live with a 0.2 volt loss), but since they invert, you would want to use 2 ... 1 as a driver, and then a 2nd one to do the switching.

when you are done, you have essentially built a SSR ...:)
 
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